The Ethics of Full Disclosure on ScubaBoard

[lionfish-eater]

here is an example I just stumbled upon:

Found an old screwdriver, decided to put the Craftsman hand tool warranty to the test.

 

[drrich2]

In most cases, it is just a strong suspicion.

Another wrinkle is some people heavily into scuba who have a strong favorite brand may come to acquire a financial relationship with it as a result. Dive shop owner or staff, maybe? Such a person might see himself as endorsing for honorable reasons despite a conflict of interest.

Put another way, if a poster works for a LDS in any capacity, and that LDS sells anything the poster talks up on the forum (e.g.: regulator brand, fins, dive computer), should that poster post a disclaimer in every post promoting the product?

Or is this just about people giving willfully manipulative reviews for profit motive?

Richard.

 

[Damselfish]

here is an example I just stumbled upon:

Found an old screwdriver, decided to put the Craftsman hand tool warranty to the test.

not sure how that is an example?

 

[lionfish-eater]

not sure how that is an example?

It just looks like a staged ad to me.
If you found an old screwdriver would you think to photograph it before you pulled it out of the ground?
It may be legit, but the fact that I saw it as being a shill and you saw it as being legit shows that it is difficult to sort fact from fiction.
I have a friend whose job it is to write favorable opinions online about the client's products. It's like a new age customer service rep. Not only posting, but engaging with others to promote the products online.

She has multiple accounts and will sometimes post a question and then answer it. It is mostly benign, like " can anyone recommend a good spot remover?" " Yes, I had great success with xyz brand".
Many trip advisor posts read like they were written by the owner or marketer.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Another wrinkle is some people heavily into scuba who have a strong favorite brand may come to acquire a financial relationship with it as a result. Dive shop owner or staff, maybe? Such a person might see himself as endorsing for honorable reasons despite a conflict of interest.

Put another way, if a poster works for a LDS in any capacity, and that LDS sells anything the poster talks up on the forum (e.g.: regulator brand, fins, dive computer), should that poster post a disclaimer in every post promoting the product?

Or is this just about people giving willfully manipulative reviews for profit motive?

Richard.

I think that's one of the balancing act as an instructor that many of us have to walk. There are brands that we genuinely love, but the shops we work for may not sell them.

 

[redacted]

I think that's one of the balancing act as an instructor that many of us have to walk. There are brands that we genuinely love, but the shops we work for may not sell them.

So, what do you do when your pimp does not approve?

 

[Damselfish]

It just looks like a staged ad to me.
If you found an old screwdriver would you think to photograph it before you pulled it out of the ground?
It may be legit, but the fact that I saw it as being a shill and you saw it as being legit shows that it is difficult to sort fact from fiction.

No, but if I pulled it out then got the idea to do this, I might have just stuck it back in the ground to take a picture.

I have no idea if it's an 'ad' or not. I tend to be skeptical of everything, but less so of this since I know Sears actually does this.

 

[lionfish-eater]

I have no idea if it's an 'ad' or not. I tend to be skeptical of everything, but less so of this since I know Sears actually does this.

That is the point, not to be deceptive, but to reach customers in a new way.

This may be legit, but from the stuff I see from my friends in marketing, this is the new face of advertising.

 

[sunnyboy]

I think one point has been missed. Some folks have nothing to gain or lose from brands, but if you have an incredibly bad experience with a brand item (or their cust. service), , then you will naturally tend to loudly warn anyone contemplating the brand,

Years ago we had a Dodge Neon that went through 3 head gaskets (one on warranty) and one set of engine oil seals. The last time I complained to the regional service director and was told (and I quote exactly): "Well, if you were stupid enough to buy a Neon I have no sympathy for you". I've never bought Chrysler stuff again and used to tell everyone considering a new auto my story.

I gained NOTHING (except some satisfaction) from not buying Chrysler or from telling the story. I had zero involvement with any auto dealer - I was simply a very pissed off customer,

So if I buy some bit of pricey scuba gear and it craps out too soon and the company won't stand behind it, then I *will* call them out.

In the reverse vein, if a product exceeds all expectations and/or the company is solidly behind the product no matter what (like Shearwater!!!) then I will also loudly sing their praises in these forums. I met Lynn & Bruce on a dive once, but only as fellow divers. I've never had any relationship with Shearwater except to own one (bought used from another diver). But I love that company for it's products and the way it treats customers.

SO - not every "hater" or "lover" should be suspect.

I'd recommend that if you start to get those warning twinges about someones "over the top" post, just ask them directly to say why they say that.

 

[RainPilot]

Sometimes it is hard to tell where the line is.

For example, @Deep Six gear. I am a big fan of the company and what they are doing, and I try to advocate support for them wherever I can. Because of their business model, if a customer uses my reference code, they get a discount on purchases. I also get a commission on EVERY purchase they make after that, as the referring instructor.

Now, I had to decide whether to put my referral link in my signature line or paste it into posts when referring people to the site. I chose not to for the reasons John has described up top. I also loaned a set to a diver here that has nothing to do with them and was skeptical. I encouraged him to write up a honest review of the regs which he did.

I know that I would refer them anyway, I wouldn't have an account if I didn't, but since no-one is in my head there is always the possibility of misinterpretation. By removing that link, I now have nothing to gain from a referral so hopefully that will un-muddy the waters.

That being said, is it possible that at some future date I might get an extra coffee mug or T-shirt from Chris in an order as a thank you for my support? Maybe.

Would that be wrong? I don't think so but I can definitely see where some may perceive that as coloring my views.

I believe that an upfront disclosure is valuable, I also don't believe that it is our job as mods to go play detective to see whether someone is on the level. Obvious cases of misrepresentation, sure, but trying to find out if Bob and Fred have a financial arrangement is way outside my pay-grade as a mod.