The future of cave diving safety

[tbone1004]

@chrisch I have to agree with @PfcAJ . With a line, I can tell where I am in the water. Too high, too low, too far left, too far right. Etc. That is a lot easier than trying to follow a computer. More importantly, I doubt you could build one that is small enough to use, and on top of that, zero vis conditions are excruciatingly disorienting for a lot of people, myself included. I shut my eyes, and open them back up every 5 kick cycles to see if it has improved.

as far as people shortcutting, a computer that is capable of doing this would be several thousands of dollars. You have to recoup the cost of building the mapper itself, then mapping, then setting up sensors inside or above the cave, and all of that has to be recouped in the selling price of the computer. Will never get a sound business plan with the cost of doing that which is why the caves haven't been mapped before. More importantly, the cost of a full cave diving gear, plus full cave training, is going to be less than what this computer would cost. Sure it would be a shortcut, but a horrifically expensive one.

Don't take this as us criticizing, the idea is good, it's just the practicality isn't there

 

[The Chairman]

I cave dive because I want to, not because I have to. I don't need or want a "Waze for Caves". I don't want to be distracted from the cave itself because that's why I'm there. Next we'll be reading @kensuf tweeting @Capt Jim Wyatt that there's diver jam at the Bat cave. Keep it simple. Keep it fun.

 

[Doppler]

In almost every case, a diver "lost" in a cave shouldn't have been in there in the first place. There's line, line / navigational protocols, and knowledge to prevent people getting lost. Navigational issues arise from people doing **** they have no training, experience, kit, or business doing.

 

[KevinNM]

Try diving with Derek.

With or without a charged primary light?

 

[Steve_C]

Cave divers go through some tight places. The ground piercing radar output I have seen would show a cave but can it show whether a narrow opening is too narrow or just enough? Does it have that type of resolution? I don't know and am curious. Separate issue from is it desirable.

 

[KevinNM]

Radar doesn't work underwater. Water strongly absorbs microwaves. Lidar is capable of seeing small gaps, but one of the manufactures was touting how they managed to get their $75k system down to a mere $8.5k. And that is before waterproofing to 150 meters. So we'll see when people sell a few million a year for cars.

 

[karstdvr]

@chrisch . With a line, I can tell where I am in the water. Too high, too low, too far left, too far right. Etc.

Line is great, and that is one of our "golden rules" of cave diving,but I agree with Sheck when he said line doesn't guarantee an exit. In a lights out/silt out situation and you are touching the line, the assumption is that you have a continuous means to the surface,which assuming if the rules of cave diving were followed,then you do. But, as Sheck inferred, learning of the cave with often progressive penetration is very important for that line to have the most benefit. For example, a team in a silt out,air sharing situation, they will move slowly, so knowing navigation issues,means a shorter delay,with time equaling air. I remember pushing a restriction in a very small, silty cave. Coming back,even on the line I struggled to negotiate that restriction, and it required complete tank removal. After that episode I learned to study a restriction from both sides, and learn it before pushing another restriction ahead. Technology would be great to make navigation in less than optimal conditions easier,but I follow the Hogarthian philosophy of minimalism, and would be concerned of high tech failures, with my safety dependent on this.

 

[kensuf]

With or without a charged primary light?

It's always a guess, isn't it?