Bowmouth
Contributor
And take some things way too seriously....
Travelers beware
- Thread starter cdiver2
- Start date
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And take some things way too seriously....
This is a great scuba diving post again.
I'm no expert...but looks pretty dodgy to me. Looking at a couple of wallets, putting the second one down and then immediately picking it up and taking it elsewhere. Then a juggling act before leaving the shop.
From the letter the wallet was found abandoned in the bin by security staff from the shop. Plenty of dodgy things happen in Thailand. This one seems too creative to be a scam. It just would be too much to have some kind of deal between the security staff and the crooked translator fella.
My guess is that they could well have nicked it and then once caught they were in real trouble because they had to deal with the "peculiarities" of the Thai system. No doubt they had a hard time, possibly ending up in some kind of bidding war when people started losing face all over the place.
Again, all speculation on all our parts cos we werent there.
Unfortunately though, like LK says, continues fortify the bad press coming out of Thailand and perhaps contribute to the decline in tourism to this country.
I'm no expert...but looks pretty dodgy to me. Looking at a couple of wallets, putting the second one down and then immediately picking it up and taking it elsewhere. Then a juggling act before leaving the shop.
From the letter the wallet was found abandoned in the bin by security staff from the shop. Plenty of dodgy things happen in Thailand. This one seems too creative to be a scam. It just would be too much to have some kind of deal between the security staff and the crooked translator fella.
My guess is that they could well have nicked it and then once caught they were in real trouble because they had to deal with the "peculiarities" of the Thai system. No doubt they had a hard time, possibly ending up in some kind of bidding war when people started losing face all over the place.
Again, all speculation on all our parts cos we werent there.
Unfortunately though, like LK says, continues fortify the bad press coming out of Thailand and perhaps contribute to the decline in tourism to this country.
OP
cdiver2
Contributor
First the written portion on your link was to small to read and when I enlarged the page it became to fuzzy to read. So I asked you to direct me to where I could see it.
A reasonable request I think.
I tried to discuss the subject rationally and without prejudice but if you want to get down in the gutter I will gladly join you.
But then you have to resort to personal insults to defend your position, childish, immature at best but what else would you expect from people with a $ interest in the topic.
Would I go or advise anyone to go to Thailand not on your life when they can circumnavigate the normal Judaical system and demand money in lieu of the normal prison sentence. Now that's scary.
They said the money was to avoid prison and pay Tony the interpreter (who makes a living at this). What was wrong with letting them contact the Embassy? this is a normal procedure in most civilized country's.
This smells of a big time scam
A reasonable request I think.
I tried to discuss the subject rationally and without prejudice but if you want to get down in the gutter I will gladly join you.
But then you have to resort to personal insults to defend your position, childish, immature at best but what else would you expect from people with a $ interest in the topic.
Would I go or advise anyone to go to Thailand not on your life when they can circumnavigate the normal Judaical system and demand money in lieu of the normal prison sentence. Now that's scary.
They said the money was to avoid prison and pay Tony the interpreter (who makes a living at this). What was wrong with letting them contact the Embassy? this is a normal procedure in most civilized country's.
This smells of a big time scam
I do know also this is not a 'diving matter', just a question
Suppose at supermarket a tape records some people take some stuff but later they would have change idea before they went to cashier and they leave somewhere else this stuff... [in this zone no cameras] so if it's not in the bag must it be stolen?
how many times happen to see stuff not at their place, also frozen stuff, at supermarket? should be they arrested? should be they thieves?
last but not least.. a cashier looks at tape all the time people goes out of DutyFree? unbelievable!! it must be something with security staff... I did already know about those two people at BKK before post#1, [unfortunately] nothing new as I already read this before.
Just before to write here I just simply googled bkk duty free scam !
I'll be soon to Thai, I've already told my wife about Duty Free at BKK (it would be the first time ever she will not go to pay a visit at one DutyFreeShop :hope
, I hope to enjoy like many friends of mine did it before and go back there again. Anyway I may accept a tailor/jewlery/tuktuk scam, let's say some people found something for living [beside I do not agree], what I do not accept is to be arrested without a reason or being attacked.... maybe awaking at hospital. this not in Thai only, everywhere. à bientôt
Suppose at supermarket a tape records some people take some stuff but later they would have change idea before they went to cashier and they leave somewhere else this stuff... [in this zone no cameras] so if it's not in the bag must it be stolen?
how many times happen to see stuff not at their place, also frozen stuff, at supermarket? should be they arrested? should be they thieves?
last but not least.. a cashier looks at tape all the time people goes out of DutyFree? unbelievable!! it must be something with security staff... I did already know about those two people at BKK before post#1, [unfortunately] nothing new as I already read this before.
Just before to write here I just simply googled bkk duty free scam !
I'll be soon to Thai, I've already told my wife about Duty Free at BKK (it would be the first time ever she will not go to pay a visit at one DutyFreeShop :hope
, I hope to enjoy like many friends of mine did it before and go back there again. Anyway I may accept a tailor/jewlery/tuktuk scam, let's say some people found something for living [beside I do not agree], what I do not accept is to be arrested without a reason or being attacked.... maybe awaking at hospital. this not in Thai only, everywhere. à bientôtBowmouth
Contributor
OP
cdiver2
Contributor
Bowmouth
Contributor
I really do not know all the why's and how's.
What I do know is that the "scam" was just now on the Thai TV News and the footage from the security camera's clearly show the couple shoplifting. Like it or not but those two Brits were stealing.
They were caught and got in big trouble. I can imagine they wanted to avoid prosecution and possible jail-time and bought their way out.
They should count themselves lucky to have gotten away without doing any time in prison here in Thailand. Prisons here are not as comfy as in Europe.
I think this incident will have taught them an important lesson. The eighth commandment, "Thou shall not steal,"
OP
cdiver2
Contributor
I did go back and read it all but still could not read the letter. However some one posted that the wallet had been found LATER in a trash bin...how convenient.
I also read the BBC report again and there are a few points I would like to bring up.
....................................................................................................................
I find it hard to believe that a large number of people travel half way round the world to shoplift small items in the duty free.
....................................................................................................................
That is what happened to Stephen Ingram and Xi Lin, two IT experts from Cambridge, as they were about to board their flight to London on the night of 25 April this year.
They had been browsing in the duty free shop at the airport, and were later approached by security guards, who twice asked to search their bags.
Mr Ingram and Ms Xi were told they had to pay £7,500
They were told a wallet had gone missing, and that Ms Lin had been seen on a security camera taking it out of the shop.
The company that owns the duty free shop, King Power, has since put the CCTV video on its website, which does appear to show her putting something in her bag. However the security guards found no wallet on either of them.
Despite that, they were both taken from the departure gate, back through immigration, and held in an airport police office. That is when their ordeal started to become frightening.
Interpreter
"We were questioned in separate rooms," Mr Ingram said. "We felt really intimidated. They went through our bags and demanded that we tell them where the wallet was."
The two were then put in what Mr Ingram describes as a "hot, humid, smelly cell with graffiti and blood on the walls".
Mr Ingram managed to phone a Foreign Office helpline he found in a travel guide, and was told someone in the Bangkok embassy would try to help them.
The next morning the two were given an interpreter, a Sri Lankan national called
They were taken by Tony to meet the local police commander - but, says Mr Ingram,
Mr Ingram and Ms Xi were taken to meet the local police commander
They were told the charge was very serious. If they did not pay, they would be transferred to the infamous Bangkok Hilton prison, and would have to wait two months for their case to be processed.
Mr Ingram says they wanted £7,500 ($12,250) - for that the police would try to get him back to the UK in time for his mother's funeral on 28 April.
But he could not arrange to get that much money transferred in time.
'Zig-zag' scheme
If you are under arrest what is a civilian doing escorting prisoners
....................................................................................................................
and told Ms Lin to withdraw as much as she could from her own account - £600 - and Mr Ingram then withdrew the equivalent of £3,400 from his account.
This was apparently handed over to the police as "bail", and they were both made to sign a number of papers.
Later they were allowed to move to a squalid hotel within the airport perimeter, but their passports were held and
"I will be watching you," Tony told them, adding that they would have to stay there until the £7,500 was
On the Monday they managed to sneak out and get a taxi to Bangkok, and met an official at the British Embassy.
She gave the name of a Thai lawyer, and, says Mr Ingram, told them they were being subjected to a classic Thai scam called the "zig-zag".
Their lawyer urged them to expose Tony - but also warned them that if they fought the case it could take months, and they risked a long prison sentence.
After five days
Mr Ingram had missed his mother's funeral, but at least they were given a court document stating that there was insufficient evidence against them, and no charge.
"It was a harrowing, stressful experience," he said.
The couple say they now want to take legal action to recover their money.
'Typical' scam
The BBC has spoken to Tony and the regional police commander, Colonel Teeradej Phanuphan.
They both say Tony was merely helping the couple with translation, and raising bail to keep them out of prison.
Tony says about half the £7,500 was for bail, while the rest were "fees" for the bail, for his work, and for a lawyer he says he consulted on their behalf.
In theory, he says, they could try to get the bail portion refunded.
Colonel Teeradej says he will investigate any possible irregularities in their treatment. But he said any arrangement between the couple and Tony was a private affair, which did not involve the police.
The British Embassy has also warned passengers at Bangkok Airport to take care not to move items around in the duty free shopping area before paying for them, as this could result in arrest and imprisonment.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I also read the BBC report again and there are a few points I would like to bring up.
....................................................................................................................
I find it hard to believe that a large number of people travel half way round the world to shoplift small items in the duty free.
....................................................................................................................
That is what happened to Stephen Ingram and Xi Lin, two IT experts from Cambridge, as they were about to board their flight to London on the night of 25 April this year.
They had been browsing in the duty free shop at the airport, and were later approached by security guards, who twice asked to search their bags.
Mr Ingram and Ms Xi were told they had to pay £7,500
They were told a wallet had gone missing, and that Ms Lin had been seen on a security camera taking it out of the shop.
The company that owns the duty free shop, King Power, has since put the CCTV video on its website, which does appear to show her putting something in her bag. However the security guards found no wallet on either of them.
Despite that, they were both taken from the departure gate, back through immigration, and held in an airport police office. That is when their ordeal started to become frightening.
Interpreter
"We were questioned in separate rooms," Mr Ingram said. "We felt really intimidated. They went through our bags and demanded that we tell them where the wallet was."
The two were then put in what Mr Ingram describes as a "hot, humid, smelly cell with graffiti and blood on the walls".
Mr Ingram managed to phone a Foreign Office helpline he found in a travel guide, and was told someone in the Bangkok embassy would try to help them.
The next morning the two were given an interpreter, a Sri Lankan national called
They were taken by Tony to meet the local police commander - but, says Mr Ingram,
Mr Ingram and Ms Xi were taken to meet the local police commander
They were told the charge was very serious. If they did not pay, they would be transferred to the infamous Bangkok Hilton prison, and would have to wait two months for their case to be processed.
Mr Ingram says they wanted £7,500 ($12,250) - for that the police would try to get him back to the UK in time for his mother's funeral on 28 April.
But he could not arrange to get that much money transferred in time.
'Zig-zag' scheme
,
If you are under arrest what is a civilian doing escorting prisoners
....................................................................................................................
and told Ms Lin to withdraw as much as she could from her own account - £600 - and Mr Ingram then withdrew the equivalent of £3,400 from his account.
This was apparently handed over to the police as "bail", and they were both made to sign a number of papers.
Later they were allowed to move to a squalid hotel within the airport perimeter, but their passports were held and
:shocked2:
"I will be watching you," Tony told them, adding that they would have to stay there until the £7,500 was
.?
On the Monday they managed to sneak out and get a taxi to Bangkok, and met an official at the British Embassy.
She gave the name of a Thai lawyer, and, says Mr Ingram, told them they were being subjected to a classic Thai scam called the "zig-zag".
Their lawyer urged them to expose Tony - but also warned them that if they fought the case it could take months, and they risked a long prison sentence.
After five days
, and they were allowed to leave.
Mr Ingram had missed his mother's funeral, but at least they were given a court document stating that there was insufficient evidence against them, and no charge.
"It was a harrowing, stressful experience," he said.
The couple say they now want to take legal action to recover their money.
'Typical' scam
The BBC has spoken to Tony and the regional police commander, Colonel Teeradej Phanuphan.
They both say Tony was merely helping the couple with translation, and raising bail to keep them out of prison.
Tony says about half the £7,500 was for bail, while the rest were "fees" for the bail, for his work, and for a lawyer he says he consulted on their behalf.
In theory, he says, they could try to get the bail portion refunded.
Colonel Teeradej says he will investigate any possible irregularities in their treatment. But he said any arrangement between the couple and Tony was a private affair, which did not involve the police.
The Danish Embassy says one of its nationals was recently subjected to a very similar scam, and earlier this month an Irish scientist managed to flee Thailand with her husband and one year-old son after being arrested at the airport and accused of stealing an eyeliner worth around £17.
with the police. He says sometimes he does it for no charge.
The British Embassy has also warned passengers at Bangkok Airport to take care not to move items around in the duty free shopping area before paying for them, as this could result in arrest and imprisonment.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ScubaSteve
Wow.....what a DB
All I can say, is that I personally do not believe either side fully.
I think that at this time, this couple has been lambasted publically around the world and they are trying to dig themselves out of the hole that they put themselves in when they stole a $20 wallet....(I am guessing at the value...sorry if I missed it).
As for the Thai nationals (Police etc.)....they are likely positioning to make temselves look squeaky clean. I am sure if something underhanded did go down, they are all singing the same song right now to avoid the truth from getting out.
Bottom line is, once this sort of situation arises, it is very difficult to get to the bottom (or the truth). In these cases there is always three versions.......The couples version, the Police's version and the Truth. We are not seeing the truth....just two versions of the story designed to make the telling party look better.
I will still spend my time in Bangkok and be thankful that I almost never buy duty free at an airport....way too much scuba and photography stuff to lug around already.
I think that at this time, this couple has been lambasted publically around the world and they are trying to dig themselves out of the hole that they put themselves in when they stole a $20 wallet....(I am guessing at the value...sorry if I missed it).
As for the Thai nationals (Police etc.)....they are likely positioning to make temselves look squeaky clean. I am sure if something underhanded did go down, they are all singing the same song right now to avoid the truth from getting out.
Bottom line is, once this sort of situation arises, it is very difficult to get to the bottom (or the truth). In these cases there is always three versions.......The couples version, the Police's version and the Truth. We are not seeing the truth....just two versions of the story designed to make the telling party look better.
I will still spend my time in Bangkok and be thankful that I almost never buy duty free at an airport....way too much scuba and photography stuff to lug around already.
OP
cdiver2
Contributor
As I see the footage. The first red ring nothing wrong, she picks something up looks at it and puts it back. When she walks around the display she puts something? down on the shelf picks something else up puts it back then picks up the object she placed on the shelf when she first came around. So my question is was that object hers and she put it down to look at something else.
Don't get me wrong I think if she did steal it she should not have been given the opportunity to buy her way out of jail. You did the crime do the time just like any citizen of the country
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