Underwater surveillance

[Ardeus]

Hi there,

I am trying to find a camera that enables me to do the following:




That's the idea, but with only 4 or 5 cameras, I guess it would be to expensive to use 8. They need to:

- Ideally have battery enough to film from dawn till dusk, or at least 5 hours. Because the cameras will be left by themselves, I won't need to waste battery on LCD's;

- Film small fish (1 - 5 cms) from a distance of 50-100 cms, at a depth of 15-20 meters;

- Without any artificial lighting.

I will need to get at least 4 of them.

I have been looking at cameras and I saw the Panasonic HC-X920, that can be fitted with a 3300mAh battery. The original battery is 1250mAh and it lasts over 2 hours without LCD on, so I guess that the result is a battery that will last close to 6 hours.

The problem is: a housing for this cameras can be quite expensive because they have lots of things I won't need. I just need to place the cameras on a rig, point them, make some adjustments and leave them there for as long as the battery lasts.

These animals are most active at dawn and at especially at dusk, so ideally I need a camera that accepts a battery that lasts that long and that have a decent low light sensitivity... at 20 meters depth without any extra lighting.

I will be filming them daily for 2 months.

Any suggestions?

 

[3D diver]

If you're willing to run some cables to the surface something like this might work:

GoPro Hero3 Underwater HDMI Video Out Housing by Eye Of Mine

They have several variants.

Lower resolution:

GSY7000 7" Color TFT Underwater Fish Finder Video Camera Monitor Standard Set w/ 15m Cable ? Black - Free Shipping - DealExtreme

 

[Ardeus]

Thanks for the links.

The GoPro Hero3 seems to have good quality, but I read that even with the extra battery, it doesn't last much.

The other one is very interesting, I hadn't heard about it, but I forgot to add that I need to film in 1080.

I need to record the video in all cameras and edit it, so they need to accept 64GB cards.

 

[diversteve]

Actually the GoPro's do record 1080 and even 4K at 15fps. I don't think any of the Action cams (GoPro, Countour, JVC etc.) will have the battery life you need unless you can power them externally. The GoPro Black at it's most powersaving is 1h:30m. 20M that may prove impossible for the GoPro solutions suggested above. Go Pro's are also fixed focus and don't do macro particularly well without external diopters.

One less expensive option for mounting camcorders is a less expensive "tube" housing. They're about 1/2 the cost of conventional housings - or less since they'r basically a tube with a flat port on one end. Aquatix, Atmo-seal (US), Birchley Products (England) and Reef Rider (Germany) all make one afaik. Aquatix and Atmo-seal have a start/stop optional control also - and retail under $500. Links are here: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/un...-housing-manufacturers-updated-02-2013-a.html

Canon also has some low-lux cameras for less than you're spending for the Panasonic. one is at 0.4 lux - if you can live with their "low-light mode". Usually that means they slow the shutter speed to 1/30th. I suspect the Panasonic does also. For you since the cameras are fixed in place, that may be less of an issue.

One of them - the Vixia HF R400 - Canon U.S.A. : Consumer & Home Office : VIXIA HF R400 is also $299 at Adorama - I believe they ship worldwide. Canon VIXIA HF R400 HD Camcorder 8155B004

If you can work with a more basic model with housing, look at one of their consumer models in their proprietary WP-V4 housing - less than $1K total combined - street prices. The camera itself can do .1 lux at 1/2 second (2FPS) intervals. They don't list the lux rating at faster settings. Canon U.S.A. : Consumer & Home Office : VIXIA HF M500 - $500 on Amazon.com currently.

Newly designed Canon HD CMOS Pro Image Sensor is a professional-level 1/3-inch native 1920 x 1080 image sensor which delivers outstanding video resolution, improved low-light performance*, and a wide dynamic range. *20% improved low-light performance compared to the Canon HD CMOS Pro Image Sensor used in Canon's 2011 VIXIA Camcorders.

It's a poly housing good to 130' with limited controls, on/off, zoom/tele. You can see but not access the touchscreen. It does take one larger sized battery but not the largest one they sell. They're all 1080P and use 64GB flash cards - my buddy shoots one. Canon U.S.A. : Consumer & Home Office : WP-V4 Waterproof Case

If Canon is going thru one of their frequent upgrade cycles you may not be able to find one except on Amazon or eBay. Check with B&H Photo or Abe's of Maine also. Someone posted that they had one in stock but not listed on their website recently. They list at $499 but I've seen them for $449.

There's also a previous WP-V3 that works with the Canon HF M300 also. Or the HF M400 if you can still find either of those. It's listed on the Canon site for $600.
Camcorder Waterproof Cases | Canon Online Store Compatibility for both models is also listed in case you can find a cheaper M52 or M50 in quantity - they all take the same 64GB SDXC card.

The housing is pretty model specific so the WP-V4 won't work with the newer HF R 400 afaik.

 

[Ardeus]

Thanks a lot! That really openned many possibilities. I'm in the process of reducing costs to make the project feasible and the links to the housings already helped a lot. I already own 2 panasonics but I will look into your other suggestions.

In a previous project I filmed with 4 panasonic cameras: 2 tm700 and 2 hs200. The quality difference was so great that I found it hard to use the footage from the older models.

I don't need wide angles, I will be filming mostly very small animals, so I guess the GoPro is out.

I'm also trying to loosen up the surveillance and film them less time everyday. Last time I did something along these lines, I had to edit over 1200 hours of footage and that's something I will never forget.

Battery life has a big impact on the whole budget, because with a short duration I would have to pay for more trips to the place where I'm filming just to go down there, get the cameras, exchange the batteries, and put the cameras back again.

 

[MichaelS.]

You can try contour hd cameras.

 

[3D diver]

Didn't Contour just go belly up?

Another idea would be to get some of the cheap GoPro copies from DX extreme and glue them, with a big battery, into a simple DIY acrylic tube housing. Put camera and battery in housing, glue shut, place at dive site & retrieve the previous batch.

 

[diversteve]

You can try contour hd cameras.

Besides the too short battery life:

The rechargeable lithium-ion battery provides 2-3 hours depending upon usage

I'm guessing the Contour has the same close focus problem as the GoPro's or the Sony Action Cam.

The Sony actually focuses down to a foot but the battery life is probably equally poor. Plus it's a 6 lux camera. Not the best for filming in the dark with no lights. Based on them recently discontinuing a model - (1 of 2 they sold) and the price break I'm wondering if the Sony is next after Contour.

Also for the OP's purposes, with no LED review on-site, he'd be hoping they were aimed right each time. Given that there's probably some component of tracking the animals over time, registration of the cameras is probably important.

Didn't Contour just go belly up?

Did it? Website is still up. That may explain why there's a deal on them at REI though.

---------- Post added August 30th, 2013 at 09:48 PM ----------

In a previous project I filmed with 4 panasonic cameras: 2 tm700 and 2 hs200. The quality difference was so great that I found it hard to use the footage from the older models.

That's surprising since both are 3CMOS 1920x1080 HD models. I would've thought the video performance would be indistinguishable. The Canon's I suggested are probably going to be worse in quality as they're more low end consumer grade models.

 

[OkByMe]

camera battery life can be extended by putting another battery in paralell with the camera battery. Since you are going to use these for a specific fixed purpose, mobility and size should not be an issue. get a housing large enough to contain both and open the camera body to make the wiring changes. You could make your own (have a machine shop do it) by using clear acrylic and PVC pipe. The acrylic lens can be fiitted permenently into the tube and an o-ring boss with threaded cap on the other end.

I made something like this to enclose an infrared light to carry with me on night dives.

 

[Ardeus]

Thanks a lot for the help.

Steve: The hs200 images were far more noisier and with lower contrast than the tm700. I left the cameras filming all day only with natural light, so I had most controls on the cameras on automatic. The difference in low light performance was huge.

OkByMe: The idea of creating a custom housing and putting an extra battery in there is great. If I manage to postpone the beginning of the shooting, I will give it a try, it would save lots of dives just to go there and change the batteries.

The thing is I have just received the information that the visibility in the area where these fish are is usually 3 - 6 meters. What kind of light do I get 20 meters underwater in this conditions without any extra light? No matter how good the camera is, even taking into account that the cameras will be very close to the fish, the images will be terrible.

These fish are extremely territorial and now the only idea on the table is to move a few of them to shallow waters 1 km away, keep them protected from predators by a net for a few days while they establish themselves and film them there. I feel it's cheating a bit though. And I'm not sure they will be able to survive there.