What to do when an instructor is out of line?

Please register or login

Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

Benefits of registering include

  • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
  • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
  • You can make this box go away

Joining is quick and easy. Log in or Register now!

Sounds to me that the instructor was not paying attention if you were trying to signal him.
so what were you supposed to do, blow out your ears for the sakeof staying with your inattentive buddy?
sounds to me that the Instructor is the F#@%*& Idiot and should be reported to PADI without further delay.
no need for the other side of the story from what I am hearing, The instructor is just plain wrong for not paying more attention to the student and for cussing the student out.
 
A shop that really didn't do it is going to answer:
No, we wouldn't tolerate that for a second and we'd fire any instructor who yelled at a student. Period.

So you DO want the shop to fire the instructor over your version of the incident...?

I'm having a hard time figuring out what it is you actually want. Is it:

1. an explanation?
2. an apology?
3. a refund?
4. revenge?

You had an opportunity for an explanation if you'd asked the CD to set up a civilized meeting with the instructor to go over what went wrong after everybody had cooled down. You also had the opportunity to ask the CD to debrief the instructor and relay the info on his behalf. Instead, you chose to seek your debriefing from people who weren't present and who aren't in a position to confirm your belief that what you did was 100% correct. You also chose to file a QA report before attempting any sort of mediation. I'm not saying this was the wrong decision -- only you can make that call -- but it's unrealistic to expect the instructor to have anything to do with you after you file a QA report on him. Your relationship with this instructor is over.

If you were after an apology, you may have got one if you'd approached the instructor with a conciliatory note along the lines of "I'm sorry for whatever it was that upset you. I don't think I deserved that kind of reaction, but I'd like to move past it and learn from the experience." You are, after all, taking the high road. You may feel that you don't owe him any apology (nobody said you had to mean it), but if he's a decent person then he'd probably offer his own apology. Again, you blew your chances for this when you filed the QA report, so don't expect one.

You asked for a refund and they're prepared to give you one. What more do you want? It sounds like you were just trying to bait them so they'd go out of their way to keep you as a customer, and are disappointed that they didn't put up any protest. Maybe it's bad business, maybe they consider you high maintenance -- but it was you who brought it up, so you can't complain that they agreed to it. You've even told them that they've lost your trust. Get out and move on.

You keep saying the shop isn't taking this seriously enough, and even though they've actually heard both sides of the story from multiple sources, you're convinced that no matter what actions they've taken -- and again, you don't know what these are -- they're insufficient. You seem to have clear ideas of what you consider to be appropriate repercussions, even if some of them are far fetched (seriously...calling the cops? :rofl3:).

Now it's PADI's turn. While there are some questionable judgment calls based on your version of events, there don't appear to be any glaring standards violations that would terminate his membership, although that's PADI's call and not mine or anyone else's on this board. PADI QA's role is to correct problems rather than dispense justice, so you may be disappointed at the end of the QA inquiry when you don't receive a certificate saying "You were 100% right and the now-former instructor was 100% wrong". At that point will the thread then become "PADI doesn't take QA complaints seriously enough so I'm switching to NAUI"?


Diving is a small world.... word will get around without me being the source of it.
You've dropped enough clues that a proficient Googler will find the shop in less than 2 minutes. Those who want to launch their own personal boycott based on incomplete information are free to do so -- it's as American as the class action lawsuit.
 
Last edited:
So you DO want the shop to fire the instructor over your version of the incident...?
I pretty clearly spelled out my expectations of what should have happened.
I'm having a hard time figuring out what it is you actually want. Is it:
Try reading carefully.. it's really not any more complicated than you make it.
1- Apology (check)
2- Assurance that this not tolerated (missing)
3- Assurance that it won't happen again (missing)
4- Request that I give the shop another chance (missing)
You had an opportunity for an explanation if you'd asked the CD to set up a civilized meeting with the instructor to go over what went wrong after everybody had cooled down.
My bad, I've since learned that the individual I spoke to is the "Director of Training" which I confused with "Course Director". Individual I spoke to is a MSDT (like you) and has not yet completed the CD course/requirements.
If you were after an apology, you may have got one if you'd approached the instructor with a conciliatory note along the lines of "I'm sorry for whatever it was that upset you. I don't think I deserved that kind of reaction, but I'd like to move past it and learn from the experience."
Should I lay down and paint "welcome" across my chest too? Your comment suggests that you think the instructor deserves an apology from me? Look, I'm a diving student, not a mind reader. If an instructor doesn't like something it's not my place to pontificate about *if* they are upset. A reasonably competent adult with average communication skills and the task of evaluating and correcting someone's performance can reasonably be expected to bring up deficiencies for discussion. Holding all the "sins" in until you lose your cool is not quite the same thing and probably indicates the need for professional help.
You keep saying the shop isn't taking this seriously enough, and even though they've actually heard both sides of the story from multiple sources, you're convinced that no matter what actions they've taken -- and again, you don't know what these are -- they're insufficient. You seem to have clear ideas of what you consider to be appropriate repercussions, even if some of them are far fetched (seriously...calling the cops? :rofl3:).
Maybe calling the cops is a bit farfeteched... but you took the bait and ran pretty hard didn't you? You seemed to have focused on one part and ignored the other part of the statement... which was (and i'll put it in bold to help you) I SHOULD NOT HAVE YELLED AT THE INSTRUCTOR.
Now it's PADI's turn. While there are some questionable judgment calls based on your version of events, there don't appear to be any glaring standards violations that would terminate his membership, although that's PADI's call and not mine or anyone else's on this board.
I'm honestly not very concerned with what PADI does. Notifying PADI QA clears my conscience that I have exposed something that shouldn't have happened and provided the opportunity for remediation. It isn't up to me what happens. I wouldn't tolerate that behavior in my business, and it would probably result in the offender's termination. I don't run the LDS in question so they may act differently. I think someone who loses it as an instructor probably needs anger management and stress training... but it's not my call to make. You asked what I think and that's my opinion. You're entitled to your opinion which carries about as much weight as mine in this particular instance.

I've cured my relationship to the problem by firing the shop and the instructor. Yes, it's called firing when I tell you that you have violated my expectations and I won't be doing any business with you in the future as a result.

In the future I'll be more selective about the quality of my instructors and the committment of the shops I work with. I'm not really that worried about it. I've got a good base of training to make safe recreational dives. I'm not perfect, don't know everything, and will very likely learn something each time I go diving.
You've dropped enough clues that a proficient Googler will find the shop in less than 2 minutes.
Probably not. Sure you could narrow it down to a few shops, but a proficient googler won't get any closer than that. That is still sufficiently vague.
 
Last edited:
Update: This is pretty much settled.

I had a good conversation with the LDS Owner this afternoon. We're on the same page as far as most of it goes and there are a few things that need to be pro-rated and we're in agreement on how that should be done. They need a little more time to figure out a couple of the details, mostly driven by hectic schedules and deadlines that are coming to bear.

Final synopsis:
- I appreciate the feedback and suggestions from many on this forum.
- Keeping cool and not naming names has made it much easier to resolve things with the LDS.
- This is essentially resolved from my perspective, pending the finalization of some completion and refund details.


I don't expect to provide any more updates at this point.
 
Update: This is pretty much settled.

I had a good conversation with the LDS Owner this afternoon. We're on the same page as far as most of it goes and there are a few things that need to be pro-rated and we're in agreement on how that should be done. They need a little more time to figure out a couple of the details, mostly driven by hectic schedules and deadlines that are coming to bear.

Final synopsis:
- I appreciate the feedback and suggestions from many on this forum.
- Keeping cool and not naming names has made it much easier to resolve things with the LDS.
- This is essentially resolved from my perspective, pending the finalization of some completion and refund details.


I don't expect to provide any more updates at this point.

So we can expect about 15 more pages before this thread dies?
 
Hopefully not...but then again...

to the OP: Glad both parties came to an agreement. That is how it should have been in the first place. between both parties....«cough»...:wink:
 
I'm not an instructor, so I am not going to comment on that aspect of the situation. But this is why I prefer diving side-by-side, rather than lead-and-follow, especially in low viz or with unfamiliar dive buddies. If the person in the back runs into problem, it is too easy to lose them.

I will agree with this statement. In lead and follow, I feel being the front person, most of the dive is spent looking back to make sure buddy is ok.
 

Back
Top Bottom