Why not two 7ft hoses when sidemount diving

[rddvet]

I got the OAO signal when I was on my short hose - went to donate the short hose (in my mouth) and realised those extra couple of seconds could be the difference between ok and panic for a stressed diver

No offense but that's a training/experience issue not a gear issue. You're thinking of changing your gear because YOU made a mistake, not your gear. You should have been taught to only donate the long hose, so if you knowingly donated the short hose you weren't taught appropriately. If you accidentally grabbed the short hose, well that's a mistake likely based on inexperience. A quality sidemount instructor would have sorted out donating before your first day. I know mine drilled it in our heads over and over and over. You should have had this sorted out before starting a cave class or your instructor should have sorted it out early in the class. Though if it was simply just a mistake, well mistakes happen and you should learn to react appropriately without thinking as opposed to changing gear.

 

[The Chairman]

Exactly my experience. I’m a big proponent of mouth donate for that reason.

It's not only muscle memory on the donor, but also for the person getting the air. They have no idea which hose you're on, and they've been trained since forever to take the reg in the mouth. I've had a few 'real' OOAs and they are never pretty due to the person's panic or semi-panic as they have just run out of air. I've never had a real OOA in a cave. I've seen the marks in the silt and clay from those who have, and I never want to be there.

I know of no double long hose sidemounters who put a hose around their neck. Everyone that I dive with that uses two long hoses utilizes left/right second stages, so there's no need or desire to do this. The double reg necklace really makes it easy for me too. The left reg stays on the left, while the right stays on the right. No confusion about which tank I'm on, no issues with hose length if/when my buddy grabs the reg out of my mouth and the reg pops out of the necklace far easier than any breakaway. Sharing is simple as most regimens require me to be in contact with the donee's thigh. The tank is easily moved forward if I have to move rearward in a tight passage with my 5 ft hoses and I don't have excess hoses all over the place during the dive. Easy to deploy, easy to stow, it's perfect for what I do even if I am with a backmounter. Yeah, I get it's not the way many do it, but you probably haven't dove with someone using them effectively.

 

[tursiops]

5 ft is not long enough; it is over 5 ft from a donor's SM tank to the mouth of the person in front. Claims of total comfort and competence with single-file sharing through a restriction using a 5 ft hose are not believable.

 

[rddvet]

5 ft is not long enough; it is over 5 ft from a donor's SM tank to the mouth of the person in front. Claims of total comfort and competence with single-file sharing through a restriction using a 5 ft hose are not believable.

Thanks. I was thinking it but didn't want to say it and come off like I'm just being argumentative. It works. And I'm sure it works in most situations. Is it comfortable? No. Is it wise? I don't think so but that's for the people in the team to decide. The way my team members and I were educated, a 5 footer in a mixed team is asking for trouble eventually.

 

[Caveeagle]

Once you throw in a backmount diver the odds of an air share go up, though a rare occurrence. So sure its probably not likely to ever be an issue, but I'd rather be prepared if it does.

I get the theoretical basis for this comment, but how does this hold up to real world accident analysis?

Seems like the only OOG fatality In the last couple years was a SM diver. Perhaps I am wrong. I don't think we have a comprehensive accounting for the last few years incidents. And who knows how to account for near miss, or OOG situations where everyone survived.

 

[The Chairman]

Claims of total comfort and competence with single-file sharing through a restriction using a 5 ft hose are not believable.

Have you tried it with sidemount through a restriction?

 

[rddvet]

I get the theoretical basis for this comment, but how does this hold up to real world accident analysis?

Seems like the only OOG fatality In the last couple years was a SM diver. Perhaps I am wrong. I don't think we have a comprehensive accounting for the last few years incidents. And who knows how to account for near miss, or OOG situations where everyone survived.

It was theoretical. I don't have hard numbers to prove that since they're hard to come by. But theoretically a bm dive is much more likely to have catastrophic gas loss than a sm'er

 

[The Chairman]

But theoretically a bm dive is much more likely

OOA on either is not likely at all, so "much more likely" certainly seems a stretch.

 

[tursiops]

Have you tried it with sidemount through a restriction?

LOL! Is this a trick question?
Yes, of course I have. Unless i wanted the OOG diver in front to be kicking me in the face, the 7 ft hose was necessary.

 

[rddvet]

OOA on either is not likely at all, so "much more likely" certainly seems a stretch.

I agree, neither is highly likely at all. I guess more likely when in bm would be better phrasing.

I hope that people don't base their gear decisions based on the fact that a complete loss of gas is highly unlikely. I plan my configuration for the extreme rarity. Choosing a 5 foot hose which is more difficult to share gas using shouldn't be based on the person's comfort and the fact that using it is highly unlikely. The person you need to donate to should be the focus on why you choose the configuration. Pete-that's not directed at you eventhough I quoted you. It's a general statement.