You GOTTA have insurance

[BRT]

Ok, change the word tangible to visible. You see the workings of the fire department when they show up at a wreck or house fire. You see the police when they catch a bank robber or whatever. Those are immediatly visible and you see the effect that your taxes are having.

Currently our medicade/medicare dosen't show good results. It makes it hard to convince anyone that they are better off under a government run system. Currently.

Also, I agree with you. I want people healthy and able to work so they can pay into the system too. The economy is better off with all of us making payments and buying stuff. It makes the word go round, gets the roads paved, parks cleaned, ambulances and fire trucks run, ect.

Preventative health care is dissuaded by cost primairly, and to a lesser extent lifestyle. You know a 4th truck is more important than going to the Dr's. for a checkup. But primairily cost.

If we could get costs down to where the guy stuck working at McDonalds or the bagger at the grocery store could afford to go get the check up, they might. Things could improve, more revenue from taxes, more spending and sales tax, and we could concentrate on the underemployed, the disabeled, and the mentally ill.

If we do't control cost first though it dosen't matter what we do with a national health insurance because there will never be enough. If more money is avaliable, insurance and the healthcare industry will find a way to raise rates.

I would rather have regulation of the costs and pay for things myself than be forced into a system like our medicaid system as it is now.

My experience is that the guy working McDonalds and the grocery store bagger can get health care cheap enough that they tend to clog up the doctors offices with every sniffle their kids have. Our cost, as lower middle class citizens was high enough that we had to triage to decide when to take the kids in.

 

[Storker]

change the word tangible to visible. You see the workings of the fire department when they show up at a wreck or house fire. You see the police when they catch a bank robber or whatever. Those are immediatly visible and you see the effect that your taxes are having.

When I went to the ER with acute appendicitis, was admitted, operated (during that very night, no less) and subsequently released after a couple of days, with close to no paperwork ("Name? SSN? OK, you're good. Take care") I most definitely saw the effect of my health tax.

When someone close to me went to the ER with acute excruciating stomach pain, had a cholecystectomy, had to be re-operated due to complications, spent >1 week in the hospital, and was released with close to no paperwork ("Name? SSN? OK, you're good. Take care"), paid a couple of tens of USD for their painkillers during the recovery period and had their lost income during sick leave 100% compensated, we most definitely saw the effect of their health tax.

For me, that was very tangible. And I'm quite happy about paying 8.2% of my gross income to cover that service - which also covers whatever I'll get in Social Security when/if I retire.

And just for the mathematically challenged out there: If I were making $400k/year, that 8.2% would be $32800/year, or $2733/month. If I were making $100k/year, that 8.2% would be $8200/year, or $683/month. What is the median US income and how much does the average USian pay just for their health insurance?

 

[Storker]

You think we get water and sewage service for free? No, we are not that far down the socialist road yet.

You don't? I get it for free as long as I pay my taxes.

I think I prefer the socialist road.

 

[Storker]

Our cost, as lower middle class citizens was high enough that we had to triage to decide when to take the kids in.

Imagine living in a single-payer system, where you just take the kids in, and a qualified ER nurse takes care of the necessary triage.

Yes, I know. Crazy, right?

 

[Ghost95]

When I went to the ER with acute appendicitis, was admitted, operated (during that very night, no less) and subsequently released after a couple of days, with close to no paperwork ("Name? SSN? OK, you're good. Take care") I most definitely saw the effect of my health tax.

When someone close to me went to the ER with acute excruciating stomach pain, had a cholecystectomy, had to be re-operated due to complications, spent >1 week in the hospital, and was released with close to no paperwork ("Name? SSN? OK, you're good. Take care"), paid a couple of tens of USD for their painkillers during the recovery period and had their lost income during sick leave 100% compensated, we most definitely saw the effect of their health tax.

For me, that was very tangible. And I'm quite happy about paying 8.2% of my gross income to cover that service - which also covers whatever I'll get in Social Security when/if I retire.

And just for the mathematically challenged out there: If I were making $400k/year, that 8.2% would be $32800/year, or $2733/month. If I were making $100k/year, that 8.2% would be $8200/year, or $683/month. What is the median US income and how much does the average USian pay just for their health insurance?

Our system does not allow for that kind of pricing because it's not regulated. I had a heart stent put in and it was like $85-$90k. Insurance "negotiated" it down to $10k. The medicine the Dr. put me on for a year was not covered by my $1500 a month plan. Go figure. I could have afforded the $10k, I paid $5700 anyway but the cost without insurance, no way. That's insane. Is your state run health system operating in the black?

A big part of the problem is that whenever any politician talks about "Free Healthcare" or Medicare for all, their plan is to expand Medir/Medicaid coverage and force people on to that system. After having dealt with that system in the past there is no way that's a good idea. It is a horribly run sytem. Waste is through the roof and price gouging on medicines should be criminal. There is a reason some of us have been forced to buy mail order medicines from Canada. What we have now can only be improved on so much but it is not a scalable system for the whole country. Until we're willing to look at a way to phase in a new system in planned stages it won't happen. The cure would be worse than the disease as they say.

The US and Canada are very different places good in some ways and bad in others, on both sides. But the differences mean that a system like yours wouldn't work within our framework. Neither political party has offered a real, honest, workable system that operates within our framework of laws, and culture. Both parties disgust me at the moment.

Having to order medicines from Canada so you can afford them is just one of the things that shows how broken the system is. I'd be willing to start over with a clean slate if I thought I could trust any of them to do the right thing but I don't, neither does anyone else. So we're stuck. It sucks. Maybe next election cycle we'll have better options.

I'm done for the day so until later. Take care and stay warm up there.

PS, I'd love $700 insurance with no deductable. Want to adopt me?

 

[Storker]

Is your state run health system operating in the black?

As far as I know, yes.

The US and Canada are very different places good in some ways and bad in others, on both sides.

Take care and stay warm up there.

Um, I'm not Canadian. I hail from the right side (pun not intended, but very appropriate) of the pond

I'd love $700 insurance with no deductable. Want to adopt me?

Rather not. But if y'all chose to adopt a single-payer healthcare system and swallow the transitional costs, you, too, might have a <$700 "insurance". With an 8.2% health and Social Security tax, youd be in the black with an income below roughly $100k for a cost of $700/month if my math is right.

To boot, your copay would've been capped at around $300.

 

[Storker]

I had a heart stent put in and it was like $85-$90k. Insurance "negotiated" it down to $10k. The medicine the Dr. put me on for a year was not covered by my $1500 a month plan. Go figure. I could have afforded the $10k, I paid $5700 anyway but the cost without insurance, no way.

Just that fact that the bill was negotiated from $90k to $10k shows how sick your system is. How much did you end up paying out of pocket? $5700? That's insane.

I've never paid more than pocket money for any health service - at point of use, that is. And any emergency service or hospital admittance has been 100% free of charge. Because I pre-paid through my taxes. As a bonus, there was no paperwork, and I never had to worry whether any of the health personell were out of contract.

 

[BRT]

Imagine living in a single-payer system, where you just take the kids in, and a qualified ER nurse takes care of the necessary triage.

Yes, I know. Crazy, right?

I live next to Canada. I have friends and relatives there. I have not been as impressed with single payer as you have. Doesn't matter. We are going there. I predict a rise in medication prices for the rest of the world when we do.

 

[BRT]

As far as I know, yes.




Um, I'm not Canadian. I hail from the right side (pun not intended, but very appropriate) of the pond


Rather not. But if y'all chose to adopt a single-payer healthcare system and swallow the transitional costs, you, too, might have a <$700 "insurance". With an 8.2% health and Social Security tax, youd be in the black with an income below roughly $100k for a cost of $700/month if my math is right.

To boot, your copay would've been capped at around $300.

A quick Google suggests the Norwegian health care system is under financial pressure. It will probably work so long as the world is not too successful at being green.
"Norway is in the global top 7 exporters of crude oil. The oil and gas sector constitutes around 18% of Norwegian GDP and 62% of Norwegian exports in 2018."

 

[Ghost95]

Sorry

As far as I know, yes.




Um, I'm not Canadian. I hail from the right side (pun not intended, but very appropriate) of the pond


Rather not. But if y'all chose to adopt a single-payer healthcare system and swallow the transitional costs, you, too, might have a <$700 "insurance". With an 8.2% health and Social Security tax, youd be in the black with an income below roughly $100k for a cost of $700/month if my math is right.

To boot, your copay would've been capped at around $300.

Sorry, I thought i read Victoria BC, somewhere in there, must have been another post. Well, it's cold where you are too so the stay warm part still goes.