Your personal evolution in diving, and an etiquette question

[Darnold9999]

I HATE “tour the reef” diving. Swimming from one spot on the reef to the next just so you get there. I once saw a DM lead a group around in a big circle around the exact same patch of reef - twice. They had no idea. Swimming so they “saw” as much as possible on the dive. They actually saw very little.

My solution is much like the Chairman’s. I take the time I need to see the things I want to see. If the DM swims off I am not particularly concerned. I may or may not catch up. If I don’t I shoot a bag at the end of the dive and wait for pickup.

I have the “slow” discussion at the beginning of a trip but my definition of slow and most DM’s is different.

Happy to keep up to a group when the dive is one where you have to drop in one place and swim to get to another but swimming just for the sake of “seeing” as much as possible is just crazy IMHO.

 

[MrBigfins]

Diving slowly in a high current environment like Cozumel means riding the current. It certainly does not mean fighting the current to remain stationary. That is the equivalent of vigorous movement in a low current environment.

There are dive sites that can easily accommodate stationary diving in Cozumel. There are others that can be dove different ways depending on the current that particular day. So while in general I agree with you, it is not always true

 

[Seaweed Doc]

Couple thoughts:

1. Sounds like the OP got a bad situation with either a poor DM or a bad drop.

2. As a new diver in murky water, I spent a lot of time looking at tiny critters like nudibranchs and such. I took lots of macro photos. When I go tropical, I'll readily admit I want to see big things and grand seascapes that just aren't possible when your dives are in 15-20' vis on a good day. I want to shoot video of bonefish, mantas, sharks and turtles as they swim in from a distance. Put another way, the desire to search for macro may not be correlated with experience diving but opportunity to dive in water where you're not restricted to macro. All that said, I'm copacetic diving with folks who pin themselves to a spot. I'll scout a limit-of-visibility circle around their spot. And I take photos/videos, so I'm usually slow....

3. I've not gotten any benefit from showing my DM card. (And more training doesn't equate with being a better or more experienced diver: I was on a boat once with two instructors and I'd logged more dives than both.) What has helped is doing a second day's diving with the same crew. When the DM's see you know what you're doing, they'll give you a lot of latitude. On the other hand, if you do something not quite right (and I admit I've done this), you may get less consideration...

 

[markmud]

Diving slowly in a high current environment like Cozumel means riding the current. It certainly does not mean fighting the current to remain stationary. That is the equivalent of vigorous movement in a low current environment.

For a quick two sentence response, this is right on.

When I pay between $1000 and $8000 for a dive trip (for my wife and I), you bet I am communicating with the dive op. If they have divers with different styles/speeds than that is the dive ops problem, not mine. I don't appreciate being treated as a newb who must beg for the DMs guidance when I am paying thousands for the experience. It should be the other way around.

Compromising with others in the group is proper etiquette. This thread is not about having it my way and screw everyone else, IMHO.

The OP asked a simple question, and I think we should all respond in a respectful way. Please don't assume that I don't, or the OP doesn't know how to dive in the recreational environment, just because we don't enjoy an u/w speed tour.

If you like Olympic level swim meets, ask for one--it is your right!

markm

 

[dianna912]

The happy medium suggested is most likely going to be different places on different dives. I ran into the same problem in Coz. For 2 days in a row I was burning air, fighting current all to see another blenny or our 30th toadfish and stay "close to the group. Finally I inquired with the rest of the group, and asked if we could mix it up a bit. The resulting dive was one of my all time favorites. We leisurely drifted through 3 dive sites and saw tons of life, both macro and larger with little to no effort. For the rest of the week we paired with the same people and took turns on slower dives focused on macro and the other half was more of a float by and see the bigger picture.

I think your best bet is to communicate better and more. If the previous dives werent what you were looking for, say so in a polite way. See if others feel the same and discuss how it can be adjusted. Also know that your desires cannot always be accommodated.

For sure! Diving Coz is a whole other ballgame on some sites! Ride the current and see what you can see in passing!

I did back to back weeks on the RSA I in 2016 Red Sea Aggressor April-May 2016. Many of the dives were in significant current, some in blue water, and required that the group generally stay together. This was particularly true for Brothers, Daedalus, and Elphinestone, as well as a few others. On some dives, it was perfectly reasonable to dive independently with your buddy. Most, but not all dives were from tenders and we frequently deployed our SMBs to facilitate pick up. The trip I took on the Red Sea would not fit your style of diving particularly well, though some of it would. The reefs were gorgeous and covered with life.

On the other hand, I went out on the Cayman Aggressor V last fall Cayman Aggressor V, November 24-December 1, 2018. All dives were from the yacht, there was little to no current, independent diving with your buddy was the rule rather than the exception, though there was a guide in the water for the dives. A trip like this would be nearly ideal for your style of diving.

We are looking at a trip on the HEPCA defender. It is a turtle/dolphin research trip, so I’m sure most of it will be focused on big stuff. Hopefully we will get some macro time, too, though. The sites are as follows:
Marsa Shuni, Marsa Mubarek , Shaab Abo Dabab , Samadi Reef. Shaab Alam, Satayeh Reef, Fury Shoals, Zabargad.

What do you think about this itinerary?

 

[dianna912]

As much as I love macros, I am also obsessed with sea turtles.

I can spend a whole dive just watching a sea turtle do it’s thing, munching on some grass.

 

[scubadada]

We had a wonderful snorkel with the dolphins at Sataya. Much of the diving to the south is more amenable to independent diving

 

[dianna912]

We had a wonderful snorkel with the dolphins at Sataya. Much of the diving to the south is more amenable to independent diving

I’m intrigued by the snorkeling. Is diving not allowed at the samadi reef? a whole day of the itinerary is for snorkeling there, and I was wondering why. I don’t know if it’s just because of the research we’ll be doing?

 

[scrane]

For a quick two sentence response, this is right on.

When I pay between $1000 and $8000 for a dive trip (for my wife and I), you bet I am communicating with the dive op. If they have divers with different styles/speeds than that is the dive ops problem, not mine. I don't appreciate being treated as a newb who must beg for the DMs guidance when I am paying thousands for the experience. It should be the other way around.

Compromising with others in the group is proper etiquette. This thread is not about having it my way and screw everyone else, IMHO.

The OP asked a simple question, and I think we should all respond in a respectful way. Please don't assume that I don't, or the OP doesn't know how to dive in the recreational environment, just because we don't enjoy an u/w speed tour.

If you like Olympic level swim meets, ask for one--it is your right!

markm

I am having a little trouble understanding the tone of this post. I thought this thread has been remarkably restrained. Just because some may have a different opinion does not mean they are being disrespectful to the OP or you. It was the OP who inquired about the etiquette of diving in a recreational environment and suggested she knew a better way:

"Anyways, all this to say: is it selfish to insist on my style of diving and hope that maybe, like us, the other diver will learn from it?"

So, sometimes I like fast and sometimes I like slow and just about anytime I'm underwater I'm having fun. And I don't think anyone has advocated an"Olympic level swim meet".

 

[scubadada]

I’m intrigued by the snorkeling. Is diving not allowed at the samadi reef? a whole day of the itinerary is for snorkeling there, and I was wondering why. I don’t know if it’s just because of the research we’ll be doing?

It was snorkeling only at Dolphin Reef, Sataya