DIR from the start? Zeagle Express Tech

[MXGratefulDiver]

This belongs in either the BCD or the DIR form. Not in intro/greets.

Well ... if you feel that way, click that little Report Post icon and make that suggestion. It is where it is because that's where the OP decided to put it ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[The Chairman]

Pete, the guy said right in his original post he wanted to become DIR, that he liked our philosophy...

Not quite. He mentioned that he was "attracted" to DIR and indicated that he was also attracted to the Express Tech. The title of his thread starts with "DIR from the start?" which for most people would indicate as much a question about the suitability of DIR as the Express Tech. He also asked: "Any other advise?" Consider my responses under the "any other" heading.

As I pointed out earlier, you are willing to dismiss gear that does not meet your rigid definition. The release for my Express Tech is not only similar to any BP&Wing: it's exactly the same. It would be like saying that you know how to uncouple a black hose: BUT NOT A BLUE ONE! It makes me wonder if you have ever touched an Express Tech. Perhaps that's the source of your inaccuracies.

Here's something for the OP to ponder: If DIR necessitates that you give up on innovation "just because", then you should consider if DIR is right for you. There are many instructors who teach situational awareness, perfect trim, anti-silting kicks and so on from OW and up. DIR does not hold a monopoly on these abilities.

the hydrostatic lung loading discussion...

When you're ready, I will gladly have a discussion about voodoo decompression. It would be my guess that your science is mostly conjecture with absolutely no data to back it up. Its no surprise that I created the :gans: smiley to help me express my feelings about such silly science.

 

[danvolker]

As I pointed out earlier, you are willing to dismiss gear that does not meet your rigid definition. The release for my Express Tech is not only similar to any BP&Wing: it's exactly the same. It would be like saying that you know how to uncouple a black hose: BUT NOT A BLUE ONE! It makes me wonder if you have ever touched an Express Tech. Perhaps that's the source of your inaccuracies.

....of course..I only know how to remove the black ones....

It is more like, a diver shows up with gear I don't know.... I don't know, what I don't know about it.....

Here's something for the OP to ponder: If DIR necessitates that you give up on innovation "just because", then you should consider if DIR is right for you. There are many instructors who teach situational awareness, perfect trim, anti-silting kicks and so on from OW and up. DIR does not hold a monopoly on these abilities.

For more than a decade, any "innovation" i saw from Zeagle I considered to be junk...convulted dive industry bs.... I agree this new system looks much better.... However, I have no reason to believe it is as good as a metal backplate, and many reasons to believe it is worse....there is no reason to take the gamble...

If it really is as good as you say it is, some DIR diver will play with it, and post about it...personally I don't have an interest in this, I really like Halcyon, and they were the real innovators of this whole direction in the late 90's.

When you're ready, I will gladly have a discussion about voodoo decompression. It would be my guess that your science is mostly conjecture with absolutely no data to back it up. Its no surprise that I created the :gans: smiley to help me express my feelings about such silly science.

Easy to use your approach to this, but not so easy to explain why Irvine could do 6 hours at 280 and then deco for only 12 hours.....it shocked the Navy spec Warfare so much that they made every major exploration dive for years, to get the first hand benefit of a new and better way for accelerated deco to occur....
I have used this horizontal technique since I began deep diving with George, and always follwed the custom "George" tables. this would typically mean if a bunch of IANTD divers did the RB Johnson when we were doing it, and they did the same 25 minutes at 280 that we did, they would do close to twice our deco time...and if this was a morning dive, I could ride a bike in the afternoon....
I'm just saying, I'll go with my personal experiences on this, and could care less about a "supposed science", where really, it is more "art" at this point, with some science assisting

 

[Pullmyfinger]

This discussion is "Introduction/Greets"? Wow. DIR has that effect no matter where.

DIR bashers seem to have that effect. The OP asked if something was DIR compatible or not. It's a yes or no question.

-Mitch

 

[Pullmyfinger]

As I pointed out earlier, you are willing to dismiss gear that does not meet your rigid definition. The release for my Express Tech is not only similar to any BP&Wing:it's exactly the same. It would be like saying that you know how to uncouple a black hose: BUT NOT A BLUE ONE! It makes me wonder if you have ever touched an Express Tech. Perhaps that's the source of your inaccuracies.

Here's something for the OP to ponder: If DIR necessitates that you give up on innovation "just because", then you should consider if DIR is right for you. There are many instructors who teach situational awareness, perfect trim, anti-silting kicks and so on from OW and up. DIR does not hold a monopoly on these abilities.

How exactly is the Express Tech so innovative?

-Mitch

 

[tridacna]

DIR bashers seem to have that effect. The OP asked if something was DIR compatible or not. It's a yes or no question.

-Mitch

Sheee..it. Let's see. We've gone from "Hello Jerry" to "custom George" tables in about 30 posts. Once we get to barrel-ended topologies in non-vectorial space, it should get riveting.

 

[Pullmyfinger]

Your avatar makes it hard for me to take you seriously.

 

[TSandM]

Here's something for the OP to ponder: If DIR necessitates that you give up on innovation "just because", then you should consider if DIR is right for you. There are many instructors who teach situational awareness, perfect trim, anti-silting kicks and so on from OW and up. DIR does not hold a monopoly on these abilities.

It is entirely true that "DIR" doesn't hold a monopoly on such skills; they should be, and almost are univeral in the cave diving community, because your life can depend on them.

DIR is a lot more than basic skills, though. At its heart, it is standardization and team. Some people come to the system from wanting the skills (as I did) and discover it's more; some people are attracted because of the standardization and team approach, and understand they have to acquire the skills to belong.

We do not know the OP's motivation for moving in this direction. If he likes the system -- the standardization, the team approach, the high standards, the community -- is it reasonable to criticize his desire to make his equipment conform from the get-go? Many of us who have ended up "DIR" lost a lot of money converting our gear. This gentleman is smart enough to want to avoid that.

No, the Zeagle is not acceptable. We can argue why, and whether it is relevant, somewhere else. You can ask your local GUE instructor (or whichever instructor with whom you have chosen to work) to explain it.

 

[vladimir]

Given the definition of optimal, it's either optimal or sub-optimal. IOW, "the"="one".

On the face of it, a logical statement, but DIR might (hypothetically, I don't pretend to be a spokesman or even to know) define their system, say, as "optimal for divers who want to be able to do open-water diving, cave diving, and scootering." And PADI, for example, might define their system as "optimal for divers who want to do escorted tropical reef diving next month with the option to progress to more challenging dives with further training." Two different optimals.

(I registered as John in order to save me explanations that I'm not a woman.

Good. We wouldn't want a conversation with a Latvian woman:

DIR bashers seem to have that effect. The OP asked if something was DIR compatible or not. It's a yes or no question.

-Mitch

Is that all he asked?

Any other advise?

Of course, everybody is free to stop posting and reading when they lose interest in a thread.

 

[The Chairman]

How exactly is the Express Tech so innovative?

-Mitch

Here ya go: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/bu...h-first-last-bc-most-will-ever-need-want.html