GUE Open Water class documentary

[VooDooGasMan]

AMA you are not really making a good point here is a diver on new years eve, scubapro stabjacket weight intergrated and weight belt New years dayand yesterday his diving is what ever the topography is and is trim and this guy takes great photos.

The BCD makes no difference at all you can achieve perfect trim in any dive gear.

 

[amascuba]

AMA you are not really making a good point here is a diver on new years eve, scubapro stabjacket weight intergrated and weight beltView attachment 111993View attachment 111994 New years dayView attachment 111995View attachment 111996View attachment 111997View attachment 111998View attachment 111999and yesterdayView attachment 112000View attachment 112001View attachment 112002View attachment 112003View attachment 112004View attachment 112005 his diving is what ever the topography is and is trim and this guy takes great photos.

The BCD makes no difference at all you can achieve perfect trim in any dive gear.

It maybe the camera angle, but in pretty much all those pictures, the diver is at about a 45 or more degree angle. Even if that particular diver were able to achieve a better trim, he wouldn't be able to hold it while being perfectly still. He would have to constantly swim to achieve the trim. This is because the rig isn't balanced and the majority of the ballast isn't centered over the body.

Beyond that, I never stated that you couldn't achieve trim in a jacket BCD. It would take a lot more work to do so. That is also only a part of the problem. A jacket BCD will no grow with a diver who gains more aspirations in their diving career and would have to start with something completely different, which will screw with your muscle memory and take longer to become accustomed to.

 

[VooDooGasMan]

On those dives I dove jacket and weight belt the days before that solo I was BP/W and I switch out constantly Dry to wet also. you will learn to dive what you have.

Maybe some of flat pics did not show justice as we only have 50' of mild slope then it is all wall and ledges.

I posted as you gave a bad example of sitting then your trim pic.

How about laying back and blowing bubbles, I can do it in any gear configuration, moving in the water is achievable in any gear. Even sidemount.

 

[TSandM]

VDGM, I appreciate your point that a good diver can trim out in almost any gear -- but I have already posted that trim is NOT the reason for the GUE gear configuration; it is to put divers from the beginning into gear that they can use to go almost anywhere they could ever eventually want to go with their diving, and also to allow a fully standardized gear configuration across the community of GUE divers. Nobody ever said you have to dive a backplate because it's the only way a diver can be in trim, or even stable (although I think it makes it easier).

 

[RonFrank]

I always find it odd that when comparing BC's folks like to contrast jacket to BP/W. They completely ignore back inflate BC's. I never had a jacket style BC hence was not as impressed with BP/W's. I have a BP/W for when I need weight. My plate and STA weights 12lbs.

I love my Zeagle Stiletto when I don't need much weight (6 lbs or none if diving steel) diving a 3mm in warm water. For this type of diving the BP is not needed, and I like the weight pockets vs a weight belt. BP/W are required for doubles but how many divers ever dive doubles? I see lots of rec divers who have a BP/W system but gain no benefit over a back inflate BC. In fact they may be overweight with the plate in warm water.

I think the equipment standardization works, but definitely not for everyone. I found it funny that these students wore a drysuit in an environment were none was needed.

 

[TSandM]

As I said, Ron, GUE does it this way for the reasons I stated. It's not because there is no other dive gear that works. My husband likes his Balance (although he never dives it except in the pool). GUE wants to put students in gear that they will never have to change, no matter what they may eventually decide to do with their diving. (And nobody needs to be overweighted in a backplate system -- just change the material of the backplate!)

I have to admit, I found the dry suit thing a bit odd, too. The T1 class we watched in Egypt was done in dry suits, but at least you have the reasonable concern about very deep diving wet, and redundant buoyancy. For shallow reef diving, I'd have started them in wetsuits. But maybe he was thinking about the diving they would later do at home? Because they all came from places where they would need to dive dry, if they dove locally.

I can tell you that the GUE Training Council doesn't think you have to dive dry in Egypt (she says, remembering Richard Lundren's bare legs disappearing into the holds of more than one wreck . . . )

 

[Peter Guy]

All I can say, after reading this, is that I will NEVER allow a video of any class I teach to be posted!!! My skin isn't thick enough to take the critiques.

 

[pedo]

To answer your second question, no.

 

[boulderjohn]

. . . How about anybody else? Anyone willing to sign up for a more than $1000, ten day open water class?

It is interesting that roughly 90% of the posts in a thread in the Basic Scuba forum are from dive professionals. It is almost as if the thread was posted in the instructor to Instructor forum.

In working with another thread I found a Florida dive shop offering instruction (both NAUI and PADI) for OW classes with a total price of $1,295 for individual instruction and $995 for small group. That includes everything, including boat fees for the OW dives. In don't think it takes 10 days. In comparison, this class is almost cheap. That shop is offering the class in a location with competing shops offering the same level of certification for less than a third that price, and it seems to be successful. That fact opened my eyes considerably--I had never heard of it, and would not have predicted it.

I am quite happy to hear that there does appear to be at least some market for people who are willing to pay more for a more comprehensive initial OW course. I don't want to get into the debate about how comprehensive it needs to be at this point or if it can be compared to a series of conventional basic courses teaching the same thing in independent modules. To me the interesting thing is that this puts into question the idea that an OW course has to be as short and as cheap as it can possibly be. It indicates to me that there might be a very good market courses that take the time and money to fall somewhere in the middle of the spectrum between the absolute bare minimum and and truly polished.

So, if any new or basic OW divers have waded this far through the thread, can you tell what you would have been willing to spend, both in money and time, for a course that went beyond the bare minimum?

 

[Blue Sparkle]

ISo, if any new or basic OW divers have waded this far through the thread, can you tell what you would have been willing to spend, both in money and time, for a course that went beyond the bare minimum?

I already posted in this thread, but I'm an OW diver, and I would happily spend $1000 for the class shown (and I don't have money to just throw around). It looks like a deal to me because, from what I have seen, I would have received more and better training for less money than I have spent, to-date.

I can't really say how much I would be willing to spend, for a theoretical course, because I'd have to know more about what it offered, who was teaching it, etc.