Why new divers looking into instructor and tech diving

[eelnoraa]

I was talking to a dive buddy about my hogarthian/DIR setup last night. He just finished his PADI DM and thinking of becoming an instrutor in the near future. But his current plan to get into tech diving and asked me if I want to go into tech training with him. I was quite shock when I heard that.

His diving experience is like this. Started in 2009, PADI OW, then AOW, rescue and finished DM about 6 monthes ago. His life time dive number is about 100, maybe 150 at most. Out of that, at least 50 were done in tropical vacation. I would say he is a good diver, very conservative and danger conscienct. Diving skill wise, I would say if he was to be evaluated for GUE fundie today, he will not pass. But if he was to take and class, he has good chance to pass after the training. So not bad, but far from tech ready, and definitely not instructor ready.

What is the deal here? While I was shock, it seems not that uncommon these days, even amougst Scubaboard members. Why rush into something that you (he) are (is) not ready. What is wrong with just doing recreation dive for fun??? Or am I too conservative?

 

[Tigerman]

Guess its some of the same reasons why some people join special forces instead of "regular army"..

 

[TSandM]

I think there are a lot of reasons.

When I first came onto ScubaBoard, there was an essay on the home page entitled something like, "What to do when blowing bubbles isn't enough". The gist of it was that diving for the sake of diving will likely pall, and if you can't find something beyond just getting in the water to keep you interested, you will likely drift out of diving.

I have seen it happen, and it happens most, it seems to me, to the people who get into diving for its own sake. Those of us who are fascinated with marine life stay interested for a long time, and when we get bored, we pick up cameras or start doing REEF surveys. Those who are truly motivated by marine archaeology and wreck diving get technical training, and spend their days planning expeditions to Truk. But the people who simply aren't interested in sea life or wrecks seem to find meaning in taking more and bigger and better classes . . . until there are no classes to take, and they buy a motorcycle.

Teaching is one direction this takes, because becoming an instructor is another hurdle people can set in front of themselves. Shops encourage it, because they make money from the classes, and because (at least where I live) they are chronically short of teaching staff, due to burnout and turnover. Enthusiastic new divers want to teach, because they love what they are doing and want to introduce others to it . . . and unfortunately, those are precisely the people who SHOULDN'T be teaching most of the time, because they just don't have the experience to do it and do it well.

 

[spectrum]

What is the deal here? While I was shock, it seems not that uncommon these days, even amougst Scubaboard members. Why rush into something that you (he) are (is) not ready. What is wrong with just doing recreation dive for fun??? Or am I too conservative?

I can't speak for anyone but myself and I will add that I have not chosen not to peruse a professional level certification. With regard to going DM or better my sentiment is that the is little point until your experience and ability make you a respected diver / mentor/ role model. Said another way, would you trust yourself with the training of a loved one? Keep in mind that there is limited diver skill growth in the pro courses, it's mainly about handling people and the educational process.

With respect to going tech ( a nebulous term to say the least) it depends on the intent. If it's to start slow as remedial OW then go for it. If the intent is zero to hero to dive the Doria then "get real". Also if you don't have that form of diving locally I can't understand how one becomes or remains competent lacking a killer ravel budget. If a person's perception of tech is to wrap a hose around their neck and blind people with a can light then they can go knock themselves out on recreational class dives. Tech today is almost reduced a state of mind.

Pete

 

[xspect]

What is the magic number of dives or years of diving that make one ready for tech diving ?

Why isnt it based as much on the individual student as much as getting the right instructor ?


/install xspect asbesto wetsuit

 

[eelnoraa]

Teaching is one direction this takes, because becoming an instructor is another hurdle people can set in front of themselves. Shops encourage it, because they make money from the classes, and because (at least where I live) they are chronically short of teaching staff, due to burnout and turnover. Enthusiastic new divers want to teach, because they love what they are doing and want to introduce others to it . . . and unfortunately, those are precisely the people who SHOULDN'T be teaching most of the time, because they just don't have the experience to do it and do it well.

With regard to going DM or better my sentiment is that the is little point until your experience and ability make you a respected diver / mentor/ role model. Said another way, would you trust yourself with the training of a loved one? Keep in mind that there is limited diver skill growth in the pro courses, it's mainly about handling people and the educational process.

Pete

This is exactly my concern. I dive with this buddy most of the time when I am not diving with BAUE group. Honestly, I don't think we have never encounter a real "oh sh!t" moment. At most, we encounted some small things that we laugh about later. I think this give a boost in confident about his ability of handling a problem. But I really don't consider either of us have enough experience to handle real problems. After all, OW class is like a trust me dive. OW students trust their lives with the instructor. That is a huge responsibility.

 

[TSandM]

That's why I'm glad I got my DM and have spent a couple of years DMing classes. You don't have quite the responsibility of the instructor, but you get a pretty solid taste of what it means to have brand new divers in the water. Read the recent thread from the guy who isn't really sure he WANTS to be a DM any more . . .

 

[spectrum]

What is the magic number of dives or years of diving that make one ready for tech diving ?

Why isnt it based as much on the individual student as much as getting the right instructor ?


/install xspect asbesto wetsuit

There is no magic anything. On the ability side sime divers are quick at picking things up and others never reach what you'd call mastery. It may be lack of a natural ability, focus, motivation or to lead to your next question a lack of solid instruction to begin with. Alongside skill is experience and that needs to cover a relevant number of conditions / environments and types of non technical diving. When the cards are on the table there is no substitute for experience and the confidence it can foster.

Some instructors may be willing / able to tailor a program to include some work I'll call remedial or otherwise close gaps. Once again knowledge not yet applied can be shallow.

As much as some would like to believe otherwise you really do need to just go diving between classes.

Pete

 

[USFpsychDiver]

I have more fun doing something when I'm proficient and skilled at it. While there is no substitute for experience, there's also no substitute for training. My other sport is skiing. I've been skiing for more than 4 decades. Every year I take a week of instruction to improve my skills. Some people are perfectly happy skiing the greens and blues with enough skill to get down the hill in one piece with maybe a bit of speed. I want to be able to fly over the moguls on the blacks and make my way down the double-blacks on my skis, not on my butt. I like the challenge of difficult slopes and having most of the mountain open to me. So I keep training and skiing. I've only been diving for a little over a year now. In my first year I took OW, AOW, Nitrox, Cavern, and Cave I, and logged close to 100 dives. I'm by no means ready to go diving in some deep dark silty little hole, but the overhead training took my open water diving skills to a new level. Like in skiing, I like the challenge of diving in a cave, and I like having more dive sites open to me.

Unlike in skiing there seems to be this idea in diving that training too early can do damage. Learning knowledge and skills can't harm anyone, the harm comes if someone mistakes the limits of the cert card as competence to do the dive. I do not dive to the limits of my cave certification because I'm not comfortable there yet; I have a license to learn, not the competence to push the limits. That seems to be where to confusion in diving lies, that a cert card means you're competent. Maybe that's what it's supposed to mean, but I have not found that the case. I did not feel competent to fully plan and execute my own dives after OW cert, guess I was suppose to, but I didn't; one classroom session, a morning in a pool, and 4 OW dives didn't do it for me. So I hired guides for my early dives. Knowing one's own limits and diving within them is the key, not avoiding training.

 

[Dr Dog]

I was talking to a dive buddy about my hogarthian/DIR setup last night. He just finished his PADI DM and thinking of becoming an instrutor in the near future. But his current plan to get into tech diving and asked me if I want to go into tech training with him. I was quite shock when I heard that.

His diving experience is like this. Started in 2009, PADI OW, then AOW, rescue and finished DM about 6 monthes ago. His life time dive number is about 100, maybe 150 at most. Out of that, at least 50 were done in tropical vacation. I would say he is a good diver, very conservative and danger conscienct. Diving skill wise, I would say if he was to be evaluated for GUE fundie today, he will not pass. But if he was to take and class, he has good chance to pass after the training. So not bad, but far from tech ready, and definitely not instructor ready.

What is the deal here? While I was shock, it seems not that uncommon these days, even amougst Scubaboard members. Why rush into something that you (he) are (is) not ready. What is wrong with just doing recreation dive for fun??? Or am I too conservative?

Ok let me ask, who are you to judge his skills? You say he would not pass his fundies, would you? I do not understand why someone has to be at a certain level of dives before they can learn skills. I am in a constant state of training in diving, and I will have my NAUI Intro to Tech, Cavern 1, Nitrox, DPV, and possibly cave 1 done by this coming Feb. I am currently doing my AOW, and have logged 20 cold water dives since May. So am I not ready? How will you improve without challenging yourself? It is like playing computer games on easy, sure fun, but you can't handle any escalation.