What do you do when donating to a panicked diver who initiates a buoyant ascent?
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UofMI_Divegeek
Registered
Since you asked for experiences,
As a young instructor, I had a student initiate an "escape to the surface" event. Because the suddenness and explosive nature of the violence surprised me, I described the event in a published article
Its best to assume a panicked diver has ceased being a rationale human creature as their fear / anxiety/ perceived life threat has taken control.
In general there is no time to think, all you can do is react to the situation (Do whatever you can to slow ascent ... apparently locking my legs around the diver's furiously kicking legs was effective.)
Incidentally, I do not have much faith is the "OK" signal 'cause I have witnessed several incidents where a diver indicates "OK" and then immediately does something that creates a life-threatening situation.
As a young instructor, I had a student initiate an "escape to the surface" event. Because the suddenness and explosive nature of the violence surprised me, I described the event in a published article
Its best to assume a panicked diver has ceased being a rationale human creature as their fear / anxiety/ perceived life threat has taken control.
In general there is no time to think, all you can do is react to the situation (Do whatever you can to slow ascent ... apparently locking my legs around the diver's furiously kicking legs was effective.)
Incidentally, I do not have much faith is the "OK" signal 'cause I have witnessed several incidents where a diver indicates "OK" and then immediately does something that creates a life-threatening situation.
fiveoboy01
Registered
Man. Reading the end of that... A good example of how some make it through who shouldn't or aren't there yet.
During our submarine escape training (30m tank) if a student does not breath out constantly during an ascent, an instructor (they were strategically placed in blisters up the tank) would swim to the student and administer a gut punch, we soon got the idea.
Perhaps another question here, we always had enough air in our lungs to ascend 30m, constantly blowing out, I guess the psychological aspect takes over when in open water, that and nitrogen bubbles.
Belzelbub
Contributor
Yep. In my course, we practiced several scenarios at the surface, and underwater. The first point was definitely hammered into our heads over and over. Easier to accomplish at the surface as you can submerge and approach from below. A panicked diver at the surface is not likely to follow you down.
At depth, it can a bit more difficult. The panicked diver is not going to be making good decisions at least until they’ve calmed down. The donating diver needs to be in control. My instructor recommended grabbing their inflator and controlling buoyancy for both. If it becomes a struggle that could endanger you, go negative. One victim is better than two, and if it becomes necessary, you can continue the rescue at the surface.
UofMI_Divegeek
Registered
With respect to hand to hand combat ... absolutely ... a "dive parasite" who has lost control is a threat to themselves and anyone attempting rescue, so rescuer should always have an escape route.
I am a firm believer that training should, as much as possible, approach the real scenario. As such, in the days I was running rescue classes (40 hours lecture, 20 hours in-water for 4 students max), I did the following exercise:
Each student was asked to swim a small box pattern. They were told I would be above and behind them to observe their kick stroke and that their comfort in the water would dictate the rest of the day's exercises.
On the third leg, I removed my regulator and then I would come at them from behind, hit their shoulder, and spin them to face me. I would then give a frantic "out of air" and the "I want to share air" signals.
Since a real situation is much more intense than typical relaxed only a few times "I am out of air" in recreational class drills, I received a variety of responses to my scenario ... most would not, in my opinion, have been successful. (When I was trained as an instructor (1980), the staff was insistent that any skill done less than 17 times was easily extinguished)
Some interesting observed responses:
A student started to hand me her primary, as soon as the regulator got in front of me, she remembered she had a secondary, withdrew her primary, and handed me the secondary.
A student knew I needed additional air, but spent the entire ascent banging his secondary into my face mask. (repetitive behavior is a common stressed response)
Several students simply froze and had to be assisted to the surface.
Once, I was handed a second stage while the mouth piece remained in the octo-holder.
Every student who went through this exercise considered it to be enlightening ... just a demonstration of being human.
Lastly, something to consider:
To the dive parasite coming at you ... the only regulator they see is one in your mouth. So be prepared to defend your life.
Legal disclaimer: don't try the above exercise unless you are certain that you can handle the results of a surprised, stressed student.
I am a firm believer that training should, as much as possible, approach the real scenario. As such, in the days I was running rescue classes (40 hours lecture, 20 hours in-water for 4 students max), I did the following exercise:
Each student was asked to swim a small box pattern. They were told I would be above and behind them to observe their kick stroke and that their comfort in the water would dictate the rest of the day's exercises.
On the third leg, I removed my regulator and then I would come at them from behind, hit their shoulder, and spin them to face me. I would then give a frantic "out of air" and the "I want to share air" signals.
Since a real situation is much more intense than typical relaxed only a few times "I am out of air" in recreational class drills, I received a variety of responses to my scenario ... most would not, in my opinion, have been successful. (When I was trained as an instructor (1980), the staff was insistent that any skill done less than 17 times was easily extinguished)
Some interesting observed responses:
A student started to hand me her primary, as soon as the regulator got in front of me, she remembered she had a secondary, withdrew her primary, and handed me the secondary.
A student knew I needed additional air, but spent the entire ascent banging his secondary into my face mask. (repetitive behavior is a common stressed response)
Several students simply froze and had to be assisted to the surface.
Once, I was handed a second stage while the mouth piece remained in the octo-holder.
Every student who went through this exercise considered it to be enlightening ... just a demonstration of being human.
Lastly, something to consider:
To the dive parasite coming at you ... the only regulator they see is one in your mouth. So be prepared to defend your life.
Legal disclaimer: don't try the above exercise unless you are certain that you can handle the results of a surprised, stressed student.
johndiver999
Contributor
What does defend your life and the primary regulator in view mean?
UofMI_Divegeek
Registered
To the stressed, out of air human (the "dive parasite"), (their reasoning and perceptions are hindered / narrowed) .... the only functioning source of air they see (if they are not already escaping to the surface) is the one in your mouth. There may be no signal ... they may simply, without warning and quite unceremoniously rip the regulator out of your mouth. This could be life threatening.
johndiver999
Contributor
How ridiculous that is. All divers have another second stage. If someone takes mine, I grab another. It is just not that big of a deal and telling people otherwise only makes the whole thing much worse than it needs to be. I tell buddies that if they need air just take the reg from my mouth.
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