A Good Reason For Air2?

[kenlt]

On topic, my wife really likes the idea of the AIR2. She bought her Ladyhawk with it, but hasn't had a chance to dive on it yet.

She also wanted to put a long hose on her primary... Somehow I haven't quite gotten around to that yet.

I did that, as well. I have a Knighthawk with an Air2, and since my last dive I have added long hose, but haven't had the chance to dive with it yet, either. It seemed reasonable, I don't see how we'd have room to manuever with the "normal" primary hose.

 

[pennypue]

I don't see how we'd have room to manuever with the "normal" primary hose.

<grin>
Did that on a freeflow in cold water. (3 times)
Can I tell you how badly it sucked?

I'm getting a long hose. AND in cold water I'm going to use two first stages with an H-valve.

 

[oversea]

Traditional octo vs. Air2 is an almost worthless argument. I have dove both ways and I enjoy each for different reasons. It is like arguing jacket style BCDs and back-inflate BCDs. They are different, but serve the same function. It is all about what you are comfortable with.

I wouldn't loan the guy a gear set that is different from the one he has used thus far.

I personally now have an Air2 setup on my back-inflate BCD, and I teach that way. All of my students use a jacket-style BCD with a traditional octo. I teach them about the differences and their individual pros and cons so that they can make their own decision when the time comes. Also, it will come in handy when they go to rent gear that, "heaven forbid" is a different setup than the stuff they took OW in.

I totally agree, I learned with an AIR2. I recently converted to a longhose and bungeed backup but not because the air2 was crap. I happen to like it, it just won't currently work as I would like it to. And yes, it will confuse the hell out of your buddy. When I changed over, it felt a bit awkward. He's got bigger things to worry about other than the merits of an air2 vs octo argument.

 

[Divingnthedark]

Recently, a coworker started OW training at a LDS with the intention of doing his cert dives in the Bahamas later this month. I have been attempting to help him with whatever I can, including options for equipment beyond what the LDS is offering. His plan will require him to rent gear in the Bahamas and his preliminary info suggests this will cost $45 per day (2 days OW cert dives + 2 days rec diving after cert= $180). In trying to save him some money, I offered the use of some equipment, in this case reg set, BC and a computer. When I showed him the reg he was real concerned because it is not the type they are training with (mine actually has a completely separate extra second stage attached directly to the first stage with a hose, rather than being integrated to the BC inflator hose). I started to explain the advantages of a conventional octo vs the Air2's he is learning to use, but his responses could only have come from his instructor, as I doubt an as yet uncertified student with two classes under his belt could have rationally thought the issue thru. At the time, I decided to not press my point. I really don't want to come between a new diver and his instructor or somehow betray their bond of trust but since then I've been wondering what possible reasons a LDS would have for telling a new diver that integrated octos are the way to go. I'm not trying to rehash all of the old arguments, just figure where the LDS is going. First, these appear to be a solution to a non-existant problem. I find it hard to believe they are any more profitable than most other octo choices. What alarmes me most of all is that my coworker won't be exposed to any options as to air sharing or recovering a lost reg. I'm also thinking that the gear he ends up renting is going to look a lot like mine anyway and sooner or later he's going to have to confront his fear.

Hhhmmm.... I guess I don't want to argue for or against the AIR2 as I think this is a matter of personal preference. Although, I have had both types of safe seconds/octo the Air2 gets my vote for ease of use, It's always right there if some diver rips my primary out of my mouth in a panic which did happen to me once when a newer diver I didn't even know realized he was running out of air at 120 feet.( BTW it performs well at depth... at least those I will admit to.) My Air2 is first generation and I have never had a problem with it although if your friend does decide to purchase an Air2 make sure he realizes that it should be taken off the inflator hose and securely reattached for annual service with the rest of his air delivery set up or taken in attached to his BC if he is not comfortable doing this himself. I will tell you a funny story related to diving with the Air2. I was on a liveaboard in Georgian Bay Canada and playing around breathing off my Air2, there was a diver from Germany with our group. He told me that he had been watching me real close to see how I got such good air consumption rate
and he said "I never thought to breath the air out of my BC"... HHhhmmm new rebreather technology? =) LOL. "I told him I never thought about that either"
I did show him the Air2 and explain... BTW you give an out of air diver your primary if they need it and you breath off the Air2 if they don't just take your primary from you...Hope this helps....Loretta ...Forgot to add that it is also going to depend on what type of diving he plans on... obviously an Air2 set up will not be a good idea for cave, cavern, or wreck diving, unless you are strapped for cash why not have both types it keeps your options open =)

 

[Corigan]

Only time I've thought about breathing air out of my BC would be if I had no air elsewhere to breath. I would definately snag a breath or two from the BC with an ESA if I had to.

As for AIR2's, They are real easy to rebuild. You could about do it in your sleep. I was at my local shop the other day and we were rebuilding 6 at a time. I believe this is one of the many reasons why LDS use them on their rental/training gear.

On another note I have started just using my knighthawk as a backup/pool BC so I don't use the AIR2 anymore. In the time I messed around with the AIR2, I didn't have any problems dumping air, controlling bouyancy, turning my head to the right, breathing, or anything else that many people say they have problems with them. Of course a safe second stage breaths a heck of alot better than an AIR2. I dove with a 7' primary, safe second, and an AIR2. I never had to use the AIR2 once. Of course YMMV.

On another note, I've seen quite a few AIR2's on dolphin rebreathers. I don't have much knowledge of rebreathers, but seeing an AIR2 on one of them was pretty interesting. I thought to myself.. "If it's such a piece of crap, why is it on a rebreather?" Of course you have bailout bottles and such on rebreathers, but still curious as to why if they were "Evil and going to kill you" like some people have stated on all of these threads as to why they would be there on a rebreather.

Matt

 

[oversea]

Oh, you may want to consider encouraging your friend not to buy anything until they've tried both air2 and octo. I have one, but am not using it anymore, so while it did its job, it is now a waste of money collecting dust.

 

[friscuba]

Bingo. Anyone who is considering an air2 ought to spend pool time doing alternate air ascents or swims with both an air2 ond an octo. It might make the choice obvious, no matter which way the choosing diver prefers.

By the way, I'd like to see a thread on how many owners of air2s have a slight freeflow. My wife's doesn't last very long between services and many of my customers are often bothered by their "leaks" from this piece of equipment.

Oh, you may want to consider encouraging your friend not to buy anything until they've tried both air2 and octo. I have one, but am not using it anymore, so while it did its job, it is now a waste of money collecting dust.

 

[ScubaTwo]

I did that, as well. I have a Knighthawk with an Air2, and since my last dive I have added long hose, but haven't had the chance to dive with it yet, either. It seemed reasonable, I don't see how we'd have room to manuever with the "normal" primary hose.

Did that also. with the air2 and a short hose it gets very crowded.

 

[ScubaTwo]

Bingo. Anyone who is considering an air2 ought to spend pool time doing alternate air ascents or swims with both an air2 ond an octo. It might make the choice obvious, no matter which way the choosing diver prefers.

By the way, I'd like to see a thread on how many owners of air2s have a slight freeflow. My wife's doesn't last very long between services and many of my customers are often bothered by their "leaks" from this piece of equipment.

Have not had this problem yet.

 

[scubapro50]

1st most instructors don't teach buddy breathing now where you are required to pass back and forth a single 2nd stage ..... this is why a secondary air source is necessary. The current trend is that everyone will have a oct that you can just hand it to your buddy. Using both a regular oct and the Air2 should be taught durning basic courses. The problem is that if the instructor is not from a shop that sells this type of equipment (Air2) the students doesn't get proper instruction on how to use it. This is one reason there is so much misinformation the equipment.