AOW, Jr vs Regular...

[TGIF]

From where I stand, you are considering maximum depth, knowledge/skill development, and AOW qualifications dives.

• Maximum Depth: I would not use the maximum possible depth as the deciding factor because you/she might not be able to reach said depth becasue of the dive site's charactersitics. While the instructor will probably try take you guys to a deeper depth, the conditions, site and other factors will influence wheter or not you go much beyond 60'.
• Knowweldge/skill developmetn: Personally, it's always beneficial to gain more skills and knowldge for diving. In particular, the naviation dive will be useful for improving your skills when diving without a guide. Additionally, I believe that everyone would benefit from taking a peak performance buoyance course, both to make diving easier and to help improve air consumption.
• AOW qualification dives: You have three choices for the additional dives outside of deep and navigatoin. Shops and instructors will differ on which choices dives they offer. I would make a list of dives that you want to do and see if those dives are avaliable at a given shop.

Just my thougts. For what its worth, I did my AOW in Thailand and while I enjoyed the dives, I spent a day reading coursework rather than seeing the sights. Additionally, while the educaton was adequate, I would have prefered to do the instruction locally becuase of the quality and used the trip just to "see the sights."

 

[Diver0001]

Thanks for all the insight from everyone. A couple follow-ups to them:

• Correct, on the EAN40 class we took - it was dive-free since it really isn't a knowledge course you need a dive for (we breath the same once we're under).

Ah... in this case it won't count toward your AOW.

• I'll have to think about whether or not we want to do the AOW while we're down in Grand Cayman. What I don't want to do is take away from the things to see underwater at GC because we decided to do AOW and obviously there's a level of focus specific to the course that would be needed... whereas otherwise we might just be diving the dives and enjoying the scenery.

Generally speaking I think it's better to take the courses where you will be diving most. I'm not really familiar with conditions in Florida but I imagine there isn't a great deal of difference as compared to the Caymans. Your point about not putting your vacation time to studying is a good one. For that reason I think it's generally better to take the course at home and then go diving on vacation to get more experience.

The one caveat to that is that conditions can make a big difference to the quality of the course. Where I live, taking navigation locally is challenging because we usually have about 3m of visibility. If you have 20 or 40 meters of visibility my view is that it makes to "too easy". Likewise, I prefer for students to make their first deep dives in better conditions than we usually have. For that it's better to go to the tropics, in my view.

Looking at it like that you may want to do *part* of the course at home and *part* of it on vacation depending on which electives you choose.

R..

 

[1000RR]

From where I stand, you are considering maximum depth, knowledge/skill development, and AOW qualifications dives.

That basically sums it up, yes. I would say that my personal desire for the AOW is the knowledge/skills development. However, what's brought this up sooner than later is the potential limitation in dives due to depth.

• Maximum Depth: I would not use the maximum possible depth as the deciding factor because you/she might not be able to reach said depth becasue of the dive site's charactersitics. While the instructor will probably try take you guys to a deeper depth, the conditions, site and other factors will influence wheter or not you go much beyond 60'.

• 
  Our maximum possible depth was more due to boat dive restrictions, not necessarily the max depth during instruction. For the instruction part, we would be all about the knowledge and skills that would lead us to comfortably/confidently diving deeper depths. I wouldn't say that either of us fear deeper dives (80'-100'), but ignorance is bliss... so we don't know what we don't know - hence why we want to get our AOW at some point.
  

  [*]Knowweldge/skill developmetn: Personally, it's always beneficial to gain more skills and knowldge for diving. In particular, the naviation dive will be useful for improving your skills when diving without a guide. Additionally, I believe that everyone would benefit from taking a peak performance buoyance course, both to make diving easier and to help improve air consumption.

  We do a bit of shore diving and I use my compass a bit trying to navigate (but I also am familiar with the site). Getting better at that would be good. I use my compass even with a guide, just to know exactly which way we're headed, which way is land/deep water, etc. Now the Peak Performance Buoyancy is the one piece that we would 100% like to do for the reasons you mention.
  

  [*]AOW qualification dives: You have three choices for the additional dives outside of deep and navigatoin. Shops and instructors will differ on which choices dives they offer. I would make a list of dives that you want to do and see if those dives are avaliable at a given shop.

  Good idea. I think the instructor/shop owner we did our OW with will do about whatever folks want.

Just my thougts. For what its worth, I did my AOW in Thailand and while I enjoyed the dives, I spent a day reading coursework rather than seeing the sights. Additionally, while the educaton was adequate, I would have prefered to do the instruction locally becuase of the quality and used the trip just to "see the sights."

Exactly my feelings.

I think at this point, we (I) have decided we will continue doing what we're doing (diving every month, gaining as much experience as we can) and then in a year or so we'll do our AOW together (when she's 15). Between now and then, besides our monthly dives, we have 2 dive trips planned - one to Grand Cayman and I just put a deposit down for a 4-day livaboard in the Dry Tortugas. Both trips I've confirmed having a Junior won't be a problem. The livaboard will be an excellent opportunity for both of us to experience a truly dive-focused trip with TONS of diving. Since it's out of Florida, it's relatively cheap for us w/no airfare needed and being it's 4 days it'll be good in the sense we aren't committing for a week plus... and can get a "taste" and then if it is all good, down the road we'll do a longer one.

 

[1000RR]

Ah... in this case it won't count toward your AOW.



Generally speaking I think it's better to take the courses where you will be diving most. I'm not really familiar with conditions in Florida but I imagine there isn't a great deal of difference as compared to the Caymans. Your point about not putting your vacation time to studying is a good one. For that reason I think it's generally better to take the course at home and then go diving on vacation to get more experience.

The one caveat to that is that conditions can make a big difference to the quality of the course. Where I live, taking navigation locally is challenging because we usually have about 3m of visibility. If you have 20 or 40 meters of visibility my view is that it makes to "too easy". Likewise, I prefer for students to make their first deep dives in better conditions than we usually have. For that it's better to go to the tropics, in my view.

Looking at it like that you may want to do *part* of the course at home and *part* of it on vacation depending on which electives you choose.

R..

Good points. For deeper dives around here (Florida) it shouldn't be a problem doing something deeper with good visibility. Similarly, there's plenty of shore dives that we could do navigation if less visibility is desired.

I think for the time being, we are just going to continue gaining experience under our OW and then get our AOW in a year or so.

 

[flyboy08]

Taking classes with your home DS allows for a better relationship with them. Especially if you and or your daughter continue the learning process...for me, the Rescue class I took with South Beach Divers was the best class/learning experience to date...I would recommend working towards this certification...at home. Vacations are for, well vacations.....

 

[flyboy08]

I think "The Chairman" offers a PPB class and is in Florida...I would take this class with him if it was convenient.

1000RR? BMW two wheels?

 

[ljpm]

I'm in the same situation with my son. He completed his OW this summer. I had intended to give him a couple years of experience before moving on to the AOW. I also would have preferred him completing his AOW in Canada where he will be doing most of his diving. This winter we will be heading to Roatan and he really wants to dive with the sharks. That dive is 65'. We didn't want to take a chance the dive shop would enforce the PADI depth 'guideline' so I enrolled him in the AOW in Roatan.

 

[Erich S]

Will PADI be revising AOW in the new year?

 

[yle]

My daughter will be a Jr diver until she turns 15, which is a little over a year from now. My thoughts are - since she is limited to 60' being a Jr OW and an AOW Jr only gets her to 70' it seems like it might be more worthwhile to just wait till she's 15 to do the full AOW. Thoughts/suggestions?

If I was your instructor, I would recommend waiting until she is 15 to do the AOW class. As you have recognized, 14 yr olds are PADI-limited to a depth of 70 feet (although my OW certed niece went to 95 feet last summer on a few dives in the Caribbean.) The weird thing about the "Junior AOW" is that the required deep dive must be done between 60 and 70 feet... but when she turns 15 she's somehow automatically qualified to dive to 100 feet. This is a loophole in the PADI system (as even the OW course states that new OW divers are trained only to the deepest depth they reached in the course.) If solid training is what you want for your daughter, wait until she's 15 and make sure the instructor makes the deep dive to 100 feet.

As mentioned above, we got our EAN40 cards a little ways back. Since this can be one of the elective dives for the AOW, will it count towards that (one of the additional 3 AOW dives)? Where I'm going with this is - I was thinking of getting her and I into a Perfect Bouyancy class next to fine tune our trim and overall bouyancy control. I'm wondering if I take a class here or there, if it will apply towards the AOW down the road... and if so, does that make the AOW any cheaper at that point in time. If not, I guess it's better to just bite the bullet and do the AOW as a package.

The whole point of AOW is to expose the diver to different types of diving and provide further training of useful skills. Which means (in my opinion) you should get as many training dives as possible. If you tell your instructor "we've already done nitrox... does that count as one of the dives?" and they say "oh yes! So you only need to do four more to get your AOW cert!" you should find a different instructor. Find one that's interested in taking you diving more, not less... one that wants to do five dives with you as part of your AOW class, not one that wants to find the quickest and easiest way to justify giving you a card.

My favorite AOW schedule is one in which I do five dives with my students and include nitrox training (beyond the five required dives.)

We are going to Grand Cayman next summer and her/I will do some diving (rest of family not). I priced doing the AOW down there and it seems that once I factor in what the boat trips cost and take that out of their advertised price, the core cost of the AOW is similar to what I see around here in Florida. Seems I can do it for about $270 (plus boat cost). Would you forego doing an AOW while on vacation so you can just focus on seeing the sites, or do you still get to see enough of the sites during an AOW that doing both combined (site seeing and AOW) is a good approach? Thoughts?

Personally, I think doing most courses while on vacation is ill-advised for two reasons. One, when you're on vacation you should be dedicated to taking your vacation. If you try to work a class into your vacation time, you will naturally compromise your vacation time. Two, trying to work a class into your vacation time will naturally compromise your class time. And that could lead to a temptation (on your part and that of your instructor) to cut corners.

Don't compromise your training, or your daughter's. Do the course at home when you, and your instructor, has plenty of time to do it right, plenty of time to reschedule properly should any disruptions arise.

I also agree the others that suggested you (and your daughter) take AOW where you will be diving the most, simply because you'll learn some location specific things that you'll get the most benefit from.

 

[yle]

Will PADI be revising AOW in the new year?

PADI just revised their AOW mid-2017, so they probably won't be revising it in 2018. At least, I hope not.