Considering a BP/Wing

[fred_f]

Thanks for all the help on this. I'm off to Barber Shop Bob's* to order an MC system tomorrow. I only have to figure out wether to go with the 27# or the 36#.

I think the 27# would be enough, even with my 7mm, but it's kinda close. Anyone know if the Halcyon 27# is really 27# or some number approaching it? How much bigger is the 36# wing dimensionally? (One of the goals is easy to travel with.)

Thanks


*The only local shop that sells Halcyon is about the size of a large walk in closet and is literally in the back of a Barber Shop.

 

[JohnF]

I have the 27# wing. With my 7mm it's marginal for lift and I haven't gone below about 75' with it. I suppose it's just a question of how much lead you use.

With a Koplin SS plate and a weighted STA I still put 12# on my waist. That works with either a 7mm onepiece or a shell drysuit with mid-warmth undies.

JF

 

[detroit diver]

The 36 lb wing is the same dimensionally (or at least it was) as the 27. The only difference is the bellows near the bottom that was added to give more volume ie lift.

I don't know the "real" lift numbers, sorry.

fred_f once bubbled...
Thanks for all the help on this. I'm off to Barber Shop Bob's* to order an MC system tomorrow. I only have to figure out wether to go with the 27# or the 36#.

I think the 27# would be enough, even with my 7mm, but it's kinda close. Anyone know if the Halcyon 27# is really 27# or some number approaching it? How much bigger is the 36# wing dimensionally? (One of the goals is easy to travel with.)

Thanks


*The only local shop that sells Halcyon is about the size of a large walk in closet and is literally in the back of a Barber Shop.

 

[MarcHall]

1. Is a BP more or less stable than the Ranger with a single tank?
2. Are the STA'less BP/Wings more or less stable than a BP/STA combo?
3. How much weight can one expect to drop moving from a Ranger to a steel BP/Wing wing with a travel wing? I am refering, not to the extra weight of the steel but rather to the bouyancy lost due to the loss of fabric.

A properly fitted BP/Wing is going to be more stable then the Ranger. With a properly fitted BP/Wings the shoulder straps will be snug, most divers who fit themselves fit them too loose and the plate can slop around on the back. They may fill overly snug on land but the benefits are readily apparent in the water.

An STA lifts the tank off your back, providing a longer moment arm from your center of gravity, so it's less stable then a non-STA rig. The newer Halcyon Wings have slots for the tank straps so that STA's do not need to be used. Other wings may have this feature as well. Some STA's have a lower profile then others so would be stable then the higher profile STA's.

Another disadvantage of an STA is that it moves the tank valve further away from your body. I have seen individuals struggle to reach their valve with an STA, but when switched to a non-STA BP/Wing have no problem at all.

As far as straps on the wings from what I have seen the Octogrips work really well. Currently I am still using the Scubapros which work really well but are more difficult to adjust to proper size when switching between tanks of different diameters.

Do you need a steel backplate when traveling ? In tropical waters you may not. For most tropical single tank trips I would take an aluminum plate.

Marc Hall
www.enjoythedive.com

 

[Big-t-2538]

fred_f once bubbled...
Thanks for all the help on this. I'm off to Barber Shop Bob's* to order an MC system tomorrow. I only have to figure out wether to go with the 27# or the 36#.

I think the 27# would be enough, even with my 7mm, but it's kinda close. Anyone know if the Halcyon 27# is really 27# or some number approaching it? How much bigger is the 36# wing dimensionally? (One of the goals is easy to travel with.)

Thanks


*The only local shop that sells Halcyon is about the size of a large walk in closet and is literally in the back of a Barber Shop.

I don't see why 27#s wouldn't be enough unless you are diving a steel tank. Especially if you are going to travel to warm places with the wing. When I finally get the $$ to buy my plate and wing, I'm going with the 27# Halcyon....and fred T plate...so yes, Fred is still machining and selling plates.

I think the difference in the 27 and 36 is like 40 bucks....but hey that's 40 bucks to me....that's a fried turkey and a case of beer!!!!

 

[fred_f]

Big-t-2538 once bubbled...
I don't see why 27#s wouldn't be enough unless you are diving a steel tank. Especially if you are going to travel to warm places with the wing.

Because not all of my diving is in warm places (one of these days I will convince my wife to move to warmer climates.) Local dives tend to range in the 50-70 deg F range so I also dive a 7mm and sometimes throw a 2mm hooded vest underneath.

I use as much as 26 pounds with this setup.

 

[jamiei]

26 lbs? With a 6/7 mm wetsuit I usually only use 12 lbs (in freshwater) with a jacket bc and single al 80. Am I just naturaly neg. buoyant? I've never really compared my weight needs to other divers.

Anyone have any idea how much weight I can drop going from a scubapro classic nt bcd with the above setup to an al bp/fredt heavy sta/wings? Thats about 6 lbs or so neg for the bp/sta. Can I drop 6 lbs off my weightbelt or slightly more since I'm using a wing instead of the jacket bc (less buoyancy)?

 

[Big-t-2538]

actually the .188 SS fred T is about 9 pounds neg, and the STA is like 3...so you wouldn't need any lead I don't think.....

 

[MarcHall]

I am quite happy with the 36lb wing. It is the same dimension as the 27lb but with the extra panels.

One reason for the extra buoyancy is for surface swims when doing SoCal beach dives. On these swims my Wings are typically full which helps to lift you above the chop. At some sites a 200 to 300 yard surface swim is called for (at some sites its more like 20 yards).

As far as weighting. You only need enough weight so that you can hold a stop at 10 feet at the end of the dive when your tank is close to empty. On your practice or skills dives it's a good idea to see how much weight you can remove and hold the stop. If you minimize the amount of weight you carry you will also minimize the amount of gas in your wing or your BC so you will be more streamlined during the dive.

Someone suggested going with an Al plate and a weighted STA. Can you explain why ?

I think it would be better to go with an SS plate without an STA. The weight would be more distributed across your back and the tank would sit closer to your back, both of which would contribute to stability of the system. An added advantage would be that you tank valve would be easier to get to.

Marc Hall
www.enjoythedive.com

 

[Big-t-2538]

fred_f once bubbled...


Because not all of my diving is in warm places (one of these days I will convince my wife to move to warmer climates.) Local dives tend to range in the 50-70 deg F range so I also dive a 7mm and sometimes throw a 2mm hooded vest underneath.

I use as much as 26 pounds with this setup.

I'm in the same boat as you....

I have a 6.5 mil John, a 6.5 mil shorty, 3mil hood, thick gloves and boots, and I weigh 240.....I use 21 lbs with my single AL 80.

So I could see the possiblity of 27#s not being enough....but only at the very beginning of the dive when the tank is full.....and if all hell broke loose then, with the wing full, I see no reason I couldn't swim that up to the surface........Not to mention that even if the wing failed, and I was OOA (even if it is a reg failure and the tank is still full)....I can always ditch lead and swim up the rest of my rig.