Dealing with a buddy's decisions

[TSandM]

This discussion is interesting, but much of it really isn't getting at the question I wanted to ask. I didn't want to know what risk behaviors you felt comfortable with or not; I wanted to know how people handle it when a buddy/teammate appears set on doing something with which you are simply not comfortable. If, as DD is, you are comfortable with everything, then you don't care. But when you DO care, what do you say? Do you get talked into doing things, or allowing others to do things that you aren't happy with? Do you draw the line in the sand and be a bit of a jerk about it? (I've done both, and I've never been entirely unhappy with the latter, but I've berated myself for the former, even though nothing went wrong.)

 

[Jax]

In my early days, I just went along with what my buddy said / did (my ex), but I was also educating myself. After about a 100 dives and a Solo class, I just started calmly saying, "I am not comfortable diving like that."

Reactions to that are interesting. My ex would berate me for "thinking I know everything" (response: I only know I do not want to dive like that.) Others would look at me like I was growing horns, but would allow me to fix whatever (I have an awesome save-a-dive bag). Real divers divers just say "okay", and fix whatever.

 

[boulderjohn]

In the cave diving situation Lynne mentioned in the first post, then that slight air leak does not all belong to the diver with the leak; that is also the team's emergency gas disappearing. It is not like a basic OW dive in which the low on air diver just ends the dive early; in a cave it could mean multiple fatalities. I would certainly speak up then.

Situations like this can lead to what is sometimes called the Abilene Paradox. Simply put, the Abilene Paradox describes the process by which a group of any size can come to a decision that most or even all members oppose. If you get the sense that your point of view is in the decided minority, you tend to keep it to yourself. In many cases, many or all members of the group misjudge the sense of the group and do not voice a supposedly contrary opinion that most or all of them actually share.

I thought of this during a dive yesterday. Three of us entered a cave through an open water cenote that had been made murky by recent rains. The visibility was very poor, but it was doable. Before we left the cavern zone, the lead diver wrote on her slate that she did not think things were going to get any better--did we want to continue? We looked at each other through the haze and agreed to go. I myself was OK with it--but not by a lot. I wondered if we might be in an Abilene Paradox situation--were we each going on with a dive so that we did not disappoint the others? We went on and she was right--it did not clear up. I was still OK with going on, and I was feeling a sense of the adventure of it all. I was enjoying the challenge. Then one of the group began to feel unwell and raised the thumb. In that case, of course, there was no discussion--we were on our way home. I realized that this is what makes diving a little different from the normal management situation that gives rise to the Abilene Paradox. In our culture we are trained not only to respect the thumb, it is very much counter to our culture to ignore it. If anything, most of us respect the diver with the courage to thumb the dive.

 

[j2s]

Fix it or dive w/o me !!!!.....That goes for divers who show up hung over, missing gear (and think they can borrow mine) or just aren't prepared.......I dive alone regularly, that's my business, you want to dive w/me, you better have your act together !!!!!!......

 

[Basking Ridge Diver]

I have asked myself this question many times:

I have been in serious down currents, if me and my buddy is holding on and he/she suddenly gets swept down should I go after them??? If its my regular dive buddy, than yes of course (she's my younger/baby sister). But I have told her many times, if it happens to me, stay where you are and work your way to the surface. I sometimes travel alone, if its an instant buddy on a liveaboard in Indonesia, I honestly DONT KNOW what I would do......... There is a possibility I would stay put and try to keep myself alive, but I honestly will not know until I am in such a situation.....

I can tell you this - I am a volunteer fireman - you do not know and will not know how you will react in a situation until it happens. Everyone talks about how they will react - that is great if you are really thinking about it and visualize it but I can tell you straight up - when the crap hits the fan - you will not think about it - you will react or you will not - good or bad. And I really like TS+M's tag

"If something goes tits up, don't count on rising to the occasion. You will fall to what you have truly mastered." (PfcAJ)

It is true in both survival and reaction to situations.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Talk about communication, Just got back from a dive, Myself and another experienced diver, depth 135 max, diving 32-33 nitrox and hanging up around 105 or so for most of the time. Drift dive, pulling a float, I have a pony, he does not. We have no real pre-dive discussion other than we will stay together.

The dive is boring and tiring because there is no current and we have to continuously swim. Toward the end of our no deco limit, we start to see a few fish (we are spearing). I check my computer and the NDC is about zero and I am at 110. So I drop down to 130, mess around for a minute or 90 seconds and come back up to my buddy. I give him the thumbs up, and he responds with finger and thumb " a tiny bit"..

So I am in deco and I assume he is as well and I agree to stay down longer, we swim for a while longer and now I have like 7 minutes deco and I only have a 6 cu-ft pony bottle. I do not like to accrue deco that can not be completed with my pony bottle. So now I am past that point and give him a stronger thumbs up and he agrees and we go up and do our stop and no problem.

So later on the boat, he says to me, man I was wondering how long you were gonna stay down? I say, "me stay down" YOU were the one who gave me a "little bit more" sign when I first signaled to lets go up. He then says "well I wanted to go up, I just wanted to let you know I was going to hang above you "a little bit and follow you".. I found his signaling very silly.

It was a perfect example of me allowing someone else to persuade me to exceed my personal safety threshold. No harm, no foul, I do two more dives in the next 2 hours with him and then another buddy, with no real incidents..

 

[DevonDiver]

How did you handle it?

I personally believe in 'practical veto'.

i.e. apply your right to preserve your safety by declining to dive with an individual that you deem a risk to yourself, themselves or others.

An application of the "Any diver can abort any dive, at any time, for any reason" principle.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

In my early days, I just went along with what my buddy said / did (my ex), but I was also educating myself. After about a 100 dives and a Solo class, I just started calmly saying, "I am not comfortable diving like that."

Reactions to that are interesting. My ex would berate me for "thinking I know everything" (response: I only know I do not want to dive like that.) Others would look at me like I was growing horns, but would allow me to fix whatever (I have an awesome save-a-dive bag). Real divers divers just say "okay", and fix whatever.

And that's why he is your ex. Good choice.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[down4fun]

For the most part my buddies and I are all on the same page and feel comfortable confronting each other if something is awry. And if I see someone doing something i consider to be dangerous I will confront them.

Just recently I was penetrating a wreck when i ran into an o/c team on singles and air one deck down that had no business being there. At first they did not see me and I watched as they peered into a hatch and motioned to each other to continue down. It was then I hit them with my can light beam and gave them a stern 'No" and motioned to the exit and made sure they exited.

 

[gypsyjim]

I can't say that I have a set criteria, but I try to always trust my instincts. If I sense that I am really uncomfortable with something about my own gear, conditions, or with another diver's attitude I will not dive.