Diving without Certification (A RANT)

[Jim Lapenta]

I certainly would not quote an instructor manual in the new divers forum. Better to let them read it while taking the OW class. And I'm being serious about this. I will allow my students to read all the instructor manuals I have from all seven agencies in my library if they wish. Best to let them see what they should he doing.

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[Hawkwood]

Jim,

FYI - If you look at my first post, I did not state that I "quoted" any instructor manual - I listed the requirements of the PADI DSD. Another user posted I quoted the manual.

However, I did quote and reference a line from the manual in my second post in order to try to make a point. The original statement by another user, that BCD control by the participant in a DSD is not taught, is not strictly correct and the IM shows as such. Since the poster did not make it clear he/she was referring to BCD use and control underwater, I simply provided the contrary. One can argue one way or another that "control" of the BCD can include inflating and deflating a BCD at the surface. That is all I was trying to get across. If the user had been clear about the circumstances of control then I would not have commented.

I trust my comments were clear that the BCD inflate and deflate (is that "control"?) was at the surface only.

This has has taken the thread way off topic.

Bill

 

[Scubadam]

We all start diving without a certification. I remember my first dive three years ago was a resort dive. The only thing the instructor that took us out on the dive did was spend a half-hour in a pool with us, teaching us basic skills such as regulator removal. None of the divers including me were certified yet. Legally, if the tech diver is not a certified instructor, he shouldn't be taking his friend on the dive, but then again most divers dive their first dive without any formal training or certification.

 

[Zieg]

No, I don't think you are making too big a deal of this.

Just a few points.
1. Yes, originally people dove, flew airplanes and drove cars all without certification. But after many accidents we evolved and made certification/license the requirement. Los Angles County in California passed a law requireing certification in response to the number of dive accidents. I will also point out that back then you did not have SPG and did not know nearly what we do today about diving and cigeretts did not cause cancer. We know more now than then and certification is just smart. Yes accidents still occur but at least you have a fighting chance of not doing something stupid because you did not know.
2. Is the "tech diver" a dive insturctor? If so then he is probably doing a discover scuba. If not, he should not be doing what he is doing
3. Dawin cleans the gene pool from time to time.

I may be incorrect but I believe that there is a difference between certifications and licenses. A drivers license is only required to operate a vehicle on a public roadway, so off road or on a private track no need. I believe you can fly a single seat ultra light without a license, so a license is only required for certain classes of aircraft.

So I believe that someone can drive a car or fly an airplane without a license (under certain conditions).

I know of no law that requires someone to be certified to dive.

I don't have a problem being incorrect, but please cite me the law, not just state that there is one.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

There is no blanket law, but there are ordinances in some cities ... particularly in California, I believe. Heck, as I recall, there's at least one city in CA that, by law, requires you to dive with a buddy and carry a snorkel.

Come to think of it, there's similar ordinances here in Washington state in the city of Edmonds ... site of a popular underwater park. I know a man who was cited and fined for solo diving in the park.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[adurso]

We all start diving without a certification. I remember my first dive three years ago was a resort dive. The only thing the instructor that took us out on the dive did was spend a half-hour in a pool with us, teaching us basic skills such as regulator removal. None of the divers including me were certified yet. Legally, if the tech diver is not a certified instructor, he shouldn't be taking his friend on the dive, but then again most divers dive their first dive without any formal training or certification.

Which law is the "tech diver" breaking by taking someone diving?

 

[cc.harley]

I believe the biggest confusion in this thread is that "Legal or by law" are being confused with common sense. There is no law that states you cannot dive without certification. Period. There are however many common practices in place to limit the ability of the masses to get a hold of scuba gear and go out and terminate themselves. Education is always the best preventative to any accident. The safest thing for anyone is to never do any "inherently dangerous". Not going to happen, is it? Stupidity and lack of common sense are the prerequisite for accidents and fatalities in all aspects of life, not just diving. Darwin?

Most individuals on this forum, it seems, did some diving prior to certification. I would hazard a guess that over 90% of certified divers today did some diving prior to certification. It was that way for me as well in the early 80's. Interest and common sense told me to go and find more information and learning as I chose to "not die" while doing something I enjoyed. It also interested me to get better at something I enjoyed. We all learn to this day by watching someone who is more experienced at doing something than we are. Few are those who wake up one day or watch a show and decide they are going to spend hundreds of dollars in gear and Certification without actually trying it first. That being said let's all hope that this succesful first venture into diving, leads to the same interest in diving and ultimate certification of said "brother in law" that has made us all better and safer divers.

My 2cents worth

 

[owenfranklin]

my first dive was in Jamaica, No cert. thirty mins. in the pool, then overboard.....loved it ever since.

 

[divingpyrate]

did 6 discovery dives before getting certified and buying my own gear
nothing wrong with discovery dives So long as the dive master knows their stuff
Would have never certified if it were not for discovories

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[bj139]

My first dive was in Bermuda in 2002(Discover Scuba). We took the boat to a sandy beach. At 4 ft deep, did a reg recovery. Then a partial mask clear and BC inflate. Got back on the boat and went to dive site. I was told not to hold my breath. Descended anchor line to 30 ft on bottom. Did a swim back up through reef. All without being certified. I did not dive again until 2010 when I became certified.