dropping weights could save life

[Curt Bowen]

I wonder what agency standards say about the correct way to get into (and out of) a strong siphon.

Thats the good part, we dont follow agency standards, we make our own and the agencies follow our ideas.

 

[cdiver2]

Curt could you define we for me please

 

[NOVIZWHIZ]

Hope you guys don't mind if I wade in here....in 30 years of diving I know of only two or three times when a dropped belt was necessary - not very often, but it happens. It prob saved lives. I like to know that if I need to ditch lead, I can.

Every diver needs to take into consideration the type of diving he/she does...for example -I do a lot of fossil diving in the local rivers, average 25 -40 ft, little to no visability and pretty hardy current. We overweight to help keep ourselves down while we're literally grubbing on the bottom. With a loaded goody bag, trying to make the surface is sometimes difficult - several years ago, my partner had to drop his belt and bag when he had a regulator malfunction. I popped a belt on another diver who had idiotically removed his fins, mask and BC at the boat and forgot to remove his belt. he let go of the boat and was gone.....I realized what was happening as he was being pulled down, was able to get to him and from behind reached around and popped the quick release buckle. He panicked and never thought about releasing the buckle. Anyway, just to say read these suggestions, think about the kind of diving YOU do and do what seems to work best.

Incidentally I did see a diver trying to make the surface once -wearing one of the old horse -collars with the crotch strap.... belt hung on the strap. Don't know about the horizontal / vertical position thing, all I know is if and when I need to drop my belt, I want to be sure I can drop my belt.

 

[Curt Bowen]

Curt could you define we for me please

The technical divers out there doing the exploring and equipment innovations.

If you did not know, much of the equipment divers use today was designed by cave and wreck divers looking for better and safer ways to explore.

Example SPG''s, BCD's, HID lights, Reels, Scooters, sidemount harnesses the list goes on and on.

 

[cdiver2]

The technical divers out there doing the exploring and equipment innovations.

If you did not know, much of the equipment divers use today was designed by cave and wreck divers looking for better and safer ways to explore.

Example SPG''s, BCD's, HID lights, Reels, Scooters, sidemount harnesses the list goes on and on.

A lot of stuff has come from tec divers, but your previous post came across as no one (training agency's) do;s anything unless it comes from the tecs.
Reels I was using a home made reel the other side of the pond before there were tec divers or a certification for wreck diver. We started with very high end brass fishing reels and then started to make our own from perspex to cut the cost of the very expensive fishing reels. They just happen to look a lot like the commercial reels of to-day.

 

[ArcticDiver]

I have to admit that I haven't been in such a down welling. Aren't they usually along a wall? If they are wouldn't you use the wall? What about your bc and/or swim perpendicular to the current to get out of it?

If none of that works and you're correctly weighted, I wonder how effective droping a few more pounds would be.

How many times have you had to drop weights in a down welling?

I've been in two downwellings, both on walls. In both cases I was properly weighted. The first time I was able to navigate away from the wall and escape the downwelling. The second time the downwelling was a lot stronger and a lot thicker. So, navigation wouldn't do the trick. As I posted earlier, after finning upward and inflating my BC I was down to reducing weight to obtain more upward lift/bouyancy when the current let me go out the bottom.

In the first case I continued the dive. In the second I controlled the ascent by deflating the BC, made a normal ascent to the surface making controlled stops along the way.

Would dropping the few pounds I had in my BC pockets have made a difference? Don't know for sure since I didn't have to drop them. But for sure I would have had a few less pounds taking me down!

Hopefully, folks reading this will realize how important it is not to be too heavy and to be practiced in basic skills so they can handle simple problems without dumping weights and blowing for the surface.

Most of the divers that I've seen hurt did it to themself by blasting for the surface becaused of a percieved problem or lack of control while trying to manage a problem.

By these comments you make insulting assertions. First, that I overweighted for normal diving. That was not the case with me. Proper weighting is for a normal dive; not for an emergency created by a substantial down force. Second, you certainly imply that I was deficient in my basic skills. You have never seen me dive. You say you have never been in this situation. So, there is no basis for your comments. When you've been there you are entitled to critique my skill and emergency handling ability. If you ain't then as gently as I can put it..Hands Off. I suspect that goes for any other diver as well.

You also, imply that I was blowing for the surface. Your assumption is an insult to me and to everyone else who has faced and handled such an emergency. People are individuals. If you want to make individual criticism make sure you have some individual basis upon which to make it.

You also say that this was only a percieved problem and that I lost control due to a lack of skill. Hogwash!

If you didn't mean this as a personal insult then put such pontifications in a general post. Then I and the rest of the viewers can discuss it in that context. This is as mild as it is because I think your cyberdiving has, in this case, gotten a little ahead of your cerebral computer.

 

[Scubaroo]

Inflator didn't work.

Uh, it wasn't one of the inflators that's just been recalled was it?!?

 

[Kim]

In over 30 years of diving I have never had or seen a weight belt come of accidentally.

My weight belt came off by accident two years ago doing a swimthrough - I'm not completely sure but I think I caught the clasp with my glove while reaching down for my gauges (I normally keep my gauge tucked into my cummer band). My buddy saw me headed for the ceiling and grabbed me - she had no problem helping me out of the overhead (it wasn't a very long way through) - we both just dumped all our excess BCD air and ended up a bit positive together - it was easy enough to swim down a little and keep it level. This was about 25 meters down so I presume my 5mm wetsuit was quite compressed. Once we were clear we headed up - the last bit did go quite a bit quicker though! We weren't that long into the dive (about 10 mins) so there weren't any DCS problems. I treated the last 10 meters as a slowish emergency ascent (there wasn't really much else to do!) I can assure you though that feeling a sudden loosening around the waist and seeing your belt fall away beneath you isn't too good. I DO use a crotch strap and now put it on over the belt - just in case. If I did really need to dump it the strap has a single fastener at the front - no problem.

 

[MikeFerrara]

I've been in two downwellings, both on walls. In both cases I was properly weighted. The first time I was able to navigate away from the wall and escape the downwelling.

Why go away from the wall?

I haven't been in a down welling in the ocean but we run into some flow in caves...the kind that can tear your mask off. We use the walls or floor. Flow is less near a wall and there are obstructions that break and bend the flow.

I've also been in strong current other than downwellings in the ocean and rivers. We hug the wreck, bottom or whatever there is that slows or breaks current.

What's your answer for a diver in warm water wearing just a swim suit or skin who doesn't need any weight at all?

By these comments you make insulting assertions. First, that I overweighted for normal diving. That was not the case with me. Proper weighting is for a normal dive; not for an emergency created by a substantial down force. Second, you certainly imply that I was deficient in my basic skills. You have never seen me dive. You say you have never been in this situation. So, there is no basis for your comments. When you've been there you are entitled to critique my skill and emergency handling ability. If you ain't then as gently as I can put it..Hands Off. I suspect that goes for any other diver as well.


You also, imply that I was blowing for the surface. Your assumption is an insult to me and to everyone else who has faced and handled such an emergency. People are individuals. If you want to make individual criticism make sure you have some individual basis upon which to make it.

You also say that this was only a percieved problem and that I lost control due to a lack of skill. Hogwash!

If you didn't mean this as a personal insult then put such pontifications in a general post. Then I and the rest of the viewers can discuss it in that context. This is as mild as it is because I think your cyberdiving has, in this case, gotten a little ahead of your cerebral computer.

The only hogwash your assertion that I implied anything about you. I didn't imply anything about what you did or didn't do since I hadn't even heard the story when I posted.

I said...

Most of the divers that I've seen hurt did it to themself by blasting for the surface becaused of a percieved problem or lack of control while trying to manage a problem.

I simply stated exactly what I've seen over and over. How does it imply anything at all about you?

You encouraged divers to stick to standards. I asked which standards you were refering to. I'll ask again...which ones? I think a discussion of standards would be appropriate.

 

[MikeFerrara]

My weight belt came off by accident two years ago doing a swimthrough - I'm not completely sure but I think I caught the clasp with my glove while reaching down for my gauges (I normally keep my gauge tucked into my cummer band). My buddy saw me headed for the ceiling and grabbed me - she had no problem helping me out of the overhead (it wasn't a very long way through) - we both just dumped all our excess BCD air and ended up a bit positive together - it was easy enough to swim down a little and keep it level. This was about 25 meters down so I presume my 5mm wetsuit was quite compressed. Once we were clear we headed up - the last bit did go quite a bit quicker though! We weren't that long into the dive (about 10 mins) so there weren't any DCS problems. I treated the last 10 meters as a slowish emergency ascent (there wasn't really much else to do!) I can assure you though that feeling a sudden loosening around the waist and seeing your belt fall away beneath you isn't too good. I DO use a crotch strap and now put it on over the belt - just in case. If I did really need to dump it the strap has a single fastener at the front - no problem.

I've seen lots of divers drop weights on accident.

I had a diver helping me move a gravel shaker. The thing is just a metal tube full of holes. It's not that heavy and it rolls easy enough. However he somehow knocked his weight belt buckle open and all of a sudden he was just gone.

I once helped another instructors OW student (I was a DM in training) who was losing her belt. She was a big girl and had LOTS of weight on the belt with no hips to hold it up. Once her suit compressed a little the belt was falling down around her ankles. Boy that was a fun one I'll tell ya.

I can't even count the number of times I've found velcro weight pouches on the bottom or saw one comming off a diver and caught the diver with one hand and the pouch in the other and strugled to hold the two together. Back before I went to a simple plate and harness I was trying out a Sherwood outback. One minute I was enjoying the dive and the next I was headed for the surface and there wasn't a thing that I could do about it. One of the pouches just slipped out. Velcro pouches are dangerous junk.