First Indo trip...need advice please :)

[jake11]

We traveled to RA with Jake 11 and I was dreading the trip, but with Jakes careful planning we arrived in Sorong and back in LA with very little jet lag.

We flew LAX-Toyko (1 1/2 hour layover) Toyko-Singapore (transit hotel in airport 8 hours-$59), Singapore-Manado (Novotel-$41 w/breakfast), Manado-Sorong. Boat picked us up.

Boat ended in Lembeh and we stayed at KBR one night - beautiful hotel. Manado to Singapore-
Furama Riverfront - great hotel with huge buffet breakfast. I would stay 2 nights, just to see Singapore-wonderful, clean city. Singapore-Toyko (1 hour layover) Toyko-LAX.

We flew Singapore Air and were lucky enough to be on uncrowded flights and each had an aisle of our own to stretch out. Singapore Air is the best airline I've ever flown

I agree with JBJClj. We have been to Indonesia around 8 or 9 times now and this is the easiest way to go! Breaking it up makes it not so much torture! Unless of course you fly first class then the trip is a snap!

 

[Luko]

Thinking maybe a 3-4 day cooldown on Sanur beach on Bali, then 7 days at Wakatobi. Anyone been there?? Thoughts? The reefs just look spectacular, and the resort is gorgeous (from what I can tell).

Not been to Wakatobi as I find Wakatobi resort is way too far overpriced (almost crazy in Indonesia) and from what some of my trusted friends told me not the very best diving in Indonesia.

I have tried this summer to arrange a trip to less expensive alternative accoms in Wakatobi but found out that summer was not the best season to go and that going to the outer island like WangiWangi or Tomea (the Wa and the To in Wakatobi) could be a pain in the neck, hence I am leaving it for when a challenger airline will fly there.

Have you considered the idea that Komodo would be a very good option, not too far from Bali and easily accessible both spring and summer (although spring would be better)?

As far as Saipadan, it was actually the focal point for our '12 vacation. I scrapped the idea when I heard that if you go for a week you could be lucky to actually get into the park 2-3 days. Thats way too far for us to travel for a roll of the dice...LOL. Besides the marine park I didn't hear really awesome things about the rest of borneo diving.

I do not concur on some parts of what you say, having been 5 times in Sipadan.
You would easily find periods in spring where you could dive at least 4 times a week on Sipadan. Otherwise I find the diving on Mabul is great, personnaly I am a photographer, you can check on my galleries the kind of small stuff you find on Mabul, which I enjoy a lot more shooting at than Sipadan, which is supposed to be the highlight!
Besides that you were asking for a beach and a comfy resort on a second part of the trip, Lankayan would be hard to beat in that respect, and a dive place too, though a step below the Sipadan/Mabul combo.

 

[Mossman]

I've done two of the options you've considered, Wakatobi/Bali and Komodo/Bali. Both trips were excellent. With travel time from LAX, however, your two weeks is going to be more like a one-week liveaboard or dive resort plus a few days in Bali at most, unless you really push it and/or get lucky with connection times and lack of delays.

We did a 10-day Bali-Komodo-Bali liveaboard that managed to avoid domestic flights and Wakatobi did a fine job of handling the travel to their resort - my reluctance to brave domestic Indonesian air travel on my own is a big reason why I chose these two itineraries for my past Indonesia travel even though I really do want to make it to Raja Ampat or Lembeh some day.

Overall, I found the diving from our liveaboard (Kararu Voyager) more interesting than the diving at Wakatobi, but that's likely because we spent 10 days at Wakatobi diving on similar reefs rather than roaming the seas on a far-ranging boat. The resort itself was excellent, with beautiful beaches, wonderful food and drink, amazing hotel service and dive facilities, and a very impressive shore-diveable house reef, albeit all at a steep price. I just found myself wanting more variety after a week. Komodo offers great variety, since the north and south are vastly different, not to mention a host of interesting spots on the way there and back. If you have to fly domestic in one direction (and in retrospect that's what I would do, especially on a shorter trip) the boat's owners can likely assist with the flight arrangements.

Were I to visit Wakatobi again, I would likely combine a week at most at the resort with a week on the Pelagian. I believe they are now offering combination trips where you can do a few days on land plus a few on the boat for those with time constraints, so you might want to check into that as a way to get the best of both worlds: excellent beach resort and a liveaboard experience, and a few days in Bali to boot, all within your 2-week time frame.

 

[Sideways]

Thanks again for all the ideas and great info! Sorry I haven't responded in a few days, but we've been researching options. I should have described us and our diving prefferences in the original post...my bad

We are a 50 year old couple. I'm an experienced diver EAN Certified with over 200 dives in the last 4 years. My girl is a new OW diver with 30 dives. She's finishing her AOW and EAN in Cozumel this coming December. I'm a Photographer, so I like it all. Great reefs, macro/muck, pelagics. She leans towards beautiful reefs and seascapes with lots of reef fish. I don't think she would be into spots like Lembeh as much. Here again...that's just going on what I've heard of it from others. Besides the diving aspect My GF loves beaching it or just kicking back. When I told her these 2 options, she was pretty much in favor of Wakatobi. I've done one LOB in the Similans, she's yet to experience one.

Not been to Wakatobi as I find Wakatobi resort is way too far overpriced (almost crazy in Indonesia) and from what some of my trusted friends told me not the very best diving in Indonesia.

I guess I'm looking at Wakatobi not as a Resort, but more similar to a liveaboard trip. 3 Dives a day, the nice house reef with unlimited diving, all inclusive food, etc. The cost is about the same as the Raja Ampat LOB's I've looked at so far. The ease of getting there is immeasurable for us. Looking at Raja, and like a couple folks here confirmed, we're looking at 2-3 days to get there. We don't have 6 days to burn on travel to and from. If we do Wakatobi, it will be 21 hours to Bali, 3-5 days there relaxing , then the charter flight to Wakatobi for 7-9 days.

So, realizing Raja is a superior divesite, it just doesn't seem feasible for our short trip.

I do not concur on some parts of what you say, having been 5 times in Sipadan. You would easily find periods in spring where you could dive at least 4 times a week on Sipadan. Otherwise I find the diving on Mabul is great, personnaly I am a photographer, you can check on my galleries the kind of small stuff you find on Mabul, which I enjoy a lot more shooting at than Sipadan, which is supposed to be the highlight!
Besides that you were asking for a beach and a comfy resort on a second part of the trip, Lankayan would be hard to beat in that respect, and a dive place too, though a step below the Sipadan/Mabul combo.

I defer to your personal experience. All I know is what I've read, which are probably about 5-10 diff TR's. On all of those people were dissapointed by only being able to get in the park a couple/few days a week. I didn't read any that got in more than 4 days in a week period. As far as Mabul, like Lembeh, it would work for me, but maybe not very good for my girl.

I've done two of the options you've considered, Wakatobi/Bali and Komodo/Bali. Both trips were excellent. With travel time from LAX, however, your two weeks is going to be more like a one-week liveaboard or dive resort plus a few days in Bali at most, unless you really push it and/or get lucky with connection times and lack of delays.

We did a 10-day Bali-Komodo-Bali liveaboard that managed to avoid domestic flights and Wakatobi did a fine job of handling the travel to their resort - my reluctance to brave domestic Indonesian air travel on my own is a big reason why I chose these two itineraries for my past Indonesia travel even though I really do want to make it to Raja Ampat or Lembeh some day.

Overall, I found the diving from our liveaboard (Kararu Voyager) more interesting than the diving at Wakatobi, but that's likely because we spent 10 days at Wakatobi diving on similar reefs rather than roaming the seas on a far-ranging boat. The resort itself was excellent, with beautiful beaches, wonderful food and drink, amazing hotel service and dive facilities, and a very impressive shore-diveable house reef, albeit all at a steep price. I just found myself wanting more variety after a week. Komodo offers great variety, since the north and south are vastly different, not to mention a host of interesting spots on the way there and back. If you have to fly domestic in one direction (and in retrospect that's what I would do, especially on a shorter trip) the boat's owners can likely assist with the flight arrangements.

Were I to visit Wakatobi again, I would likely combine a week at most at the resort with a week on the Pelagian. I believe they are now offering combination trips where you can do a few days on land plus a few on the boat for those with time constraints, so you might want to check into that as a way to get the best of both worlds: excellent beach resort and a liveaboard experience, and a few days in Bali to boot, all within your 2-week time frame.

Howdy Mossman! Was actually gonna shoot you a PM. I read through your TR and also the thread with all your planning. I'll shoot you a PM if that's OK...I have tons of questions if Wakatobi is the option we choose. Thanks!!

I'd like the Wakatobi LOB...haven't seen the prices on it yet, or seen a TR from it to tell what the diff. is between the LOB diving and the resort diving.

Thanks again to everyone.... without all your input it would be that much tougher. :cool2:

Greg

 

[Sideways]

By the way Luko...awesome galleries! :cool2:

 

[Sideways]

So.... after some not so great reviews from friends who have been to Wakatobi recently, I'm favoring the LOB Komodo idea. Ideally it would be a 8 or 10 day trip (pref 8). It also should start and end in Bali. We'll stay 2-3 days each side of the LOB in Bali. Now.... just to find that Boat....

 

[Mossman]

So.... after some not so great reviews from friends who have been to Wakatobi recently, I'm favoring the LOB Komodo idea. Ideally it would be a 8 or 10 day trip (pref 8). It also should start and end in Bali. We'll stay 2-3 days each side of the LOB in Bali. Now.... just to find that Boat....

I'm curious what they didn't like. Is their report posted anywhere?

 

[Sideways]

I'm curious what they didn't like. Is their report posted anywhere?

The one friend I talked too yesterday just got back. He said the diving was just plain not good. He dives all over the region, and I've come to trust his judgement. He posted some of his pics on FB, and other photog/dive friends of his commented on them and how they felt the same way about Wakatobi. He was at a "Shootout" event, and although it wasn't at the Wakatobi Resort, he said the overall diving was poor in the area. Very little sealife and marginal reefs was the way he expressed it. I'm quite dissapointed... I was really excited about Wakatobi

Here's some of what he said....

Wakatobi really isn't that great anymore. except for the main resort, I think you are going to be kinda disappointed. Most guests just dive the house reef there now

I was in the WA bit of Wakatobi... no fish schools, not much reefs... the wide angle was all grey but it had ****loads of massive barrel sponges and sea fans.... I really don't care much for those.... and the macro life was almost non existent... I couldn't even find anemone shrimps to shoot in over 60% of the anemones I checked... really made it tough for the shootout

Dude, see what my friend ****** said on my Wakatobi Album... and she is talking about the main Wakatobi Dive resort... I would put the money to something else bro....


His friends comment was...

I am very gald you had fun with meeting other Photographers. I tried to tell you that the diving sucked at Wakatobi......***** and I stop gong due to the NO marine life as such as you found out yourself. But I am very happy you had a great time.......(-:

Now I don't know this person, but I do have somewhat of a gauge on my buddy's perceptions.

So...based on this and me not knowing the area... what do you think Mossman? You were there recently. Was he diving an area that isn't as good as the sites the resort boats go?

I went back and read your TR again, which makes me even more confused...LOL. I don't have a lot of basis for comparison in the region. I've done the Similans on a LOB, which was by far the best trip I have ever done. Have you been there? If so how would you compare the 2? Maybe my friend is a little more selective and less impressed because he has so much experience in the region??? Thanks for taking the time to read through the muck...LOL.

Greg

 

[Bali Diver]

you made the right decision and will have a great time in Komodo,Wakotobi by far too expensive for what you get,would rather have great diving and stay in a shed

A lovely place to stay at if thats what you really want and a very good house reef again if you are happy with that.Did a liveaboard in the area 2005 but the reefs which were more better away from wakotobi.Along the southern coast of Sulawesi were some outstanding sites.

If i had loads of money and wanted a lovely beach holiday and beach diving holiday with very good divimg off the beach then i would go..

 

[Mossman]

The one friend I talked too yesterday just got back. He said the diving was just plain not good. He dives all over the region, and I've come to trust his judgement. He posted some of his pics on FB, and other photog/dive friends of his commented on them and how they felt the same way about Wakatobi. He was at a "Shootout" event, and although it wasn't at the Wakatobi Resort, he said the overall diving was poor in the area. Very little sealife and marginal reefs was the way he expressed it. I'm quite dissapointed... I was really excited about Wakatobi

Here's some of what he said....

Wakatobi really isn't that great anymore. except for the main resort, I think you are going to be kinda disappointed. Most guests just dive the house reef there now

I was in the WA bit of Wakatobi... no fish schools, not much reefs... the wide angle was all grey but it had ****loads of massive barrel sponges and sea fans.... I really don't care much for those.... and the macro life was almost non existent... I couldn't even find anemone shrimps to shoot in over 60% of the anemones I checked... really made it tough for the shootout

So this guy wasn't even at the Wakatobi resort or anywhere near it? Wangi-Wangi (the WA in Wakatobi) is hugely exploited by the oil industry (see the National Geographic article on the endangered Wangi Wangi flycatcher) and I'd imagine this impacts the diving somewhat. It's also far from the reefs under the protection of the Wakatobi resort, which is located off Tomea, the TO. No wonder his diving sucked, but you're comparing apples to, if not oranges, maybe pears?

So...based on this and me not knowing the area... what do you think Mossman? You were there recently. Was he diving an area that isn't as good as the sites the resort boats go?

I went back and read your TR again, which makes me even more confused...LOL. I don't have a lot of basis for comparison in the region. I've done the Similans on a LOB, which was by far the best trip I have ever done. Have you been there? If so how would you compare the 2? Maybe my friend is a little more selective and less impressed because he has so much experience in the region??? Thanks for taking the time to read through the muck...LOL.

I haven't done the Similans, but in the W. Pacific, I've done Bali-Komodo, Thailand-Burma, Palau x 2, Yap, and Truk. I have no doubt you'll find better diving in places in Indo that are harder to get to, eg. Raja Ampat, but I don't think you'd be disappointed with the diving in Wakatobi over a short time frame. As I said, I found myself wishing more more variety after 7 days, but my real beef was that my camera shutter stopped functioning just as I had set up a perfect pygmy seahorse shot and that's hardly Wakatobi's fault.

Your friend might still be disappointed by the diving in Wakatobi's protected area if he's been diving all around the area, who knows? There was a group of 20+ divers when I was there, many of whom had done the Paradise Dancer in R/A the year before and while they all raved about the diving on that trip, no one seemed disappointed at all by their Wakatobi experience. As for "most guests just dive the house reef", that was definitely not the case when I was there as I was one of the few who did dive the house reef more than once (had to do something while J was getting massages).

If you want "great diving and stay in a shed" as another poster suggests, go for it, especially if you don't mind getting yourself there on various domestic flights, overnighting in flophouses in sketchy towns, and putting up with resorts that have no A/C or hot water. You'll certainly save money. There's no doubt that Wakatobi is expensive. But it's similar to complaining that one's Ford Mustang can do a 0-60 faster than another's BMW. If all you care about is the 0-60 time and saving money, the Ford is clearly the way to go. If you like a little comfort though maybe less raw power and you can afford it, go with the BMW.

Overall, I preferred the diving on my Bali-Komodo trip. The Komodo sites were excellent and we hit a few nifty spots on the way there and back (though we also did some dives that were absolutely dead, where I should have stayed on the boat). The boat was indeed comfortable, at 180' feet easily the largest liveaboard I've been on, and the camera facilities were amazing. That said, I still enjoyed my Wakatobi trip even more. Unless you're a pro or dive fanatic, it's a dive vacation you're taking and Wakatobi emphasizes the vacation aspect. When I was younger and poorer, I didn't mind bunking on boats and sharing a head with 20 people, heck, camping out and diving together would have been fine, who even needs a shed? Still, even if you do a couple shore dives each day on top of the 3 boat dives at Wakatobi, you'll still be on land for the majority of your time, and that's where Wakatobi shines.

As you mentioned, and that's exactly how I thought, the cost is comparable to luxury liveaboards in many parts of the world. I've been on a few of them: Kararu Voyager, MV Anggun, Palau Aggressor, Truk Odyssey, Galapagos Aggressor II, Sky Dancer, Okeanos Aggressor, Turks & Caicos Aggressor, and Tahiti Aggressor. While many of those had excellent food, comfortable cabins and public rooms, and great service, none compare to the "liveaboard" that is Wakatobi Resort. While I thought the a/c could have been better in our bungalow (thatched roof doesn't keep the cool in very well) and we had toilet issues (eventually fixed), the rooms were otherwise large and comfortable - I'd shell out the extra for one of the upgraded, newer rooms however. The food was restaurant quality using top ingredients, easily exceeding anything produced on any of the aforementioned liveaboards. House wine was fine, but mixed drinks, from tropicals to dirty Sapphire martinis, were excellent, and very enjoyable during the happy hour at the end of the dock. Service, while usually outstanding on liveaboards, was over the top at Wakatobi - this makes it most liveaboard-like IMO as you don't have to carry a thing: your gear stays set up on the boat just like a liveaboard, unless you need it for a shore dive in which case they'll transport it to your assigned "station" at the dive facility, and they even carry cameras back and forth from the camera room to the camera table on the dive boat, or will take it from you as you exit the water after a shore dive. Throw in the available of cheap massages (the hot rock massage seemed the most popular), affordable internet accessible from the bungalow, even (albeit spotty) cell service, big tanks available (AL 100s) so heavy breathing photographers can still get their 60-70 min bottom dive on every dive, nitrox and even rebreather support for those so inclined, and grounds constantly being manicured so it looks and feels like you're staying at a boutique resort in Hawaii, not a remote island in a 3rd world country, it's luxury liveaboard on steroids.

If you'd already done other liveaboards and dive resorts around Indonesia, had dealt with the issues of traveling around the country and had experienced the best of what Indonesia can offer underwater, Wakatobi might not be the best for you unless you were more interested more in the land amenities. But as a first trip to Indonesia and your second to Southeast Asia, and assuming the cost won't throw you in the poor house, I don't think you'll make a mistake choosing Wakatobi.

I was having camera issues there, but still managed to snap a few u/w photos there (the latter set were the ones I pulled for the photo "contest" on the last night):

https://picasaweb.google.com/Mossman.Photos/Indonesia#
https://picasaweb.google.com/Mossman.Photos/Indo2#