Gear Advice - Scubapro X-Tek Form Tek Harness

[Ozwald]

Devon....grantd you may be a very exp'd diver with far more knowledge than i may ever hope to have but the "my way or the highway approach" is very unflattering.

Jusy MHO.

 

[BVickery]

Devon....grantd you may be a very exp'd diver with far more knowledge than i may ever hope to have but the "my way or the highway approach" is very unflattering.

Jusy MHO.

Not really, the way the OP first came out he wanted opinions on the gear, but in reality, he just wanted validation on his rather expensive purchase. I've dove in a deluxe type harness before, was it the SP? Nope, but the theory and basic design are the same throughout, padding.

When a person asks for advice he should actually be willing to listen to it, and not choose the advice that fits their per-conceived notions.

 

[BDSC]

Congrats on your purchase and it sounds as if you got a great deal. I have been diving Scubapro BC's since 1991 and have hundreds of dives on them and have never had a single problem. You equipment could easily be the last set you'll buy.

 

[DevonDiver]

Devon....grantd you may be a very exp'd diver with far more knowledge than i may ever hope to have but the "my way or the highway approach" is very unflattering.

I did no such thing. What I stated was the lessons I learned over many years of diving... and the same lessons that were reinforced through inter-actions with many students and fellow-divers. I've stated what I've noticed "most divers" tend to prefer. Nothing more, nothing less. It's more objective, than subjective.

Where I state my own preferences, it's worth noting that those preferences are born of expensive mistakes. I share that experience purely with the desire to help another diver avoid making those mistakes. I bought a 'comfort/deluxe' harness before I took tech training. Within 2 weeks of doing my entry-level tech, the comfort/deluxe' harness was replaced by a Hog harness.

The 'comfort/deluxe rig' offered by Scubapro is expensive. It's also the least popular option amongst experienced BP&W divers. Many divers do start with a 'comfort/deluxe' rig... but it rapidly ends up on Ebay or CraigsList being sold for a loss. Hence.. a mistake. Add the two issues together and you get 'expensive - mistake'.

In respect of functionality, I draw attention to superfluous features. They are superfluous because they are not needed. They may be wanted but, I repeat, they are not needed. Knowing the difference between what you might 'want' (or think you want) and what you actually 'need' is a fundamental principle that forms the foundations of technical equipment configuration for most, if not all, technical scuba agencies.

 

[Ozwald]

Not really, the way the OP first came out he wanted opinions on the gear, but in reality, he just wanted validation on his rather expensive purchase. I've dove in a deluxe type harness before, was it the SP? Nope, but the theory and basic design are the same throughout, padding.

When a person asks for advice he should actually be willing to listen to it, and not choose the advice that fits their per-conceived notions.

Actually no. In the original post it was something the OP was "considering" therefore no "expensive purchase" was seeking validation. He was looking for "experience" with the mentioned product.

Personally i own both, a Halcyon BP rig and the SP form harness. I use both for different situations. I find my SP way more comfy both in and out of the water when in a drysuit and diving my steel twins. My Halcyon diving wet with a single or twin 80 AL.

Then again this is MY preference.

 

[arthurmnev]

Not really, the way the OP first came out he wanted opinions on the gear, but in reality, he just wanted validation on his rather expensive purchase. I've dove in a deluxe type harness before, was it the SP? Nope, but the theory and basic design are the same throughout, padding.

When a person asks for advice he should actually be willing to listen to it, and not choose the advice that fits their per-conceived notions.

It is nice to know that you know what I wanted. Unfortunately I need to break this train of thought of yours since you are ... wrong. First and foremost I asked for an opinion of those that used it, second, I asked for a generic opinion of those that might actually have an opinion -- I'm all for picking brains.


Listening to advice, evaluating it and making a decision based on all information available are 3 independent tasks.

I have heard two voices here on the topic of the harness:
a) it sucks, it is over-engineered, it has things that nobody needs....
b) I used it and I love it with some peppered “its seems ok..”

I think there were a few comments on Luna computer:
a) It sucks …
b) You don’t need it

Not too much on the regulator topic.

In your opinion, if I don’t follow the advice that means I came here with a preconceived notion in need of validation. Obviously when I posted the proposed setup I did some research, this thread was continuation of the research, not its validation. I do architecture, design and R&D engineering in IT world. I clearly understand what “over engineered” and “bad design” means. I also clearly get the difference between “need” and “want” which is why I ended up purchasing Mares Puck Air computer instead of Luna or Cobalt. Air Puck does not have the multi-stage capability, but I can live with that, and when I will need it, I will sell this on ebay and buy myself something more advanced. I was looking for Air integration and Nitrox … this one has both. For $299 Mares Puck Air looked attractive.

Back to the harness: right from the start, I did say that my preference is not only the functionality but comfort as well. And yes, for those that can’t understand what I’m saying – I’d rather stay comfortable for 95% of the time and get out earlier due additional drag than stay uncomfortable 100% of the time. To me, good padding and good shoulder fit seemed (as was confirmed by Ozwald) to be the right

In your reference to my “justification” of the "very expensive purchase" .. I posted my price in this thread. What I paid for the full setup beat LDS price on pretty much any reasonable setup – I posted discount I got a few pages back. My choice was to pay pennies on MSRP dollars for Scuba Pro or go with someone else and without any pay like everyone else…

Finally, I get the point of people not liking ScubaPro because of SP’s business practices… I get it… and I could not care less. In fact, as soon as I get a feeling of someone’s decision being affected by business practices of the company while I’m asking about the quality of the product – I’m done listening for objectivity is gone.

 

[BVickery]

Actually no. In the original post it was something the OP was "considering" therefore no "expensive purchase" was seeking validation. He was looking for "experience" with the mentioned product.

Personally i own both, a Halcyon BP rig and the SP form harness. I use both for different situations. I find my SP way more comfy both in and out of the water when in a drysuit and diving my steel twins. My Halcyon diving wet with a single or twin 80 AL.

Then again this is MY preference.

Sadly, my point still stands. People here cited a HUGE reason to avoid the SP delux harness in that the D-Rings are set where they are. You lose the biggest advantage of a BP/W since your now stuck to where SP decides it should be. People even then showed him that he was WAY overpaying for the SP haness when he could get the same one for almost $70 cheaper.

If he was truly listening to the advice given the non-moveable D-Rings should have nixed the SP harness right out of consideration. I had a DR Transpac and the default positions for the D-Rings on chest and waist were NO where ideal for me and had to move them a good bunch before they settled just right.

 

[arthurmnev]

Sadly, my point still stands. People here cited a HUGE reason to avoid the SP delux harness in that the D-Rings are set where they are. You lose the biggest advantage of a BP/W since your now stuck to where SP decides it should be. People even then showed him that he was WAY overpaying for the SP haness when he could get the same one for almost $70 cheaper.

If he was truly listening to the advice given the non-moveable D-Rings should have nixed the SP harness right out of consideration. I had a DR Transpac and the default positions for the D-Rings on chest and waist were NO where ideal for me and had to move them a good bunch before they settled just right.

1. If D rings fit in the right spot, why do I care about adjustments
2. You do realize that I paid about 40% of the MSRP (as in 60% off) right? The ONLY company I could get that discount on was SP...
3. As for BP/W setup -- I can swap wings between single and double setup without changing the rest; that is the reason why I went with BP/W, not to have a steel plate on my back with no padding

 

[Jim Lapenta]

of a thread.

 

[DevonDiver]

Back to the harness: right from the start, I did say that my preference is not only the functionality but comfort as well. And yes, for those that can’t understand what I’m saying – I’d rather stay comfortable for 95% of the time and get out earlier due additional drag than stay uncomfortable 100% of the time. To me, good padding and good shoulder fit seemed (as was confirmed by Ozwald) to be the right

Point being, you've received numerous advice stating that there are no 'comfort' issues inherent with the basic 'Pure' (hog-style) single-piece harnesses.

Your pre-conceived notion is that a single-piece harness isn't comfortable, or is 'less comfortable' than the more expensive one. People have tried to dispel your pre-conceptions on that matter, but seemingly failed.

It's not a coincidence that manufacturers name their expensive/over-engineered harnesses as 'Comfort'. To do so creates an implication that lesser priced harnesses are 'not comfortable'. Who doesn't want the most comfortable one? Hence... units are sold.

I've done 120+ minute dives in a 'basic' harness, carrying 4 cylinders and many lbs of ancillary equipment...whilst wearing thin wetsuit or even just rash guard. I also dive a 'basic' harness a day-to-day basis..3, 4 or 5 dives per day... teaching scuba courses, leading customer divers, long solo photo dives... every day... literally. Look at my avatar pic (left)... rash guard and basic/hog harness... there you go. Now, I like to be pampered as much as the next man, but.... No negative comfort issues, despite being loaded well in excess of anything a recreational diver is every going to imagine carrying and diving far, far, far more frequently and intensively than any recreational/non-pro diver.. I know the same is true for literally thousands of other cave and technical divers.

Nobody is telling you what to do.... but I see the signs that you've bitten right into the snake-oil marketing.