heard bad news while diving today

[*Floater*]

while out in sw florida diving today, we heard over the radio for a distress diver. Its seems he did a 100ft dive, came up threw a new tank on and within 15 minutes was back in the water, back down to 100ft, burned his air out then came right to the top. They called for a med flight and he was taken to Lee memorial in Ft Myers. With the radio going in and out, it was hard to hear the details, so mine might be sketchy. Anyone hear anything??

From your story it seems reckless, but if he did slow ascents and/or required deco (if necessary) and a clean profile to let the bubbles settle after the first dive, then I don't see the problem with a 15 min SI in and of itself.

Of course it sounds like he was going to NDL limits both dives (assuming lots of things - AL80 or bigger tank, square profiles, decent air consumption rate, etc.) or over and then came "right to the top" without safety or deco stops which would be dumb, but then again this may have nothing to do with his profile.

 

[Walter]

That's what I was looking for Rick. :thumbs_up:

Another one more related to a diver mainly for those in the States.

A person is having a serious medical problem but is still conscious. Say serious arterial bleeding.

You go over to them to help and they tell you to stay away and to not touch them. But you know if you don’t help of render some medical aid they will die within just a few minutes.

How would you handle this as a general citizen? How about a trained first responder?
How about a trained medical professional?

Gary D.

You do not render aid without consent. If they are unable to respond, you have implied consent.

 

[Dive-aholic]

That's what I was looking for Rick. :thumbs_up:

Another one more related to a diver mainly for those in the States.

A person is having a serious medical problem but is still conscious. Say serious arterial bleeding.

You go over to them to help and they tell you to stay away and to not touch them. But you know if you don’t help of render some medical aid they will die within just a few minutes.

How would you handle this as a general citizen? How about a trained first responder?
How about a trained medical professional?

Gary D.

You wait until they lose consciousness from the blood loss and then help, regardless of which level you're at. The only person that can make the determination of whether someone is competent to refuse care is a physician in a work environment. If the doc gives the word, then we just tie 'em down and treat!

 

[wreckchick]

My duty as a first responder is to ascertain if the person WANTS my help. If they don't I will still call 911 and try and get them to the next level of care, but if they look at me and say, "don't touch me" and I do it anyway, even after they lose consciousness, I have now violated the expressed, witnessed wishes of the patient.

Unconscious victims that can't respond to the original question give me implied consent to treat UNLESS they have made their wishes to deny treatment before losing consciousness. DNR order anyone?

R

You wait until they lose consciousness from the blood loss and then help, regardless of which level you're at. The only person that can make the determination of whether someone is competent to refuse care is a physician in a work environment. If the doc gives the word, then we just tie 'em down and treat!

 

[H2Andy]

My duty as a first responder is to ascertain if the person WANTS my help. If they don't I will still call 911 and try and get them to the next level of care, but if they look at me and say, "don't touch me" and I do it anyway, even after they lose consciousness, I have now violated the expressed, witnessed wishes of the patient.

Unconscious victims that can't respond to the original question give me implied consent to treat UNLESS they have made their wishes to deny treatment before losing consciousness. DNR order anyone?

very sensible approach, and one i copy

i wouldn't worry about a possible DNR order unless they have it taped to their shirt or something

 

[Walter]

My duty as a first responder is to ascertain if the person WANTS my help. If they don't I will still call 911 and try and get them to the next level of care, but if they look at me and say, "don't touch me" and I do it anyway, even after they lose consciousness, I have now violated the expressed, witnessed wishes of the patient.

Unconscious victims that can't respond to the original question give me implied consent to treat UNLESS they have made their wishes to deny treatment before losing consciousness. DNR order anyone?

R

So with this in mind, how do you justify your position with regard to diving?

Frankly, if I was to do the 'mask overboard' drill it would be because I couldn't think of any other way to stop someone from doing something very, very dangerous. I'll take my chances in court.

 

[dogtownmax]

I think Vance Cabral of Belize would want to plead his case on the scubaboard. He lost his lic to operate for 5 years for "letting" 4 divers leave his boat in dangerous circumstances. I don't know the details but it is tough to not "let" some fool do what the are hell bent on doing.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Isn't America wonderful?!?
...

er, when you say "America", are you referring to "Central America"? You realize that Belize is a seperate country from the USA, right?

 

[ClevelandDiver]

Ya,
and you would find yourself going with the mask if it was mine......although I believe in surface intervals.......

Sounds like fun, but I think an assualt charge trumps a mask toss when you try to explain it to a judge.

 

[Walter]

It might be difficult to prove a dive instructor was afraid of the water.

 

[ClevelandDiver]

It might be difficult to prove a dive instructor was afraid of the water.

It is the act of grabbing and hurling/pushing someone into the water against their will that will get you in trouble.

Resorting to physical confrontation as an adult with something to lose (freedom, your house, etc.) is not something to enter lightly. Ask a lawyer what can be considered assualt, you'd be suprised.

Even if someone else starts it, you could still be the one who gets in trouble. My brothers friend, a HUGE guy who benches over 400lbs, hit some scrawny drunken fool who started a fight with him. He only hit him once, but he did some damage. He was LUCKY to get away with court costs, medical bills, lawyer fees and some punitive damages totaling around $6000.

Serioulsy everyone jokes about putting the smack down on the fools who deserve it, but it can easily come back to mess your life up in a big way.