In the market for a BP+W. What should I know? And what products best fill my needs/preferences?

[stuartv]

I have 2 Deep Sea Supply back plates - one SS and one Kydex - and 1 Blue Reef SS back plate. The BR plate was on sale from LP for $50 and is normally $70, I think. Out of the 3 BPs I have, I use the BR plate about 95% of the time.

I had a DSS LCD 30 wing, too, but I sold it. I currently have 4 wings, I think. For single tank diving, I use a Hog 23. I sold the DSS wing after I got the Hog and have not missed the DSS wing in the slightest. I have or have had DSS, Hog, Dive Rite (x2), Halcyon, Oxycheq, and OMS wings. My favorites of them all are/have been the Hog and the Dive Rites. The DSS wing gave me good trim, but I didn't like the horseshoe shape. The Halcyon and Oxycheq wings don't give me the trim I want. I would need to use a tail weight with those. The OMS wing gives me good trim (without a tail weight), but it is also a horseshoe, which I don't prefer. The Hog and the DR wings (Rec EXP and Classic XT) give me good trim with no tail weight, they are the donut shape that I prefer, and they all provide zipper access to the bladder, so I can do a field repair of the bladder if I ever get a puncture or pinch flat.

I would encourage you to at least look at this setup before you make a decision:

DGX Custom - DGX Singles Harness / Backplate / Wing Package

$299 for a complete BP/W package. The wing is a relabeled Dive Rite Travel EXP wing, so it is good quality - at least, to my understanding. I have not held one in my hands.

For adding weights, I have a pair of these trim weight pockets and I like them a lot better than the XS Scuba pockets I used to use:

DGX Gears Trim Weight Pocket (each)

If you wanted to add all your weight to your rig, you COULD put a pair of these on each of your cam bands. 4 x weight pockets should easily hold all the weight you need. However, I'm betting you won't need as much weight as you think and you'll probably only need 2 of these weight pockets.

Lastly, all the BP/W packages I have seen come with standard "floppy" D-rings for the shoulder straps and waist belt. I started with those then eventually got some rigid D-rings to replace them with and I like them a lot better.

Rigid D-rings are cheap from here:

D-Rings, Belt Slides, and Clamps | Dive Gear Express®

So, if you order anything from DGX, you might add a few rigid D-rings to your order, so you'll have them to try out at some point. There are different kinds, so you have multiple options. I use the "Extra Large S/S Rigid D-ring" on my shoulder straps and the regular "S/S Rigid D-ring" on my waist belt.

 

[ronscuba]

....
I had a DSS LCD 30 wing, too, but I sold it. I currently have 4 wings, I think. For single tank diving, I use a Hog 23. I sold the DSS wing after I got the Hog and have not missed the DSS wing in the slightest. I have or have had DSS, Hog, Dive Rite (x2), Halcyon, Oxycheq, and OMS wings. My favorites of them all are/have been the Hog and the Dive Rites. The DSS wing gave me good trim, but I didn't like the horseshoe shape. The Halcyon and Oxycheq wings don't give me the trim I want. I would need to use a tail weight with those. The OMS wing gives me good trim (without a tail weight), but it is also a horseshoe, which I don't prefer. The Hog and the DR wings (Rec EXP and Classic XT) give me good trim with no tail weight, they are the donut shape that I prefer, and they all provide zipper access to the bladder, so I can do a field repair of the bladder if I ever get a puncture or pinch flat.

....

Lastly, all the BP/W packages I have seen come with standard "floppy" D-rings for the shoulder straps and waist belt. I started with those then eventually got some rigid D-rings to replace them with and I like them a lot better...

Nice post. Interesting about the wings. Goes to show wing design can affect trim and it's not just about capacity. I like that DSS offers 2 different models of wings with similar capacities, but shaped differently to fit trim needs.

Do you use a STA with the Dive Rite wings ?

With the D-rings, rigid make clipping easier because it is 90 degrees ?

 

[stuartv]

Nice post. Interesting about the wings. Goes to show wing design can affect trim and it's not just about capacity. I like that DSS offers 2 different models of wings with similar capacities, but shaped differently to fit trim needs.

Do you use a STA with the Dive Rite wings ?

With the D-rings, rigid make clipping easier because it is 90 degrees ?

My DR wings are both for doubles, so no STA. The Rec EXP wing is claimed (I guess) to be good for singles or doubles, but I have never used it for a single tank. I did do some pool time with a guy that had the Rec wing and was using it was an STA and a single tank. I think it looked way too big to use with a single tank.

Rigid D-rings make it easier to clip to because when I swipe a boltsnap without looking they never just fold back and I miss them. That happened a lot when I had "normal" (floppy) D-rings. My waist D-rings are 90 degrees, but the chest ones are not. DGX site is down for maintenance, but if you look at the link I posted and look at the "Extra Large" rigid D-ring, you'll see what I mean.

 

[MichaelMc]

There are also bent D rings which are the norm for the chest D's. They only lay down so far.

You can stiffen up your D-rings with big O-rings. My harness is Halcyon and the waist SPG D ring came with a large O ring that makes it stand up more but is not a stiff as the rigid D ring. The o-ring I got was ~44mm OD x 6mm from my hardware store, not the right thickness but two will stiffen up the D-ring a bit.

I got a rigid D ring to try an the right waist but did not like it as much.

 

[stuartv]

There are also bent D rings which are the norm for the chest D's. They only lay down so far.

You can stiffen up your D-rings with big O-rings. My harness is Halcyon and the waist SPG D ring came with a large O ring that makes it stand up more but is not a stiff as the rigid D ring. The o-ring I got was ~44mm OD x 6mm from my hardware store, not the right thickness but two will stiffen up the D-ring a bit.

I got a rigid D ring to try an the right waist but did not like it as much.

Do you have a picture of how to use the O-rings to stiffen up a D-ring?

 

[MichaelMc]

Do you have a picture of how to use the O-rings to stiffen up a D-ring?

It is just a big O-ring around the base of the D that gets pinched when you flatten the D toward the metal web retaining tri-glide. When not pushed on, the O-ring pushing back against that pinch returns the D-ring to a more stand up position.

The first one came with my ACB pocket, not sure if due to Halcyon or due to the shop. The second and third are from the hardware plumbing department ~44mm OD x 6mm, thicker would be better. The one on the tri-glide on the plate is not doing a good job as the webbing is pulled through the clip.

The SPG one on my other plate is shown as I pulled it out of my bin and after pushing down on the D to flatten it. More tension on that tri-glide and the inner tube bands tidying up the extra webbing length are keeping the webbing through that clip tighter.
When pressed the D's will go flat, but the o-ring returns them to a more stand up position when not pressed on. I did it as the SPG D on my non-ACB harness was always flat and hard to clip back off to. They work well.

 

[stuartv]

Thanks for the pics!

 

[geoff w]

...Questions:

2) Are padded straps worth it?

...Preferences:

• Would really like a dump valve on my shoulder. Previous BC had a dump valve on the bottom of the bladder and I always thought it was horribly inconvenient.
• Would like my BP+W to be able to carry 18 pounds (the BP can be included in this). I usually dive steel but when I dive aluminum I have 12 pounds in my pouches and 6 pounds in my trim pockets. I dive thick (10 mm farmer John) so I also have a DUI harness but I like to be able to at least split some of the weight between the two. Doesn't necessarily have to be a full 18 pounds on the BC (I can add more to my harness) but at least 10 pounds on there would be nice. Assuming this shouldn't be a problem since a lot of plates seem to be 6+ pounds.
• Don't want a huge wing. All I ever dive is single steel 80's/100's and single aluminum 80's so I don't need a ton of lift. I feel that a large wing would just get in the way.
• Like the option of D-rings around my waist. Know that BP+W's are pretty customizable so don't think this will be a problem but I often have to carry a lot of stuff (e.g., slates, transect tapes, etc.) and like the option of being able to clip it off on my waist with a carabiner. Would like the D-rings to be close to my center (rather than on the sides) on my waist.

With all that said...anyone have any brands/products that they would recommend I check out? Currently have no preference but have been looking at Dive Rite, DGX, and Deep Sea Supply. Maybe Halcyon? Budget is probably around $400-500 but I can bump it up if you think it's worth it. Cheaper would be better though. If I can get a quality $300 setup with everything I want that'd be great.

If all you're going to do is fall off a boat and swim around underwater, padded straps aren't needed. But if you're shore diving a lot, including long walks on trails, up and down stairs / paths, and trudging back and forth across big stretches of soft sandy beach, then yes, padded straps are most definitely worth it. Tech divers don't do any of this wearing multiple tanks so they don't care about padded shoulder straps

Most of the time you'll be diving horizontally in trim, so it's relatively easy to use the butt dump valve. If you're vertical, that's what the exhaust at the end of your inflator is for

You'll find you need less weight than your old BC. I started with a 35 lb lift DiveRite Voyager wing, which I use for diving dry. But if I'm diving wet (7mm full suit, hooded vest, HP80 steel tank) I'll usually dive with a 25 lb lift DiveRite Travel wing. Either would probably work fine for you, and the Voyager wing isn't that much bigger

You can add or remove D-rings to your heart's content. Start with the stock setup and adjust to suit your taste and diving needs. Unless you're diving with a group that requires a rigidly standardized configuration you can do whatever you want with D-rings and their placement. I've seen some scientific divers with lots of D-rings just to keep all their sample bags straight

You'll find as many options and preferences as gear manufacturers. I'm partial to DiveRite - really well made, fantastic customer service, extremely well thought out products for both technical and recreational use, and reasonably priced. If you have a budget and are buying new, Halcyon will probably be out of your price range

 

[barth]

If all you're going to do is fall off a boat and swim around underwater, padded straps aren't needed. But if you're shore diving a lot, including long walks on trails, up and down stairs / paths, and trudging back and forth across big stretches of soft sandy beach, then yes, padded straps are most definitely worth it. Tech divers don't do any of this wearing multiple tanks so they don't care about padded shoulder straps

I don't think this is true. For diving a cave or mine it can be challenging to go to the entrance/ water.

There is no reason to assume that divingspots for recdiving are easier to reach then spots for techdiving.

 

[halocline]

But if you're shore diving a lot, including long walks on trails, up and down stairs / paths, and trudging back and forth across big stretches of soft sandy beach, then yes, padded straps are most definitely worth it. Tech divers don't do any of this wearing multiple tanks so they don't care about padded shoulder straps

Cave divers do lengthy walks with multiple tanks all the time, at least BM doubles. The padded straps are totally unnecessary. Your wetsuit (or drysuit) provides plenty of padding for the straps. In fact, the plain webbing straps over a thick wetsuit might be better for carrying doubles because they're very stable. Either way it's no fun trudging up and down stairs and through the jungle with doubles on your back.

Now, if you were going on long walks on the beach (how romantic...) with a single tank and no wetsuit, definitely a padded harness would be nice for the walk.