Novice, Intermediate, Advanced

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Looking up dive sites in the keys and looking at some of the sites I see the terms Novice, Intermediate, Advanced. I'm curious at to what those terms mean I know what they gernerally mean but what makes a novice diver a novice. Is a novice considered a crash course diver that did the 3 hour class in the back of a building? Advanced meaning a veteran diver that went diving during a hurricane? I'm by no means a advance diver but I feel that I can control my self and understand whats going on to control any situation calmly. Here is the site I'm looking at:

Dive Sites Florida Keys

Reason I ask is because I really don't want to get into something that may be over my head (no pun intended) or something that I may not enjoy. I bet there is alot of people that get vly by training of diving and may be considered Novice is this true?

Looking at the link you listed...there are plenty of novice rated dives...do those. You are a novice by any definition if you have 0-24 dives. How many dives do you have?

If you go to the keys with someone who has a lot of experience in that area you may be able to do dives listed as intermediate if conditions are good.

Advanced for those particular dives seems to be more for the planning skills and how to handle conditions when conditions aren't perfect.

Otherwise novice, intermediate, and advanced have little meaning or rather it's so subjective and site dependent as to have little meaning.
 
It all depends on the diver. I did the Speigle Grove in three to four-footers and a stiff current with only 10 ocean dives under my belt with no problems and had a hell of a good time. Next person might need 50 to do the same thing or may never be able to do it at all. It's all subjective.

I also did a few intense dives as a Novice and survived. Did that make me an Adv diver? NO, it only means I did a dive that was Adv and I survived it without problems. Those kinds of dives move a diver up to Intermediate faster, but doing one dive doesn't make a person an Intermediate or Adv diver.
Just my 2 cents.

robin:D
 
Here's the way that I look at it:

Novice: Diving knowledge is minimal and solely 'textbook.' It does not connect decisions with actions and it ignores the context in which the action will be taken. The available suite of skills rigidly adhere to learned rules, other responses are not readily available. The possible use of knowledge for planning is without situational awareness and lacks discretionary judgment. The diver has available only rational decision making tools, nothing is intuitive or holistic. Individual actions are seen, and taken, in isolation with no conception of, or capability to deal with, complexity. Performance is unlikely to be satisfactory unless closely supervised.

Beginner: The diver has developed a working knowledge of key aspects of tasks and appreciates that complex diving situations exist. Since situational awareness is limited, all attributes, aspects and elements tend to be treated separately and given nearly equal importance. Though the diver begins to use the global characteristics of situations that are recognized from limited prior experience, problems are primarily solved by using rote guidelines for action that are based on situational attributes. The diver is starting to make rudimentary attempts to decide on appropriate actions in context, but is limited to applying actions as a series of learned predefined steps, and thus can not be expected to successfully resolve complex situations. Though supervision is needed for the accomplishment of the overall task, straightforward tasks likely to be completed to an acceptable standard and the beginner is able to achieve some steps using his or her own judgment.

Competent: The diver now has a good working knowledge of diving, as well as some background knowledge of diving, and as a result can deal with knowledge in context. Recognition of relevance is now present. Actions are seen, at least partly, in terms of longer-term goals. The diver is able to cope with simple, multiple, simultaneous, and competing inputs. The diver sees actions (at least partially) in terms of longer-term goals. The diver performs best with standardized and routine procedures, but is able to achieve many tasks using his or her own judgment, and can also engage in conscious and deliberate planning. Skills are fit for the purpose intended, though they may lack refinement.

Proficient: The diver posses a depth of understanding of the disciplines that make up diving, as well as those specific to diving. At this level the the diver is able to make a holistic assessment in context, rather than just an analytic one. The diver can deal with complex situations holistically, and decision-making is more confident. Performing to a fully acceptable standard is routine; as is seeing what is most important in a situation. Deviations from the normal pattern are quickly perceived. Decision-making is less labored. Though maxims may still be used for guidance, but there is an understanding that conclusions will (and should) vary according to the situation. The diver sees the overall 'picture' and how individual actions fit within it. The diver is able to take full responsibility for his or her own work (and that of others where and when applicable).

Expert: The diver is fully capable of making correct decisions on an intuitive basis. He or she no longer needs to rely on rules, guidelines or maxims, possessing an authoritative knowledge of the disciplines that make up diving that leads to a deep tacit understanding of, as well as a holistic and intuitive grasp of situations. In complex circumstances, the diver moves seamlessly between intuitive and analytical approaches, using analytic approaches solely in completely novel situations or when problems occur. The diver simultaneously sees the overall 'picture' and grasps alternative approaches. The diver is comfortable taking responsibility for going beyond existing standards and creating original interpretations using a vision of what is possible. Excellence is achieved with relative ease.

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Editorial comment:

There was a time when most certified divers were Competent, now they are usually at the level of a Novice, or less often not having progressed from that of a Beginner.

Similarly there was a time when becoming an instructor meant first being an Expert diver, today one is lucky to find an instructor who is even a Proficient diver, they are more often Competent sometimes actually Beginner. What is usually lacking is not the ability to do one of the "twenty skills," or even possessing adequate trim and buoyancy, what is missing are critical components of two items:
  1. the ability to make a holistic assessment in context, rather than just an analytic one.
  2. the reliance on maxims are for guidance, with little understanding that conclusions will (and should) vary according to the situation.
Unfortunately there are not specific courses in the recreational industry that correspond to these levels, I see a fair number of divers with impressive patch jackets that are have never progressed beyond Novice and I know more than a few Experts who have nothing more than the equivalent of an Open Water certification but who have had good mentoring through their career.
 
Just taking a quick look at the website it looks like they classify the novice dives as shallow reef dives (OW Cert).
The intermediate dives are either deeper (AOW Cert.)or shallow with wrecks.
The advanced are deep with wrecks.

I'm sure that some of the classification will differ because of current, viz, or topography (because you have to keep in mind the constant depth changes)
 
A novice diver is someone who is just starting to dive and is just starting to learn about diving
An intermediate diver is someone who has been diving for a while and has learned quite a lot about diving.
An advanced diver is someone who has been diving for a while and is just starting to learn about diving.

Would not intermediate and advanced be switched in the definitions?
 
Would not intermediate and advanced be switched in the definitions?

Nope.

One mark of an expert over someone who is more of a dilettante is that the expert is very aware of shortcomings and limits of their knowledge and ability where the dilettante incorrectly assumes some level of mastery.

By way of allegory, I've studied martial arts for many, many years. In general:

The typical lower belt students are always asking questions and seeking to improve their skills.

The typical advanced belt students are always trying to teach and making claims about the art which are quite demonstrative of their ignorance to those with more knowledge.

Those holding master titles are always asking questions and seeking to improve their skills.

Experts have earned humility.
 
Would not intermediate and advanced be switched in the definitions?

The point is that a good diver will never grow complacent and assume they know everything. It takes most divers a little experience to realize that they do not know everything.
 
Nope.

One mark of an expert over someone who is more of a dilettante is that the expert is very aware of shortcomings and limits of their knowledge and ability where the dilettante incorrectly assumes some level of mastery.

By way of allegory, I've studied martial arts for many, many years. In general:

The typical lower belt students are always asking questions and seeking to improve their skills.

The typical advanced belt students are always trying to teach and making claims about the art which are quite demonstrative of their ignorance to those with more knowledge.

Those holding master titles are always asking questions and seeking to improve their skills.

Experts have earned humility.

I agree that a good diver is learning on every dive, but I would change it to read an intemediate diver has been diving a while, but doesn't think he needs to learn more, and an advanced diver has been diving a while and 1) realizes how much he has yet to learn, and 2) learns from every diving experience
 
Looking up dive sites in the keys and looking at some of the sites I see the terms Novice, Intermediate, Advanced. I'm curious at to what those terms mean I know what they gernerally mean but what makes a novice diver a novice. Is a novice considered a crash course diver that did the 3 hour class in the back of a building? Advanced meaning a veteran diver that went diving during

  • Novice: "What's the big deal about diving? How hard could it be? I jump in, go down, swim around and come back."
  • Intermediate: "Holy S***! I could have died down there!"
  • Advanced: "Swim into that dark hole with one tank, no line and an unknown buddy?" "No thanks."
Terry
 
I agree that a good diver is learning on every dive, but I would change it to read an intemediate diver has been diving a while, but doesn't think he needs to learn more, and an advanced diver has been diving a while and 1) realizes how much he has yet to learn, and 2) learns from every diving experience

Aphorisms need be pithy
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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