Online Dive Vendors/Dealers

[cyklon_300]

A lot of emphasis is being placed on the 'value' of having a warranty. In the 20+ years I've been purchasing dive equipment, I have had exactly ONE item that was defective at purchase or failed within a time period covered by a warranty.

A faulty reg was replaced on warranty, but the replacement took 6 weeks to arrive and I purchased a new reg (online) to use for an upcoming liveaboard vacation. The defective item could have probably been repaired locally for $50 in a few hours, but the required warranty process dictated shipping it back to the mfg (instead of getting one from the LDS inventory and letting them work out the details) and then waiting as the mfg moved at glacial speed in sending me a new piece.

With that track record, I don't see a compelling reason to pay a premium price for the perceived luxury of having a warranty.

The bottom line is the bottom line...I find the best deal and go for it.

 

[one90proof]

I am new to the sport and am getting ready to purchase complete setups for both myself and my daughter. I know I can make purchases cheaper online but there is much value in the help I recieve from the owner/staff of my LDS. As a new diver, I appreciate their experience and assistance in choosing the right gear for my daughter and I.

That being said, I have no problem going online for items that can't be found at the LDS due to limited selection such as t-shirts, stickers, etc.

An added bonus of shopping the LDS is the opportunity to talk diving for a while and meet awesome folks. In the past month I have met several great folks at the LDS that may become future dive buddies. The SCUBA Experience is much greater at the brick and mortar shop and I keep this in mind when comparing prices.

-Craig

 

[Boater Dan]

I have previously stayed away from this controversy in the past, but now is my time to speak. I absolutely DO recognize the value of the LDS. They are there for service, classes, air, advice, seeing and touching the product, and the fact that they own the quarry where I do my local diving. But, there is a factor for that service. I consider 10 to 15% to be for the value added. Not necessarily my LDS, but I have seen 50%+ differences in price within other shops. I feel that is too much of a variance. If a shop can be competitive, I will support them. I need them if I wish to continue to dive locally.

What bothered me was I got the impression that buying "used" equipment on E-bay, qualified as buying on-line. Sorry, but not in my mind!

 

[RichLockyer]

A lot of emphasis is being placed on the 'value' of having a warranty. In the 20+ years I've been purchasing dive equipment, I have had exactly ONE item that was defective at purchase or failed within a time period covered by a warranty.

My buddy and I bought a pair of Aries Voyager DPVs.
After the first dive, we noticed condensation in the LED status window of his scooter, and it felt just a little more negative than mine.

It did have a bad seal, and it was exchanged, no questions asked.
We had bought them online from Diver's Supply, but before making the purchase, we called Aries and confirmed that a) DS was an authorized dealer and b) they had no issues with the internet sale (for $1600).
They were so "okay" with it that they even agreed to drop-ship the scooters directly to my buddy's office, which saved them a trip to Florida and back (Aries is in Ca in the bay area, we're near LA).

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

I'm curious. If the MFGs dictate prices, as LDSs are so quick to point out, why can one LDS I know of offer 20% discounts across the board to anyone employed by a certain local company? This is a straight discount on sales, not an exchange for training.

Pardon my vagueness, I don't want the LDS to get in trouble, or the employees to loose their discount.

IMHO, I tend to agree with the above poster, that minimum sales figures and price-setting by MFRs are issues for the MFR/LDS, not the consumer. I'm not sure, but they may also be issues for the Fair Trade Commission...

In the Internet age, many businesses have had to adapt or go under. The MFRs need to wake up to the new world. It's not unusual for a company to go under because it failed to embrace changing economic conditions.

WRT to the "what will you do when there is no LDS..." question. I say that it will be a sad day. I enjoy wandering around the LDS and drooling on the gear. But, should that day come, someone will step in to fill the gap. I know that there are currently dive instructors that do not operate through a LDS. When it comes to local expertise, LDSs can't even come close to the expertise available on this site (and ones like it). Besides, long ago I realized that dive shop employees don’t know diving, and I have stopped gong to two LDSs because they belittle any gear that they don’t sell. Where are you going to go for air? Some enterprising individual will buy tanks and a compressor. Last minute purchases? Divers might actually have to plan a dive and look over their gear periodically.

Here’s an idea... I read on another post (regarding the failures of the cert. agencies) about a 'dive club' mentality, where people learn to dive under the supervision of mentors. If such volunteer dive clubs taught regulator servicing and bought compressors...

I’ve known people who formed a food co-op, just to get groceries at wholesale. When I was part of a volunteer alpine SAR we consolidated our orders to get volume discounts on outdoor gear. Why can’t dive clubs do this with SCUBA gear?

Please don't think I want all LDSs to go under. But the industry WILL change. That’s guaranteed. A free market society (myself included) will not pay 50% more just to support an outdated business philosophy. I hope the MFRs are listening.

 

[O2Addict]

This topic comes up time and time again.

I think it depends on the service you get and want. To an online retailer you will be a statistic, you need to rely on their warantee and it may take time to get a replacement.

With your LDS you pay extra but get better service, which is realy what you are paying for. Plus you can try gear out etc. However not all LDS's are good, I was in one in FL last week looking at compasses, and I wanted to hold the compass, see how the bezel turned and the mounting worked etc. so i asked the store owner if I could take the unit out of the desplay case, and he told me no, if I wanted to hold it he could get one down from the stock room, but only if I was going to buy it!! The attitude was really arrogant, I felt like I was not welcome in the store, so I purchased what I needed, and didn't bother getting anything else. (BTW. The place was http://www.divers-discount.com it is an online retailer and LDS in one, so that is probably why instore service was so bad)

My advice is if you want to go try out gear, see what is best and get good advice, buy from an LDS, but make sure you find a friendly one!!! If you know exactly what you want, then get it from an online retailer you will save money.

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

This topic comes up time and time again.

Yet never gets resolved.

I think it depends on the service you get and want. To an online retailer you will be a statistic, you need to rely on their warantee and it may take time to get a replacement..

Unfortunately good customer service is a thing of the past. To the LDS you may not be a statistic, but in my experience, they usually just see $$.

With your LDS you pay extra but get better service, which is realy what you are paying for. Plus you can try gear out etc. However not all LDS's are good, I was in one in FL last week looking at compasses, and I wanted to hold the compass, see how the bezel turned and the mounting worked etc. so i asked the store owner if I could take the unit out of the desplay case, and he told me no, if I wanted to hold it he could get one down from the stock room, but only if I was going to buy it!! The attitude was really arrogant, I felt like I was not welcome in the store, so I purchased what I needed, and didn't bother getting anything else.

This attitude is very common in LDSs. One LDS owner told me that he's bought a shrink wrap machine so that customers won't be able to look through the books before buying them, while Barnes and Noble is installing coffee bars and comfy chairs...

Getting expertise and trying out gear at the LDS is a fantasy.

 

[RichLockyer]

I'm curious. If the MFGs dictate prices, as LDSs are so quick to point out, why can one LDS I know of offer 20% discounts across the board to anyone employed by a certain local company? This is a straight discount on sales, not an exchange for training.

Some manufacturers allow it, others don't.
A local sporting goods store with a large dive section offers 10% discounts on non-sale merchandise to members of the dive club, and that 10% is within the limits of ALL of their vendors (except for AL80s, which are a loss-leader at $105).

Every now and then, they'll put a 25% discount coupon in a mailer, and the coupon specifically excluses SeaQuest equipment. IIRC, 20% off of MSRP is the max discount that SeaQuest will allow. This shop is normally 10%-15% down, so the dive club discount is the max they can allow on SeaQuest.
Scubapro and Halcyon have similar policies, as do others.

 

[pasley]

I'm curious. If the MFGs dictate prices, as LDSs are so quick to point out, why can one LDS I know of offer 20% discounts across the board to anyone employed by a certain local company? This is a straight discount on sales, not an exchange for training. ...

Actually the MFGs dictate floor price (prices below which you may not sell). I agree some LDS charge too much, so I don't shop there.

I’ve known people who formed a food co-op, just to get groceries at wholesale. When I was part of a volunteer alpine SAR we consolidated our orders to get volume discounts on outdoor gear. Why can’t dive clubs do this with SCUBA gear?

I have often wondered that myself. Dive stores could also do the same like the IGF (Independent Grocers Federation) and more favorably compete against the chain stores.

Please don't think I want all LDSs to go under. But the industry WILL change. That’s guaranteed. A free market society (myself included) will not pay 50% more just to support an outdated business philosophy. I hope the MFRs are listening.

Agreed.

 

[RichLockyer]

I have often wondered that myself. Dive stores could also do the same like the IGF (Independent Grocers Federation) and more favorably compete against the chain stores.

Limited distribution ensures that this cannot happen. Out in BFE, you might have two dive shops... one sells Scubapro and one sells SeaQuest. It's a limited market, and even with multiple dealers, there isn't enough business available to make it work.
In more metro areas like LA you still run into distribution limitations, but in larger markets, we have larger sporting goods stores taking as much or more business away from the LDS as online stores, while offering little in the way of expertise and true service/value.