Only one type of gear? Why limit yourself?

[lv2dive]

The concept of "the right tool for the job" meaning, backmount, side mount, and/or rebreather, and inclusive of multiple variations (different harnesses, wings, BPs, tank sizes, etc) is all well and and good for those who are diving reagularly and can afford it.

OTOH, the "right tool for the job" for people who dive less frequently and/or may be on a limited budget, may be one configuration...

And I imagine the strong feelings invoked in this thread come from what appears to be being suggested by the article/blog, that the second category mentioned above *should* be buying more kit. Although I fall into the first category above, I was rather puzzled by the thoughts expressed - I don't think the majority of divers NEED to be in that category.

 

[The Chairman]

I think you're trying to read waaaaaay more into my post than is actually there.

Dude, I think you're reading 'waaaaaay more' into his post than is actually there. You've come at him like a pissed off bull dog on steroids and wonder why he's taken aback? Dial it down about twenty notches. You're giving forums and divers a bad name. It's like reading GI3 and I'm expecting you to call him a stroke at any moment.

@NWGratefulDiver and @Richard FDC ... Before the turn of the century, Dive Shops were the primary arbiters of information about diving. It was often used as a reward for buying gear or training. Today, Google has become the information gate keeper and ScubaBoard is one of her favorite children when it comes to Scuba. Ask any question and you're bound to get many diverse answers. Probably, one of those answers is even correct, especially for you. There are a lot of strong opinions presented as fact. Just read johnnyc's rantings in this thread to see that. Someone had the temerity to express a philosophy that differs from his and he feels the need to launch the Scuba Inquisition. He terms it "calling him out", but for what? Having an opinion? Having an opinion different from what he approves as being suitable? The point is, there are a number of people, including shop owners and users on forums, who feel that you have to be stupid to not follow their advice. They ascribe to the "If I don't sell, teach or dive it, then it must be crap" mentality. They often follow up with a "if you don't agree with me, you must be crap too!" The internet disagrees with them.

 

[Richard FDC]

OK...Where do we start here? First of all let's have a round of applause for creating a discussion that has inspired passion. Then another round of applause for the those who have conducted themselves in a civil and reasonable manner. Disagreement is not bad but personal attacks, back peddling, and denial makes you sound like a politician and I've got better things to do than respond to that behavior. I believe my premise can be easily defended but agree that it's a big world and people have different needs. Sometimes economy or efficiency dictates compromise. That's why we have all those strange bubble-like vehicles today that are part mini-van, part sports car, part truck, etc. Ideally we would have a sports car to go fast and have fun, a pickup for when we need to haul things, a mini-van to take the kids to the game, a luxury sedan for dinner and the theater, and a jeep to go off road. Very few of us can afford all that so we compromise and buy one or two vehicles that will fit multiple needs. Most of us do the same with SCUBA gear and that's OK. What I do find curious is that so many people are so angry that I'm suggesting divers have multiple sets of gear (although many posters agree that they own multiple sets) In this materialistic world we live in today there is a TV in every room, a smart phone in every purse, a laptop and a tablet in every briefcase and even appliances to remove jar lids in the kitchen. People are getting mad at me for suggesting somebody buy more dive gear?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! LOL Those evil local dive shops might make more money! More LOL Here's the premise of the article and you can agree or disagree and you can attack me for writing it. Keep an open mind and look at the big picture. I think one of the ad hominem attacks was something about me calling somebody a "stroke." That person obviously doesn't know me because that's very funny. I cannot stand the rigid thinking that dictates there is one equipment configuration and one way and only one way to do something in diving. Here's a quote from me that will probably upset more people: "If Jacques Cousteau were DIR we'd all still be diving double hose regulators." Innovation is good. Being open minded and trying new things is good. I'll stand by my assertion that sidemount is just another tool in the tool box and is not perfect for every dive and every diver. I'm not a fan of jacket style BCDs. I mentioned them in an earlier post and somebody attacked their use. I sort of agree but guess what? I've met people who refuse to teach an openwater class in anything but a jacket style BCD and that's their prerogative. It's a free country. I use tech gear because it just makes sense. (Read my article about it I shared somewhere in here) I have a couple different backplate and harness systems and a few wings. I can dive a single tank or doubles. I can have a single bladder donut wing or a dual bladder horeshoe when I need it. I also have a sidemount rig because different dives truly do require different gear. Out of economy or efficiency you can make one gear set work in a wide variety of situations. That's OK and it's what most divers do. I choose to have more specific tools suited for the job at hand. Not every diver needs a sidemount rig. Not every diver needs double 108s with a dual bladder wing and 94 pounds of lift. Choose what's right for you and when somebody says, "This is the way and the only way." Please do yourself the favor of getting as engaged in that conversation as you have in this thread.

 

[Richard FDC]

Thanks Pete. Well said BTW the irony of this is that I was on TV this weekend in a sidemount rig! OMG!!!!!!

 

[The Chairman]

Camera whore!

As a caveat, Richard and I are great friends and both have an odd position in the Dive Industry and community, in that we are professional marketers. Do we want to see the Scuba industry, including the LDS's succeed? You betcha! We want to see the industry grow far more than it has and much of what we write is geared towards that. FWIW, Richard is about as open minded to various modes of diving as I have seen. Do I feel a need to defend a friend? A bit, but he can obviously hold his own. No, we aren't coordinating our answers. We don't need to since we think a lot a like. Go figure!

 

[Patoux01]

From your article

For the individual diver sidemount only is limiting and can make diving less enjoyable. We can all agree that there is added safety in having two tanks but, for many dives, it isn't necessary or appropriate. The additional gear is cumbersome and takes much longer to set up than a simple single tank rig.

So i'm not too sure what I'm doing in my profile picture... Probably not diving... And that tank is not on my side I guess... And my rig is not a sidemount rig either. (hint: sarcasm)

Not all wrecks lie perfectly vertical

For wreck diving, where two tanks may be needed, back mounted doubles are quicker and easier to use on a boat and they're usually better for swimming through the narrow corridors of sunken ships.

Yes, sure, the corridor will be a bit annoying if the ship lies vertical... but what if the ship is lying on a side? Then it's the backmount diver that's in trouble (as those narrow corridors now become large low-ceiling areas)



So yeah, makes me think of that stupid article that has been praised a few months ago, written by a GUE instructor (I think), which was completely off. I think that instructor was pretty known. This thing here.

 

[Richard FDC]

Camera whore!

As a caveat, Richard and I are great friends

Now you've done it! There goes your reputation!

 

[The Chairman]

Then it's the backmount diver that's in trouble

Probably not. Tanks on your back don't make you as "thick" as tanks on the side make you "wide". In the Keys, we call side mount, wide mount. Can you side mount here in the Keys? If you choose. It's def not my first choice for most boats here in the Keys depending on their ladders and especially in pitching seas. I'm glad I'm not constrained to either modality but am free to choose. Even my choice of rebreather was largely influenced by it's ability to go either way. I want to be able to pick the best tool for the job as I see it.

As I see it.

That doesn't mean it's the same choice for you. Your experience will be different. Some by a little and some by a lot. That's the beauty of a forum. The average user can read all of the responses and choose the one that would seem to work for them. If it doesn't, they learn to modify how they read particular responses. What a boring forum if we all agreed.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Geez Louise ... if we all agreed on everything this place would be boring.

Maybe a better idea would be to disagree without taking the comments so personally (or else come join The Pub where we hang our emotions out there like laundry on a clothesline).

Diving's supposed to be fun. And as long as you're having fun who cares what gear you're using. Someone asked for an example of when a jacket-style BCD is appropriate. I'll give you one ... when the person using it is doing a recreational dive, loves their gear, and is having a great time. Nothing could be more appropriate.

I'll be diving one or both of my sidemount rigs tomorrow for recreational open water dives. Do I care that somebody else might think it's inappropriate? Not really ... I'm not diving with him, and he's not doing the same kind of dives I am. I can assure you that I'll have a great time ... and that the gear is totally appropriate for me, and for the circumstances. Otherwise I'd be using one of the other rigs hanging in my garage.

A lot of times these perspectives are based purely on the fact that we're diving in different environments, and/or with a different set of personal preferences. What someone else might see as a drawback, I might see as a benefit. So we disagree ... the exchange of perspectives can sometimes make the conversation more interesting ... if we let it.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Richard FDC]

From your article

So i'm not too sure what I'm doing in my profile picture... Probably not diving... And that tank is not on my side I guess... And my rig is not a sidemount rig either. (hint: sarcasm)

Not all wrecks lie perfectly vertical

Yes, sure, the corridor will be a bit annoying if the ship lies vertical... but what if the ship is lying on a side? Then it's the backmount diver that's in trouble (as those narrow corridors now become large low-ceiling areas)



So yeah, makes me think of that stupid article that has been praised a few months ago, written by a GUE instructor (I think), which was completely off. I think that instructor was pretty known. This thing here.

There is an interesting phenomenon in this thread- the belief that I'm espousing one rigid concept or attacking sidemount and that is just not true. I think this may be the reason. Over the last few years we have seen sidemount come on very strong. This has created sidemount divers who have sort of become sidemount Nazis. I cannot tell you how many times I've been asked, "Why aren't you diving sidemount?" and having sidemount divers almost ridicule me for diving backmounted doubles. I think sidemount divers may feel (wrongly) that I'm attacking sidemount. I'm not. What I'm saying is that it is not the ideal gear choice for every dive and every diver. Here's an example. Many years ago a friend and I were diving the Vandenburg off Key west and we were planning deco dives. I used backmounted double LP steel 85s and carried a 40 with O2. My friend chose sidemount and slung an 02 bottle as well. I stepped off the boat and was ready to dive. The seas were a little rough and my friend kept me waiting being bounced around while he got his sidemount in order in the water (A more experienced sidemount diver may not have done that) The Vandenburg sits nicely upright in about 145 FSW and we spent most of our dive inside. My buddy's "widemount" was annoying for pretty much the whole dive. It was just too wide to move easily through the narrow corridors and he was either diving at an angle, scraping the sides, or both. My little set of double 85s were efficient and compact. I went through the wreck with ease. IMHO they were a much better choice than sidemount. Now, here's another example: Jug Hole or Blue Hole in Ichetucknee Springs State Park in North Florida. This is a "sidemount only" cave dive. Yes, you can do it in other configurations but sidemount is best. To dive it without sidemount you have to use a single tank with an H valve. The bedding plain at the entrance is so low that with a single tank you have to angle your body to have enough room to get through. Then the restriction comes up where you have to roll over on your back and let the tank slide between the rocks. Can you do this dive without sidemount? Yes you can. Is a single tank the best choice? No it isn't. A couple months ago I did the dive in sidemount and just zipped right through. Sidemount was the appropriate choice for that dive. That's why I have multiple sets of gear. My article doesn't say sidemount divers are not divers or that nobody should use sidemount. It says that different types of gear work better in different situations and I personally think it's a good idea to match the gear to the dive. And let's spark more controversy by hitting on a "third rail" issue. For the people arguing about spending money, what's your life worth? Don't you want the best life support equipment you can have? That statement is sure to get things stirred up. I don't like it when something like that is said but it does come up. Take care of your gear and it will take care of you. Get the best gear you can afford. Learn how to use it well. Dive within the limits of your training and experience, and most of all, HAVE FUN! Even you sidemount divers ;-) LOL