This may be part of the problem with some folks just straping on a pony. When we carry a stage or decompression bottle it is as pug said charged and turned off. The reg is banded to the bottle and maybe out of view (stowed neatly and out of the way). Having the tank off does a couple of things for us. First, it prevents gas loss. Having the valve off also helps make sure switching to that tank a deliberate act. With multiple regs from multiple tanks it wouldn't be hard to be mistaken about which one your breathing from. The procedure for switching gas/regs ensures we have the right one.
Pony bottle configuration
- Thread starter Wreck/Tec
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This may be part of the problem with some folks just straping on a pony. When we carry a stage or decompression bottle it is as pug said charged and turned off. The reg is banded to the bottle and maybe out of view (stowed neatly and out of the way). Having the tank off does a couple of things for us. First, it prevents gas loss. Having the valve off also helps make sure switching to that tank a deliberate act. With multiple regs from multiple tanks it wouldn't be hard to be mistaken about which one your breathing from. The procedure for switching gas/regs ensures we have the right one.
MASS-Diver
Contributor
So, should a pony ALWAYS be turned off untill you need it?
What if the gas in the pony is the same as the backgas being used? For shallow dives is it OK to have it turned on all the time?
What if the gas in the pony is the same as the backgas being used? For shallow dives is it OK to have it turned on all the time?
There is a large difference, IMO, between a "pony" and "deco stage". The pony is strickly an emergency device that implies "immediate" use. As long as the unit doesn't freeflow, it should be left on. If it freeflows, it should be fixed or left behind. IF you are carrying a pony, it should be filled with whatever you are diving with as it could be used at depth.
As has already been stated, a deco tank is NOT for emergency use, may have multiple levels of tanks and O2%, and are used at predefined times.
Leave pony on, charge and turn off stage.
MD
Rich I missed your post... I wasn't just ignoring you.
Keeping in mind that the best pony bottle mount (imo) is the ebay mount... Mike and your own personal experience with freeflows gave you the reasons why the pony reg should be charged and then left off.
I think what your LDS did was reprehensible and I hope that you can find a decent shop... if you haven't yet... start looking... these folks are the unsafe divers imo with their hysteria. Pehaps they should take up a *safer* sport than scuba.
You shouldn't depend upon a pony and wouldn't need to if you had a good buddy and good buddy skills. The pony is a solution to a problem that shouldn't exist and causes more problems.
Detuning the regulator so you can leave your bottle on without a chance of freeflow is more of the same non-sense.
If anything is detuned it should be the backup second stage necklaced and hanging under your chin.
You folks that use back mounted ponies...where do you secure your pony second stage?
MASS-Diver
Contributor
Not be a smart a**, but, if I'm not supposed to be depending on my pony (since my buddies is there) why not leave the reg on since a free flow won't be the end of the world anyways?
Is this a question of a not forming bad habits (in terms of gas exchanges)?
I think there a level of diving where a pong stage is acceptable. I don't see anything non-dir or unsafe about the 40cu I carry slung. It's alot of air (at 100' or shallower) and adds redundancy to my rig. It can also (unilke a double tank) be passed off to an OOA diver after the situation is under control (first you donate your primary then give the OOA the stage). Of course, only if you have practiced in advance.
Skilled divers who practice should be able to deal with an OOA event on instinct, but, once the immediate problem is solved and you're sitting on the bottom sharing air, you then have to swim back to the anchor line and ascend (still, at the least, making a saftey stop), while a 7' hose can make this easier, it's pretty nice to be able to hand someone a 40cu bottle and ascend unteathered espcially if ocean conditions are rough.
For dives a 100' and shallower where one may not be accumalating enough bottom time to justify double tanks, a 40cu stage, IMO, can serve a role.
That said, I'm shopping for doubles right now, and, as a bonus, I'm already very comforatable carrying a stage.
Is this a question of a not forming bad habits (in terms of gas exchanges)?
I think there a level of diving where a pong stage is acceptable. I don't see anything non-dir or unsafe about the 40cu I carry slung. It's alot of air (at 100' or shallower) and adds redundancy to my rig. It can also (unilke a double tank) be passed off to an OOA diver after the situation is under control (first you donate your primary then give the OOA the stage). Of course, only if you have practiced in advance.
Skilled divers who practice should be able to deal with an OOA event on instinct, but, once the immediate problem is solved and you're sitting on the bottom sharing air, you then have to swim back to the anchor line and ascend (still, at the least, making a saftey stop), while a 7' hose can make this easier, it's pretty nice to be able to hand someone a 40cu bottle and ascend unteathered espcially if ocean conditions are rough.
For dives a 100' and shallower where one may not be accumalating enough bottom time to justify double tanks, a 40cu stage, IMO, can serve a role.
That said, I'm shopping for doubles right now, and, as a bonus, I'm already very comforatable carrying a stage.
Short version:
Because you don't need it so don't take it.
Medium version:
Because you don't want to expect that it is available and then find out that it isn't and waste time getting the proper OOA procedure going.
Longer version:
Because if you have it you will futz around with it... instead of just doing the correct OOA procedure and air-sharing ascent. No need to try and figure out which regulator to hand off... long hose or pony reg?? No need after handing off the long hose and going to the bungeed backup to start fiddling with unclipping... handing off pony... OOA receiving and then trying to secure the pony.... switching from long hose to pony regulator... handing long hose back to donor... donor re-stowing long hose and switching back.... ect...
RICHinNC
Contributor
Pug, no sweat....I was married for 26 1/2 years...I am used to being ignored!!!!!
I view the pony bottle as a "last ditch" back up. Most of my dives are done with people I dont know and have never dived with before. Not having a regular dive buddy, I am the guy on the boat that always asks can he just follow along with another buddy pair.
My job keeps me on the road about 8 months out of the year, and yes.... I actually do drag my gear around with me when I am on the road.....so having a constant dive buddy isnt realistic.
what I see about 99% of the time on a dive is the pair I end up tagging a long with hasnt a clue where the other is. They are just about always more than "one breath away" from each other.
A combination of 20+ years of military training...and....being in my 50's and wanting to make it to my 60's.....makes me plan for the absolute worse and be prepared for it. I am a big believer in redundancy, practice, and accepting responsibility.
As for finding another dive shop....well....you probably know as well as i do that gear manufacturers control what the shops sell. If a shop carries one brand...they are not carrying some other....so as far as gear maintenance goes...I am stuck. It is basically a case of.....he has been diving all his life and I have not ...so how could I be right and he be wrong.
and, to the question of where is the pony bottle mounted...I have a SeaQuest Pro QD and the Ponease mount is a swing clasp type mount that grasps the tank strap and locks down. I have it on the right side of the tank, valve down. The second stage is located within the triangle. Those I dive with are briefed that I use the Air Source and in an emergency I will pass my primary and switch to the Air Source.
I am going up to the Eatontown NJ area for three months...anyone know any good shops to visit and sign up for dives at>>>??
I view the pony bottle as a "last ditch" back up. Most of my dives are done with people I dont know and have never dived with before. Not having a regular dive buddy, I am the guy on the boat that always asks can he just follow along with another buddy pair.
My job keeps me on the road about 8 months out of the year, and yes.... I actually do drag my gear around with me when I am on the road.....so having a constant dive buddy isnt realistic.
what I see about 99% of the time on a dive is the pair I end up tagging a long with hasnt a clue where the other is. They are just about always more than "one breath away" from each other.
A combination of 20+ years of military training...and....being in my 50's and wanting to make it to my 60's.....makes me plan for the absolute worse and be prepared for it. I am a big believer in redundancy, practice, and accepting responsibility.
As for finding another dive shop....well....you probably know as well as i do that gear manufacturers control what the shops sell. If a shop carries one brand...they are not carrying some other....so as far as gear maintenance goes...I am stuck. It is basically a case of.....he has been diving all his life and I have not ...so how could I be right and he be wrong.
and, to the question of where is the pony bottle mounted...I have a SeaQuest Pro QD and the Ponease mount is a swing clasp type mount that grasps the tank strap and locks down. I have it on the right side of the tank, valve down. The second stage is located within the triangle. Those I dive with are briefed that I use the Air Source and in an emergency I will pass my primary and switch to the Air Source.
I am going up to the Eatontown NJ area for three months...anyone know any good shops to visit and sign up for dives at>>>??
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I'm a solo diver most of the time and carry a AL40 staged rigged with EANX32 as a pony. 40" hose bunge'd to the tank and standard SPG w/6" hose.
Seems to work just fine.
In ref. to the above posts and just to cause $hit...
"just say NO to spearfishing on SCUBA!"
been spearfishing for 13yrs and wouldn't be caught dead with a tank on my back with a gun in my hand. Can't belive people still do that.
Willer
Seems to work just fine.
In ref. to the above posts and just to cause $hit...
"just say NO to spearfishing on SCUBA!"
been spearfishing for 13yrs and wouldn't be caught dead with a tank on my back with a gun in my hand. Can't belive people still do that.
Willer
Tank
Guest
My disclaimer:
I am a novice diver (OW, ADV, EANX), and I would like to start phasing into tek diving wrecks. This question might sound rediculous to some, but my conclusions are based more on logic than experience at this point. Please no flaming!
The question:
I would like to become as streamlined as possible while still maintaining some level of redundancy. I usually dive with a buddy, but as we all know, a buddy is "only one breath away" in a perfect world. So I have entertained the idea of a pony, but dislike the idea of extra hoses. Here is my proposed configuration:
My percieved advantages to this setup are: no extra hoses to get snagged on the wreck, loss of primary air will still allow for a BC inflate on emergency acent, long 2nd stage hose facilitates buddy breathing while I breathe off the BC inflator, mount a compass on other wrist and eliminate console.
Possible caveat:
I live in FL and frequent the ops in West Palm and the keys. I was told that most ops would not let me on the boat with this setup because there is a requirement to have an octo on the primary air source. The reason for this is because apparantly people become lazy and do not take their ponys, claiming they used it and forgot to fill it, etc. (bs if you ask me). I don't know how true this is, but I would appreciate all comments and opinions!!
TIA,
I am a novice diver (OW, ADV, EANX), and I would like to start phasing into tek diving wrecks. This question might sound rediculous to some, but my conclusions are based more on logic than experience at this point. Please no flaming!
The question:
I would like to become as streamlined as possible while still maintaining some level of redundancy. I usually dive with a buddy, but as we all know, a buddy is "only one breath away" in a perfect world. So I have entertained the idea of a pony, but dislike the idea of extra hoses. Here is my proposed configuration:
- AL120 w/ 2nd stage and transmitter (for wrist mounted computer)
- AL19 pony w/ LP to BC mounted Oceanic (or Scubapro) Air2 (integrated octo on BC inflator), and valve mounted PG
- the pony tank will be mounted on back
- Halcyon BP w/ Pioneer wings
- Long (48in ?) hose to 2nd stage
My percieved advantages to this setup are: no extra hoses to get snagged on the wreck, loss of primary air will still allow for a BC inflate on emergency acent, long 2nd stage hose facilitates buddy breathing while I breathe off the BC inflator, mount a compass on other wrist and eliminate console.
Possible caveat:
I live in FL and frequent the ops in West Palm and the keys. I was told that most ops would not let me on the boat with this setup because there is a requirement to have an octo on the primary air source. The reason for this is because apparantly people become lazy and do not take their ponys, claiming they used it and forgot to fill it, etc. (bs if you ask me). I don't know how true this is, but I would appreciate all comments and opinions!!
TIA,
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