Pony or primary?

[Doppler]

Here's my take on it... generally the same approach regardless of details.

• Don't think it'll go like an S-Drill
• Always assume stressed
• Donate long-hose
• Take control of him/her before they take control of you
• From a controlling position make your way to SS
• If the stressed diver has his/her stuff together, perform SS
• Surface
• Make 'em buoyant

If you have need of the gas in your buddy/bailout/pony, YOU switch to it... handing a bottle off to a diver who has a skill level that allows them to run out of gas will not have a happy ending.

Here though is a different scenario

Diver swims up to you, gives you OOA and points to the pony... whole different procedure.

 

[Drin]

If you have need of the gas in your buddy/bailout/pony, YOU switch to it... handing a bottle off to a diver who has a skill level that allows them to run out of gas will not have a happy ending.

Good point.

-Adrian

 

[Mike.D]

Here's my take on it... generally the same approach regardless of details.

• Don't think it'll go like an S-Drill
• Always assume stressed
• Donate long-hose
• Take control of him/her before they take control of you
• From a controlling position make your way to SS
• If the stressed diver has his/her stuff together, perform SS
• Surface
• Make 'em buoyant

If you have need of the gas in your buddy/bailout/pony, YOU switch to it... handing a bottle off to a diver who has a skill level that allows them to run out of gas will not have a happy ending.

Here though is a different scenario

Diver swims up to you, gives you OOA and points to the pony... whole different procedure.

Interesting. Care to explain the last bit??


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[DBailey]

Echoing the thoughts of others...

Donate how you have trained (i.e. don't add new task loading to the "rescuer")
Donate a working air source. Since you were just breathing off of it, you know it is working.

If you planned properly, you should have enough air in your primary tank(s) to sort out the initial steps of the emergency. From there, you can switch to your pony if needed.

 

[Paleface]

I would donate my primary and get on my second ASAP. I would assume any diver that took a breath when they needed it and got nothing is going to be in a hurry to breath!! Once he/she was under control/calm,then I would remove my pony reg,check it my self so they can see it works then hand off pony when they were ready.

 

[MrChen]

Wouldn't you do whatever is quickest? You don't know their skill level. Do they even know what a pony is? Where is the pony mounted? You're going to physically hand it to them? I'm sure they want air, not a tank, and don't care where it comes from. It's your air source they are relying on, you'd be best to be in control of it.

 

[Doppler]

Interesting. Care to explain the last bit??


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Sure...

There is no excuse for running out of air. To do so shows a terrible lack of situational awareness, and is an unforgivable error that puts both the inattentive diver and his/her dive buddy(ies) at risk. We can debate the whys and wherefores until we're blue in the face, but that's my opinion.

Occasionally though, the rottweiler hits the fan and a piece of kit fails... for example, a regulator or LP connection free-flows or leaks, a regulator gets filled with muck and breathing from it is like breathing through a wet facecloth. In this case, the poor punter needs a working regulator. If their situational awareness, emotional control, and fundamental skills are where they should be, their "emergency" will be one or maybe more orders of magnitude less panicky and stressed than the diver in scenario one.

Therefore, their approach and request for your spare gas will be different. They will understand before they get your attention, that the best option is for only ONE of you to take a reg out of his/her mouth. That person should be them since the one they have right then is faulty. For them to use the pony is, in this case and only this case, the best option. 1) It has abundant gas 2) it is attached and secure and does not require the donor to actually do anything except acquiesce 3) It can, if circumstances require it, be borrowed from the donor and carried by the OOD diver.

HOWEVER, be aware that this scenario connotes well-trained, in-control, situationally-aware divers... both of them.


In a few years of diving, I have had to deal with one OOA a la situation one. It was not a diver from our team but a straggler who followed us into a wreck and once there promptly ran out of gas. In the same period, my buddies and I have had two or three instances that would fall into the scenario two category. And I have to say that there is very very little similarity between the two types of events.

 

[Kharon]

Neither. My primary is my primary. The guy effed up so it's on him/her. I will hand off my pony (my reserve) - it's set to hand off the octo in a second and unclip and hand over the pony, and then they are on their own. I dive solo so I have little tollerance for unprepaired divers - sorry. Get the training, get the equipment, do the practice.

 

[nolatom]

Don't dither or have second thoughts, which takes time you (he) doesn't have?? Pick one, or the other, then just do it?

I don't carry a pony, so not my problemo. And I have a rookie setup, you'll just get my octo on fairly short hose so you'll have to stay pretty close and we join arms or grab BCs. Now I've inherited your problems but the one time I had to do this, it worked out okay. OOA signal from buddy should have been "LOA" since he still had a couple hundred pounds. But he didn't grab so it was smooth, we went up together slowly and it worked out. Excellent practice for "next time", which thankfully hasn't happened (yet).

 

[Akimbo]

Here's my take on it... generally the same approach regardless of details.

• Don't think it'll go like an S-Drill
• Always assume stressed
• Donate long-hose

...

Here’s where I take exception to donating a long hose. It is one thing if the receiving diver is a known commodity and you are exiting a wreck or cave. The idea of somebody on the verge of panic grabbing a regulator with the hose wrapped around my neck isn’t what I consider a fun dive. Even worse; you get the hose off of your neck before it turns itself into a half-hitch, they clamp onto it with a death-grip, bolt to the surface trailing you behind, and kicking you in the face the whole way up. With luck, the hose fitting snaps off of your first stage and only person to dies that day.

I have only had to donate to skilled divers, or known commodities. The hoses were standard lengths, we grabbed each other’s harnesses, swam to the surface, and looked each other in the eye. Close proximity and eye contact are important to keep a distressed diver calm; and you can gut-punch them if it doesn’t.

If I were to use a “long hose”, it would be longer than the distance between my first stage and a tall person’s mouth wearing large fins. It would also have a strain relief so pulling on the hose doesn’t break the hose fitting.

Edit: Has anyone done serious OOA drills with a simulated panicked diver? I have always viewed 7' hoses as too short for exiting hatches and a really bad idea for recreational divers who should be on a short leash until reaching sunshine.