Regulator Necklace as it relates to Sidemount

[Kevrumbo]

I really respect that reasoning, believe me.

It has been said in other threads here however that the exact details of the procedure on the z-system are significantly different from the backmount situation.
You must have modified your training at least a little bit to accommodate for that, haven't you?
I am sure the changes are irrelevant to you, but perhaps they are more important to others?

There is no difference in Long Hose Primary/Back-up Necklaced Regulator configuratrion and Out-of-Gas Donation Technique & Protocol between traditional DIR Backmount & UTD's Z-system Sidemount; the only differences between the conventional backmount isolation manifold system and Z-system sidemount with Distribution Block or Isofold-Manifold --are the detailed contingency procedures for problem solving malfunctions/leaks/failures of the respective gas delivery/distribution systems. . .

 

[Razorista]

...no difference in Long Hose Primary/Back-up Necklaced Regulator configuratrion and Out-of-Gas Donation Technique & Protocol ...--are the detailed contingency procedures...

Ah, now I get it.

You just think this:

(Donating the Long Hose - Initial Step - YouTube)

is much more important than this:


(Payback on Simply Sidemount with Garry Dallas special. - YouTube)

Are you sure?

No, I actually do get it, but it's easy to joke about. Sorry

 

[Kevrumbo]

The Dive Guides here at the Truk Stop Dive-ops use DIR Long Hose Configuration on conventional manifolded doubles backmount; yes I'm sure I want to be compatible 100% whether I'm on backmount or Z-system sidemount. Either way the long hose Primary at operating depth is always being breathed and ready for out-of-gas donation.

 

[Aotus]

i've thought about having two long hoses myself. As I'm new, i just went with the standard long and short, but maybe one of these days I'll try it. no reason it would be any more burdensome, just need one more fancy UWLD retainer. as for necklace or clip, I like my necklace but need to improve the knowing system so it stops popping off. I don't like clipping/unclipping my long hose reg, though i am pretty good at doing it without thinking too much now. I certainly wouldn't want to have to be clipping unclipping TWO regs each switch.

is it just me or are all the videos linked here broken or private?

 

[tbone1004]

[video=youtube;QVFUz7esCF8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVFUz7esCF8[/video]

that's the video I posted, won't let me go back and edit the link, sorry.

 

[Kevrumbo]

The problem with classic independent doubles technique with sidemount is that you have to switch 2nd stage regs between the two independent cylinders which are both left on; the problem with that is that if you're also scootering, there is the potential for the un-used 2nd stage reg to start free-flowing without you noticing it (solution is to clip the unused reg to a bungee necklace under your chin and/or install an Omni type inline shut-off valve at both 2nd stage regs)..

Also, inside of a wreck there can be a lot of "Toxic Brew" in the machine spaces/engine rooms/cargo holds -especially on the 70 year-old WWII Truk Lagoon Wrecks (fuel oil,, aviation gas, chemical leakage etc)- you want to minimize taking out switching regs if at all lest you inadvertently take a mouthful of this foul soup. . .

UTD's Z-system sidemount always has you breathing the long hose at working operational depth, no switching regs to balance out cylinders. To balance the cylinders' trim as you consume gas from each tank, Z-system technique calls for alternately turning one side tank on and then turning the other side tank off, each connected via Swagelock QC6's through the common Distribution-Block or Iso-Fold Manifold.

 

[Patoux01]

UTD's Z-system sidemount always has you breathing the long hose at working operational depth, no switching regs to balance out cylinders. To balance the cylinders' trim as you consume gas from each tank, Z-system technique calls for alternately turning one side tank on and then turning the other side tank off, each connected via Swagelock QC6's through the common Distribution-Block or Iso-Fold Manifold.

So basically, what you're saying, is you'd rather end up with no air at all, than having to switch regulators?
What I mean is, left tank closed, right tank open. BAM! There goes the hose from the right tank to the manifold, what do you do? You first have to open a tank before you can get air, now if it bursts when you've just breathed out, I'm not sure that's a great idea. Is this really how UTD teaches it, or should you rely on your buddy (which will of course be at the other side of a restriction)? This is a serious question, I don't know the UTD training and probably never will take it, but closing a tank that you're supposed to breathe of doesn't sound too good.

 

[MSargeant]

I like the idea of the z-system, and have watched/chatted with AG and a couple other instructors from UTD about them and indulging my curiosities, though reading about the "Long hose paradigm" so much that if I had a drink for everytime my eyes scrolled over it i'd die from alcohol poisoning, really grates my enthusiasm.

 

[Kevrumbo]

So basically, what you're saying, is you'd rather end up with no air at all, than having to switch regulators?
What I mean is, left tank closed, right tank open. BAM! There goes the hose from the right tank to the manifold, what do you do? You first have to open a tank before you can get air, now if it bursts when you've just breathed out, I'm not sure that's a great idea. Is this really how UTD teaches it, or should you rely on your buddy (which will of course be at the other side of a restriction)? This is a serious question, I don't know the UTD training and probably never will take it, but closing a tank that you're supposed to breathe of doesn't sound too good.

I'd rather not have both tanks opened as in classic independent doubles technique, and an un-noticed free-flowing switched out & flapping away 2nd Stage Reg while scootering into a current at depth --a much more likely scenario than the above if you use a DPV a lot.

In UTD's Z-system sidemount, the Long Hose Primary stays in your mouth, and the necklaced back-up 2nd Stage Reg in a standard DIR config is "detuned" either by inhalation/cracking adjustment knob or internally by a reg technician so it won't readily free-flow. And if it does, it's always around your neck under your chin so that you will definitely notice it.

 

[Razorista]

... And if it does, it's always around your neck under your chin so that you will definitely notice it.

Same way as in every sidemount config that is not explicitly cave related.

But what about overestimated lifetime of hoses on your back in that scenario?