Scuba diver to Jr. OW

[Goodtime Adventures]

Anyone with a Scuba Diver licence, and all children aged 10 & 11 are limited to a depth of 12m/40ft. So the main benefit your son will get out of the Jr OW is being able to dive to 18m/60ft as opposed to having that shallower depth limit imposed on him.

He will have to complete a 200m swin/300m snorkel, 2 further sections of academic study (after doing a review of what he should currently know) and a final exam, plus more confined water skills (after preassessing existing skill set) and 2 further OW dives under the direct supervision of an instructor. IMO this would be a benefit both to him as a diver, and to you as parents of a young diver.

 

[Frosty]

A heads up for the OP.i can tell you for certain that a JOW auto updates' to OW as soon as a kid turns 15.BUT to get the c card showing the OW status either you pay for replacement card or more easilly choose a specialty and that will then give the adult qualification,.
I have two lads who showed their cards at a dive op and once age was checked were treated exactly as normal OW divers.

 

[DENLASCUBA]

From the C-Cards:

1. Printed on the Jr OW Card: 2 lines.
Line 1: 10-11 - With Parent or PADI Pro 12m/40 (Yes a 40' depth limitation but may go with a parent or pro)
Line 2: 12+ - With Adult. Note that there is no depth nor Parent/Pro limitation. Basically this states that they are able to dive NORMAL OW limits with only an adult. While PADI recommends 60' for OW and some dive shops enforce it, PADI's official depth limit for OW is 120' and this applies to the Jr OW.
I do not think that PADI lacked the ink or space on the card to have printed the same limitations as line 1.

2. Printed on the Jr AOW: Jr Advanced OW Diver Must Dive with Certified Adult. Again, No depth limitations, e.g. PADI's official depth limit of 130' and again I do not think that PADI forgot to print it on this card even though they printed the Adult limitation.

3. Printed on the Jr Rescue Diver: Jr Rescue Diver Must Dive with Certified Adult. Again, No depth limitations, e.g. PADI's official depth limit of 130' and again I do not think that PADI forgot to print it on this card even though they printed the Adult limitation.

The official limitation according to PADI when I questioned them for a Jr diver is 130'. There are considerations for what depth your child should go based on numerous factors including maturity, experience and overall ability to handle themselves. There are also considerations on physiological factors that must be balanced. When I learned to dive, 12 was the age to get a full OW certification without limitations.

When your child turns 15, they are full certified for the level they are certified to, e.g. mine will be a full Rescue Diver. She also possesses a IANTD Jr Nitrox which will convert then. We will convert all of her cards then to full status just to make a point,

In case you cannot tell from my rant on this, some shops have been very receptive to the Jr divers while others like to treat them with false interpretations of their limits. As PADI told me, ultimately there are no limits set on any diver by any agency that is enforced. I doubt anybody here will know of a certification being revoked for going to deep or being too risky (other than revoked by death).

There are limitations on training imposed on instructors, e.g. Jr AOW is limited to 70' for the 'deep' adventure dive. These training limitations are real and can be enforced by revoking the Instructor Certifications. The 'deep' adventure dive does not, however, translate to the maximum depth for a Jr AOW diver. Many training agencies set max depth limits shallower than the certified depth for training. TDI Basic Trimix comes to mind which has a limitation of 150' but a certified depth of 190?'. Also there are possible insurance limitations imposed on the dive operations that do not follow standard OW Recreational limitations of 130'.

I do not know who you asked at PADI but your depth limitations are not correct at all and instructors or dive centers teaching PADI courses can not just increase the depth limitations as they please. PADI will not just say sure you can go as deep as you want that would open them up to a law suit, now I could see an instructor saying that, which he should then go back and take his instructor course again to learn PADI standards. Divers may feel they can go to any depth they want, some may beable to pull that off with a dive outfit, DM, or Instructor who just does not care (another instructor who should take his course again) but we are to hold you to your certification level depth limits, the boats limits, and the dive outfits limits. Also for dive insurance with DAN even if you have their highest plan without depth limitations they will still hold you to the limitations of your certification level, if you go deeper than your cert you are not covered. The only people able to enforce these depth limitations are us the dive outfitters, the dive masters and instructors. We may not beable to revoke your card but we can easily say no to your business as it is a liability for anyone who will say yes or just doesnt care.

Here are the correct MAX depths for PADI certifications

Discover Scuba Diving 10+: 12 meters/ 40ft
PADI Scuba Diver 10+: 12m/ 40ft. Must dive with a PADI Pro
PADI Jr. Open Water Diver: 10-11 years old- 12m/40ft. Must dive with PADI Pro
PADI Jr. Open Water Diver: 12-14- 18m/60ft must dive with adult guardian
Open Water Diver: 15+- 18m/60ft'
Jr Adventure Dive/ AOW- 10-11 years old- 12m/ 40ft
Jr Adventure Diver/ AOW- 12-14 years old- 21m/ 70ft
Adventure Diver/ AOW Diver: 15+ 30m/ 100 ft
Padi Junior Rescue diver:12-14 years old: 18m/60ft Diver only is certified as Adventure diver but no deep dive
Padi Junior Rescue diver:12-14 years old: 21m/70ft Diver has completed the deep adventure dive and is either certified Adventure Diver or AOW diver.
Rescue diver:15+: 18m/60ft Diver only is certified as Adventure diver but no deep dive
Rescue diver:15+: 30m/100ft Diver has completed the deep adventure dive and is either certified Adventure Diver or AOW diver.
PADI Deep Diver: 15+: 40m/120 ft

 

[Frosty]

scubalawrence-its printed on the back of the c cards.

 

[packrat12]

I do not know who you asked at PADI but your depth limitations are not correct at all and instructors or dive centers teaching PADI courses can not just increase the depth limitations as they please. PADI will not just say sure you can go as deep as you want that would open them up to a law suit, now I could see an instructor saying that, which he should then go back and take his instructor course again to learn PADI standards. Divers may feel they can go to any depth they want, some may beable to pull that off with a dive outfit, DM, or Instructor who just does not care (another instructor who should take his course again) but we are to hold you to your certification level depth limits, the boats limits, and the dive outfits limits. Also for dive insurance with DAN even if you have their highest plan without depth limitations they will still hold you to the limitations of your certification level, if you go deeper than your cert you are not covered. The only people able to enforce these depth limitations are us the dive outfitters, the dive masters and instructors. We may not beable to revoke your card but we can easily say no to your business as it is a liability for anyone who will say yes or just doesnt care.

Here are the correct MAX depths for PADI certifications

Discover Scuba Diving 10+: 12 meters/ 40ft
PADI Scuba Diver 10+: 12m/ 40ft. Must dive with a PADI Pro
PADI Jr. Open Water Diver: 10-11 years old- 12m/40ft. Must dive with PADI Pro
PADI Jr. Open Water Diver: 12-14- 18m/60ft must dive with adult guardian
Open Water Diver: 15+- 18m/60ft'
Jr Adventure Dive/ AOW- 10-11 years old- 12m/ 40ft
Jr Adventure Diver/ AOW- 12-14 years old- 21m/ 70ft
Adventure Diver/ AOW Diver: 15+ 30m/ 100 ft
Padi Junior Rescue diver:12-14 years old: 18m/60ft Diver only is certified as Adventure diver but no deep dive
Padi Junior Rescue diver:12-14 years old: 21m/70ft Diver has completed the deep adventure dive and is either certified Adventure Diver or AOW diver.
Rescue diver:15+: 18m/60ft Diver only is certified as Adventure diver but no deep dive
Rescue diver:15+: 30m/100ft Diver has completed the deep adventure dive and is either certified Adventure Diver or AOW diver.
PADI Deep Diver: 15+: 40m/120 ft

DENLASCUBA,

There is a distinct difference between instruction and certified diving. With that said, the information from PADI stated that PADI's official limits for ALL certified divers is 130', e.g. the Recreational Limit. When I was certified, the recognized depth limit of OW was 130'. Last I have looked, the current recognized depth limit of Recreational diving is 130'. This applies to all divers. Agencies can Recommend any depth they wish but we are trained to dive recreational limits.

"PADI Jr. Open Water Diver: 10-11 years old- 12m/40ft. Must dive with PADI Pro" - Strange that my daughter's card specifically states: With Parent or PADI Pro. PADI Pro not needed if parent is with them.
"PADI Jr. Open Water Diver: 12-14- 18m/60ft must dive with adult guardian" - Strange again that my daughter's card specifically states: With Adult. No specific for Adult Guardian, just an adult.
Jr Adventure Dive/ AOW- 10-11 years old- 12m/ 40ft & Jr Adventure Diver/ AOW- 12-14 years old- 21m/ 70ft - Strange it is not on her card. Care to point out the "NON Training" limitation?
"Rescue diver:15+: 18m/60ft Diver only is certified as Adventure diver but no deep dive" - Around here, I am not aware that you can be a Rescue diver without being a AOW. ?? Does this even make sense?

Overall, you just stated PADI recommendations, which are just recommendations. You also have been sloppy with the specific wording, e.g. Adult Guardian vs Adult. They have real legal meanings and are different.

As for DAN, I can only find that your coverage is based on your planned depth. If you plan 150' on standard coverage, you will not be covered regardless of certification. If you plan 130' with either Rec or Tek, further you will be covered regardless of your Rec level, e.g. OW, AOW etc. The unlimited depth plans are for Tek divers. In addition, most medical insurance in the states specifically have exclusions when diving deeper then 130, not based on certification level and depth. I am and have been a DAN member and currently am Guardian.

So again your 'facts' do not seem to correspond with what is reality. Now, I will agree that a dive shop may set what ever limits they want and that no instructor may 'increase' limits set by their agency. I am simply stating that an OW diver and a JR OW diver are both rated to Recreational limits. This does not mean that they are qualified for it in terms of experience.

 

[pdhenry]

As for DAN, I can only find that your coverage is based on your planned depth. If you plan 150' on standard coverage, you will not be covered regardless of certification. If you plan 130' with either Rec or Tek, further you will be covered regardless of your Rec level, e.g. OW, AOW etc. The unlimited depth plans are for Tek divers. In addition, most medical insurance in the states specifically have exclusions when diving deeper then 130, not based on certification level and depth. I am and have been a DAN member and currently am Guardian.

The DAN Member's Handbook doesn't specify depth limitations but it does define a "Covered Dive" as a recreational dive or certain professional activities such as Instructor or Divemaster. But the definition of "Covered Diving Accident" explicitly has no depth limitations.

The term "Recreational Dive" isn't defined within the handbook (which I believe to be a shortcoming). The context used in the definition of Covered Dive (recreational or certain professional dives) could lead one to conclude that it means a dive undertaken for the purposes of recreation. I can see your interpretation as well.

 

[ddmattos]

PADI Scuba Certs for Children and Teenagers

Straight from their website use link above.

The minimum age is 10 years old (in most areas). Student divers who are younger than 15 earn the PADI Junior Open Water Diver certification, which they may upgrade to PADI Open Water Diver certification upon reaching 15. Children under the age of 13 require parent or guardian permission to register for PADI eLearning, or to use PADI Open Water Diver Touch™.

Junior Open Water Diver (ages 10-14)

Young people can take the full PADI Open Water Diver scuba certification course and upon completion will become Junior Open Water Divers with certain age limitations for scuba diving:

• Junior Open Water Divers ages 10-11 years old must dive with a PADI Professional or certified parent/guardian. Dives must not exceed 12 metres /40 feet.
• Junior Open Water Divers ages 12-14 years old must dive with a certified adult. (13+ years old can take the Open Water Diver course online.)

Junior Advanced Open Water Diver(ages 12-14)

Young people can continue the adventure and build their skills by taking the Advanced Open Water Diver course with a few limitations

• Junior Open Water Divers ages 10-11 years must complete three adventure dives to become a Junior Adventure Diver. They must dive with a PADI Professional or certified parent/guardian. Dives must not exceed 12 metres/ 40 feet
• Junior Open Water Divers ages 12-14 years may complete three Adventure Dives to earn the Junior Adventure Diver rating or five Adventure Dives to earn the Junior Advanced Open Water rating. If they complete the Deep Adventure Dive it must not exceed 21 metres/ 70 feet. They must dive with a certified adult.

Junior Rescue Diver (ages 12-14)

Young divers ages 12-14 rise to challenges and learn how to master them in the PADI Rescue Diver course. Upon completion, they become Junior Rescue Divers. They must dive with a certified adult.

Junior Master Scuba Diver (ages 12-14)

Young divers ages 12-14 can continue building experience and exploring unique diving environments on their way to the Master Scuba Diver Rating. They must dive with a certified adult.

 

[DENLASCUBA]

DENLASCUBA,

There is a distinct difference between instruction and certified diving. With that said, the information from PADI stated that PADI's official limits for ALL certified divers is 130', e.g. the Recreational Limit. When I was certified, the recognized depth limit of OW was 130'. Last I have looked, the current recognized depth limit of Recreational diving is 130'. This applies to all divers. Agencies can Recommend any depth they wish but we are trained to dive recreational limits.

"PADI Jr. Open Water Diver: 10-11 years old- 12m/40ft. Must dive with PADI Pro" - Strange that my daughter's card specifically states: With Parent or PADI Pro. PADI Pro not needed if parent is with them.
"PADI Jr. Open Water Diver: 12-14- 18m/60ft must dive with adult guardian" - Strange again that my daughter's card specifically states: With Adult. No specific for Adult Guardian, just an adult.
Jr Adventure Dive/ AOW- 10-11 years old- 12m/ 40ft & Jr Adventure Diver/ AOW- 12-14 years old- 21m/ 70ft - Strange it is not on her card. Care to point out the "NON Training" limitation?
"Rescue diver:15+: 18m/60ft Diver only is certified as Adventure diver but no deep dive" - Around here, I am not aware that you can be a Rescue diver without being a AOW. ?? Does this even make sense?

Overall, you just stated PADI recommendations, which are just recommendations. You also have been sloppy with the specific wording, e.g. Adult Guardian vs Adult. They have real legal meanings and are different.

As for DAN, I can only find that your coverage is based on your planned depth. If you plan 150' on standard coverage, you will not be covered regardless of certification. If you plan 130' with either Rec or Tek, further you will be covered regardless of your Rec level, e.g. OW, AOW etc. The unlimited depth plans are for Tek divers. In addition, most medical insurance in the states specifically have exclusions when diving deeper then 130, not based on certification level and depth. I am and have been a DAN member and currently am Guardian.

So again your 'facts' do not seem to correspond with what is reality. Now, I will agree that a dive shop may set what ever limits they want and that no instructor may 'increase' limits set by their agency. I am simply stating that an OW diver and a JR OW diver are both rated to Recreational limits. This does not mean that they are qualified for it in terms of experience.

I do not know of a reputable dive shop that will take a diver past the depth they were certified, I have seen quite a few questionable operators who will do this. Your depth limit is increased by you completing AOW and Deep diver courses. And a student can move from adventure diver to rescue diver. The only requirement is that the student completes their adventure diver course and have completed their navigation dive, the deep dive is not required to complete the adventure diver course or to enroll in the rescue diver course. The depth limit was a typo on my part and not 140.

 

[Frosty]

-I post this purely from a theory prospective.--There are no scuba police underwater giving tickets if a kid goes to 60 feet.
Its sensible to keep to certain depths BUT depth limits are strongly suggested guidelines only.

 

[pdhenry]

As for DAN, I can only find that your coverage is based on your planned depth. If you plan 150' on standard coverage, you will not be covered regardless of certification. If you plan 130' with either Rec or Tek, further you will be covered regardless of your Rec level, e.g. OW, AOW etc. The unlimited depth plans are for Tek divers. In addition, most medical insurance in the states specifically have exclusions when diving deeper then 130, not based on certification level and depth. I am and have been a DAN member and currently am Guardian.

I think I'm going to amend my earlier comment on this post.

I was looking though the DAN Member Handbook again and in the table on Page 12 it clearly says "Planned Maximum Depth Covered - Unlimited" for all three coverage levels.

I think this is consistent with "recreational dive" not being defined in the handbook - it's safe to interpret this as a dive undertaken for purposes of recreation and not tied to certification depth limits.