Semidry wetsuit for warmer water?

[karstdvr]

. The neoprene drysuits are pretty much like wetsuits from what I hear.

Neoprene drysuits are nothing like a wetsuit,but a very viable drysuit. As long as you don't take the neoprene drysuit deep (to me beyond 100') they keep you warm and dry, but the upside is they are highly durable, easy to repair, and cheap-so when worn out, throw it away. Other benefits to a neoprene dry suit is they are fairly streamlined, and if they flood, they become a wet suit.

 

[tbone1004]

Just get a normal 7mm that fits you well and add a hooded vest if you fell you need it. The dry zippers on the semi suits are what's restricting movement.
I would never use a drysuit when I don't need it. There is always the change of getting wet in the suit, you have to use a p-valve that also might fail and you really don't want to be in a wet drysuit doing deco. You also have to pay more attention to the drysuit while you can chuck the wet suit in a box until the next day.

He's talking about a semidry. The dry zippers are not what is restricting movement, it's the fact they're made out of dense neoprene that is very thick. That also said, who cares if you get wet? He's diving in mexico, it's warm, if your suit floods regularly, time to get a new one. Don't have to use a P-valve for shorter dives, but they are also pretty much not prone to failing outside of operator error. The attention required for a drysuit over a wetsuit is pretty minimal. Tuck the seals inside, zip it up, and throw it in the box...

Look, this is simple. Dude is in a 3mm, he's comfortable now and is getting into longer deco dives. You are going to have to spend $400+ on either a good 7mm with hooded vest, a semidry, or you can get something like a thermalution. Get the thermalution it's the best option for what you're doing as it allows you to keep the 3mm that you have, and only add the heat when you want/need it. I would grab a decent maybe 5mm hooded vest to assist, but no need to get a semidry or thick wetsuit/drysuit for that.

 

[Bennno]

He's talking about a semidry. The dry zippers are not what is restricting movement, it's the fact they're made out of dense neoprene that is very thick. That also said, who cares if you get wet? He's diving in mexico, it's warm, if your suit floods regularly, time to get a new one. Don't have to use a P-valve for shorter dives, but they are also pretty much not prone to failing outside of operator error. The attention required for a drysuit over a wetsuit is pretty minimal. Tuck the seals inside, zip it up, and throw it in the box...

Look, this is simple. Dude is in a 3mm, he's comfortable now and is getting into longer deco dives. You are going to have to spend $400+ on either a good 7mm with hooded vest, a semidry, or you can get something like a thermalution. Get the thermalution it's the best option for what you're doing as it allows you to keep the 3mm that you have, and only add the heat when you want/need it. I would grab a decent maybe 5mm hooded vest to assist, but no need to get a semidry or thick wetsuit/drysuit for that.

Sure, but these are YOUR facts tbone.
There are a bunch semi suit with dry zipper and they do restrict movement quite a bit. Apparently you don't even know about those. You also don't have to spend 400 bugs on a normal wetsuit.
You will spend quite a bit of time underwater, if you wanna do deco dives in Mexican caves, so you would likely need a p-valve. It seems like you're haven't even been using dry suits for long... you will go through a dry suit much faster when you treat it the same as a wet suit.
Thermalution is not "the best option", it is one option (not the best imho) and just your opinion... no better than other peoples opinions.
Can you stop acting like you're an expert and stop claiming your guesses are facts they are not not facts.

 

[tbone1004]

the point is that the suit restricts the whole bodies ability to move because it is thicker, denser neoprene. The dry zippers if don't properly don't restrict anywhere near the amount of movement that the suit does.

I dive dry probably 95% of the time, and have been for 6 years, with a P-valve. I don't always hook it up for dives under about 2 hours, and my suits last quite a long time, so do the seals. Maybe I treat my wetsuits properly, but they are all the same.

The thermalution is still a better option than a thicker wetsuit for this situation. Active heaters are better for the body than just increasing the neoprene. By going to a semidry you significantly reduce your comfort for the whole dive to gain a bit of warmth at deco. You're too hot for most of the dive which is bad because it promotes ongassing, and/or restricting movement which makes you generally uncomfortable compared to a 3mm. Huge advantage to drysuits in that you can just inflate them a bit at the end of the dive to warm up and gain the thermal advantages when you don't need to worry about moving around because you're on deco. The thermalution *Which btw I don't have nor have I used* allows you to stay in a 3mm, and just flip a switch and warm up on deco. That's about as perfect a solution as it gets, and costs the same as a good 7mm wetsuit.

Neo Tek Semi Dry - Dive Right in Scuba
Neotek, $400 *Most in the $500-$600 range
Pinnacle Cruiser 7mm Mens | Dive Right In Scuba - Plainfield, IL - Dive Right in Scuba
Pinnacle 7mm, $250 *cheapest I could find, most in the $400-$500 range
Amazon.com : Thermalution 70M - Heated Undersuit : Wetsuits : Sports & Outdoors
Thermalution 70m, $500. Bit more expensive, lot more versatile.


So that is my opinion and why. Why do you think that a thicker wetsuit is better? Here is why I think a thick wetsuit is idiotic in this situation.
Cons of a thicker wetsuit. Have to carry more lead, they only have AL tanks in mexico so you now have to carry likely 30lbs of lead to sink a thick wetsuit plus two AL80's. You also lose most of that at depth when the suit compresses, so now your wing is stressed and you are diving an unbalanced rig which is not safe in open water, and certainly not safe for the cave if the wing fails. He is doing deco which means he is going deep, deeper means he loses that thermal thickness advantage until he comes back up, but with a heated undergarment he can just flip a switch and warm up if he needs to for a minute.

Deep dives in wetsuits just aren't smart or safe. If you're diving deep and need to stay warm, dive dry, plain and simple, it is a safety concern. If you're in this situation, a 3mm is perfectly adequate considering their water temp, and if you need a bit of a thermal boost that you can't get from a good hood, then go with something that is heated and not have to worry about the buoyancy issues and hassle of carrying a boatload of extra lead when you don't have to

 

[gearhound]

Interesting comments from everyone. I'm a regular drysuit diver, as I own 3 and teach in cold water. I very much prefer diving with the neotek semi-dry in Mexico. The rest of our group of cave divers and instructors also prefer diving wet or semi-dry. There is no restriction of movement, in fact there is more movement. We do extended dives. We stay warm. If you get too hot, you can crack a seal and let water in. You can pee in the suit and flush it. It's durable. I don't have to worry about ripped seals ending a dive before it's begun. I can move my head in all directions without worry of a flood. I see no disadvantages to a wetsuit/semidry diving in the caves in Mexico. The only thing you can bring up is redundant buoyancy. However, thermulation is not going to solve that problem either. And that's just going to add battery failures to your dive planning.

There's a group of 10 of us, all instructors/DMs, that go down regularly. Not the biggest sample size, but as close to an expert opinion on this thread that you can get. Unbiased because we own and dive both types of suits. All of us dive wet/semidry.

 

[Bennno]

the point is that the suit restricts the whole bodies ability to move because it is thicker, denser neoprene. The dry zippers if don't properly don't restrict anywhere near the amount of movement that the suit does.

Here we go again, your're just making stuff up.

I dive dry probably 95% of the time, and have been for 6 years,

So, in other words: You have virtually no experience diving wet and 6 years of drysuit diving hardly makes you an expert.

The thermalution is still a better option than a thicker wetsuit for this situation. Active heaters are better for the body than just increasing the neoprene. By going to a semidry you significantly reduce your comfort for the whole dive to gain a bit of warmth at deco. You're too hot for most of the dive which is bad because it promotes ongassing, and/or restricting movement which makes you generally uncomfortable compared to a 3mm. Huge advantage to drysuits in that you can just inflate them a bit at the end of the dive to warm up and gain the thermal advantages when you don't need to worry about moving around because you're on deco. The thermalution *Which btw I don't have nor have I used* allows you to stay in a 3mm, and just flip a switch and warm up on deco. That's about as perfect a solution as it gets, and costs the same as a good 7mm wetsuit.

It's a theory of yours. It's fine, but just an opinion from a guy that's been diving for a few years. Look at what greyhound posted, I agree with what he said. He makes some good points.

... have to carry likely 30lbs of lead to sink a thick wetsuit plus two AL80's. You also lose most of that at depth when the suit compresses, so now your wing is stressed and you are diving an unbalanced rig which is not safe in open water, and certainly not safe for the cave if the wing fails...

Your wing is stressed? Lol. Sorry, but this is just BS. When I started out using a sidemount rig for cave diving I didn't use any kind of wing, 12lbs with a 7mm suit and an 2mm vest for 80' dives... works better with a wing but I don't really need one.

Deep dives in wetsuits just aren't smart or safe. If you're diving deep and need to stay warm, dive dry, plain and simple, it is a safety concern...

So, according to your expert opinion I must be a moron than.
Where do you come up with that stuff? Seriously, who tells you these fairytale? I used to dive below 200' in the Red Sea all the time in a wet suit and why wouldn't you.

You really seem to overestimate our level of experience and expertise by quite a bit.

 

[LiteHedded]

Just get a normal 7mm that fits you well and add a hooded vest if you fell you need it. The dry zippers on the semi suits are what's restricting movement.
I would never use a drysuit when I don't need it. There is always the change of getting wet in the suit, you have to use a p-valve that also might fail and you really don't want to be in a wet drysuit doing deco. You also have to pay more attention to the drysuit while you can chuck the wet suit in a box until the next day.

i'd rather be in a wet drysuit than a wetsuit

 

[tbone1004]

read any of the GUE recommendations on twin tank diving and wetsuits for deep diving, drysuits are just safer. I have no issue with thin wetsuits, 5mm's or less are fine for whatever diving, but I just don't think thick wetsuits are the best option with the alternatives out there now. For situations like this a light drysuit that you can inflate on deco is better than a thick wetsuit or semidry, or a heated vest is cheaper and probably actually better since wetsuits dive better than drysuits. For cold water, a drysuit is just plain better, don't care who you are, that is just not up for discussion.

If I could dive wet all the time I probably would, and I might look into the thermalution for myself when it comes time to replace my drysuit in a few years for cave diving because I think it's a better solution. I just got back from a weekend of cave diving in Florida in a wetsuit and I much prefer it to diving dry, but it's a 5mm and I wasn't diving deeper than 80/90 ft and didn't have any real deco obligations.

That said, I am less restricted in my drysuit than I am in a 7mm wetsuit. TLS350 style drysuits offer far better range of motion than any 7mm+ wetsuits if they're fitted properly, especially with the Ti-Zips over brass. 7mm dense neoprene is just not conducive to motion....

 

[karstdvr]

i'd rather be in a wet drysuit than a wetsuit

Unless that wet dry suit is a pvalve failure :-(

 

[Bennno]

i'd rather be in a wet drysuit than a wetsuit

I don't.

@tbone, so what? "Drysuits are just safer", I see, I didn't get the 'just' part earlier. Because GUE has it written down somewhere, like you can't use air on a 30' dive, crush neoprene is dangerous, bungee wings are dangerous, dry gloves are dangerous, every drysuit except DUI is BS, it's 'streamlined' when your stages point straight up, sidemount is dangerous, light fins are dangerous, everybody else is a stroke (aka a-hole), bla bla bla... tell me when to stop. Did the church of GUE give you a reason too or is it just because pastor George once said so.
Now I understand what you basing your wisdom on... you should have said so right away.

Btw: I don't feel restricted in my 7mm, maybe you should get a better suit.

For cold water, a drysuit is just plain better, don't care who you are, that is just not up for discussion.

Great point Captain Obvious! I never said a wet suit is better in cold water. In case you don't know, the Red Sea is pretty warm.