Should I Start with a DRY suit ?

[orcatwiggy]

I am just starting my diving career. I live in Connecticut and anticipate doing 99% of my diving either off the CT shore or off of Rhode Island.

I believe that I would like to go as frequently as possible and not let the cold be a negating factor. This does not mean that 0 degrees in the dead of January will be a requirement of mine, but I certainly want to have the longest season possible, both starting and ending.

All that being said, there are the two options...wet or dry. A 6.5 wet suit might not be warm enough in the coldest times of the year. Would it be better to get another wet suit and double them up when the temps are prohibitively cold? Or would geting a dry suit be a better way to go.

If I look at the wet suit path, a 3 + 6 should cover most of the year in the Northeast. Then I could just use the 3 or just the 6 when needed. But a dry suit can be used in warmer temp by regulationg your undergarments. (NOTE: all the above is what I have learned from reading, not first hand experience, so go easy on me if I am way off base)

Is a dry suit too much suit for a novice...I wouldn't think so because it's all about staying warm.

Last point, concerning dry suits. I have been looking around to educate myself. DUI seems like the best, but I am not sure if I need that. If there is a dry suit for $800 that works 95% as well as a $3000 DUI, that would be ok. I am not looking to spend the money if I don't have to. (I realize that you get what you pay for) Brand recommendations would be appreciated.

Thank You
John

 

[bedmund]

Hi John,
My advice would be to go at least a few months diving wet before you get a drysuit. Make sure you're improving your awareness of your bouyancy while diving wet. Then look into getting a drysuit.

The type of drysuit you get will depend to some degree on what type of diving you're doing. Although, my .02 cents worth would be to stay away from a regular neoprene suit. Crushed or compressed neoprene might be ok, depending on your dive interests. In a regular neoprene suit and thick undergarments, you'd have to wear tons of weight so you're not too positive at the end of your dive.

Good luck,
-Bill

 

[OceanSpirit]

Hi from the miserable UK!

My advice is to go straight for dry. Get the hard part over with first (ie controlling bouyancy using only your suit) and you'll never look back. Concerning the type, I'd go for a membrane suit as you then have the option of choosing the undergarments to your thermal requirements. In the spring and fall here (or autumn, take your choice!) I wear simple a sweatshirt and jogging pants which keeps me snug. For hardcore winter diving I have an Otter undersuit which is toasty.

As for makes, yes you get what you pay for. I have a Aquion Pro membrane suit. They are at the cheaper end of the market and can best be described as workmanlike. However, it has done me sterling service, doesn't leak and takes what I throw at it, so I'm happy.

 

[geraldp]

... there are the two options...wet or dry. A 6.5 wet suit might not be warm enough in the coldest times of the year. Would it be better to get another wet suit and double them up when the temps are prohibitively cold? Or would geting a dry suit be a better way to go.

If I look at the wet suit path, a 3 + 6 should cover most of the year in the Northeast. Then I could just use the 3 or just the 6 when needed. But a dry suit can be used in warmer temp by regulationg your undergarments. (NOTE: all the above is what I have learned from reading, not first hand experience, so go easy on me if I am way off base)

Hi John:
I would highly recommend getting a drysuit now if you can afford it. If you're serious about diving and you want to dive all year long, make the investment. Also take a drysuit class. They'll teach you the pitfalls of diving dry.

Before purchasing a drysuit, I only got a couple of dives in every 6 months. Since getting the drysuit I now get 2-4 dives in every month (I'd get more in but it's almost a 400 mile round trip drive for me).

Here in the NorthWest our waters only swing about 10 degrees from Winter to Summer (mid 40's to mid 50's). In the NorthEast I understand you guys have a bigger temperature swing. On my one NorthEast dive trip (Cape Ann) the temp was 41 degrees. I would NOT want to dive that temperature in a wetsuit. There were people there diving wetsuits, but they were very uncomfortable. Anyway, you are correct in that with a drysuit you can easily fix this by layering your underwear.

Is a dry suit too much suit for a novice...I wouldn't think so because it's all about staying warm.

Definitely not. I got my Open Water certification in a drysuit.

Last point, concerning dry suits. I have been looking around to educate myself. DUI seems like the best, but I am not sure if I need that. If there is a dry suit for $800 that works 95% as well as a $3000 DUI, that would be ok. I am not looking to spend the money if I don't have to. (I realize that you get what you pay for) Brand recommendations would be appreciated.

I can't help a whole lot here as I've only tried two brands. My LDS rents Andy's drysuits. They offer several shell type suits. I really liked them, especially the front-entry suits like the Andys DS2 or DS3. When I went to purchase I found a great sale on Whites drysuits. I ended up purchasing a Whites Catalyst. It's a Front-entry shell suit, and I like it a lot more than the Andy's, mostly for comfort and shell material. I'm not sure as to the total price as I added a bunch of other gear in the deal, but I think I got it for around $1500 with underwear and boots.

Jerry

 

[Afraid_of_Fish]

Hey John,
I would recomend getting one and basicly sticking with it. If you want to get a drysuit, then get one, practice getting bouyant with it. Or get a wetsuit and dive with that, don't try to do both. I would recomend the dry suit, because personally I like them better and like you said, you can adjust the warmth depending on how cold it is outside, whereas with a wetsuit you can't. The difference in how much weight you need when using a drysuit vs using a wetsuit is a lot. So if you switch maintaining bouancy will probably be an issue.

As for brands, I've only ever dived with a DUI dry suit. Though I'm no expert on this. DUI actually has test days where you can go to a beach they meet at and test out a dry suit before you buy one. I've done this, it's pretty cool. Check out their website for dates and such: www.dui-online.com (I think).

Safe Diving!

Cheers,
Jess

 

[lawofgravity]

I can remember a couple of dives last fall when I was the only one on the boat wearing a wetsuit. On the SI, the crew were pouring hotwater down my back and front, offering me hot soup, blankets etc... while the drysuit divers were putting their feet up and complaining about how warm they were. After that episode, I decided never again and started saving for a drysuit. My advice obviously, is to go for straight for the drysuit, if as you say, the majority of your dives are coldwater. Take a class and spend a couple of easy dives with a shallow bottom to do nothing but practicing on your buoyancy skills. It won't take long before everything is second nature.

 

[mstudley]

roughly 30 dives ago I purchased a new wetsuit because it was a deal (half price). I love my wetsuit and it does keep me warm (6.5mm farmer john), however that said I just ordered a drysuit today.

Personally I see no benefit to starting with a wetsuit if you are planning on diving dry soon after. If you have the money for the drysuit I say go for it. Put whatever money you have for a wetsuit towards the dry.

Time will tell, but I think once I get my suit and start using it you'll see my wetsuit up for sale here shortly after.

Oh, and as for drysuit brands DUI is great but expensive. The suit I ordered is a Bare ATR HD. Great suit, DUI quality and much cheaper.

 

[eponym]

I bought a drysuit (Whites Nexus Shell) just a few dives after OW certification. I love it. Got the suit, fleece underwear, boots, and bag as a unit. I recently bought a 5mil farmer john and tunic combo that works well in mildly cold water (I seem to chill easily, not much left on these old bones) but the drysuit's more convenient - cooler on the surface on a hot day, easier to get in and out of.

The drysuit specialty course I took helped me get comfortable with the buoyancy issues, and like many you'll speak with I'm no longer using the drysuit for buoyancy control, just putting enough air in to offset suit squeeze and using my BC and lungs at depth to stay neutral. There are skills to master with the suit, no doubt, but I feel so much less exhausted after a day of cold-water diving. I noticed that the very first day I used it.

Fin on,
Bryan

 

[sylvester]

I just left Pa, prior to moving there last year, I dove 100% wet in a 6.5 or 7mm even in the winter months I was usally good for a dive then I froze my butt off. I bought a BARE nexgen dry suit and have never looked back. I love Dry, I was able to go in the winter and get 2-3 dives in instead of one. I was warm on my SI, and the entire experance was better.

What would I do differant, hummmmm, I bought my suit off ebay cause it was priced right. Took my DS class with a shop and then learned the differance in materials. I would buy another suit like I own again no doubt about it. However, I would take the DS class 1st, learn about the differant suits and materials dive one of each avaliable suit when I could prior to deciding which suit to purchase. That way you can determine what suit and features will best suit your diving. Things as simple as suspenders, were not included on my suit, I added them on my own, but that simple piece of support is very nice on a warm SI. If, I would have a rented suits with that to begin with I would have purchased a suit with it installed, instead of trying to recreate the wheel after the fact.

Dont rush in to buying a suit just to have one. Learn and decide which suit to get based on your needs.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I am kind of middle of the road on the issue of new or relatively new divers going with drysuits.

Bouyancy control is more demanding as you will either be using the suit for bouyancy or you will be using the BC for bouyancy and adding air to the suit as required to offset suit squeeze. In both cases you will be managing the same total volume of air, the differnce is in where the air is located and there are trade offs each way.

If you use the suit for bouoyancy you will only have to manage one volume of air with one set of valves and can focus on bouyancy only as suit squeeze elimination is a free bonus. The down side is that you have a larger potential volume for the air to fill if you get into an out of control ascent. And the penalty for being over weighted is more severe as it means you need more air in the suit and this large volume of air expands and contracts more and is more work to manage. Past a certain point, additional air in the suit is also very destabilizing.

Given that new divers are often over weighted (as many have problems with unconsiously kicking their feet when they are upright on the surface and need to descend) a dry suit and managing bouyancy this way can be a bad idea.

If you use the BC for bouyancy control, you have to manage two air volumes which increases task loading which can be a bad idea for a new diver. And if you are overweighted, you will have the problem of increased workload from the extra air, plus the extra task loading required to manage the suit to avoid suit sqeeze. Some divers do not leave enough air in the suit which can in some cases make venting the air difficult and after a they have a couple of problems I have seen relatively new divers develop a fear of not being able to vent and spending entire dives in a squeezed suit and often negatively bouyant. Not exactly relaxing a relaxing way to dive. And if the diver is squeezed the suit's ability to insulate properly is compromised, so the diver is cold anyway.

So whether a drysuit will be a good idea for you depends on your ability. Some students just intuitively understand and develop a feel for bouyancy. Those types of students will do well in any type of suit. Other students seem to have a much harder time and are always yo-yoing their way through dives. They do well in neither type of suit until they get adequate experience and for those students a drysuit could be a very bad thing leading to uncontrolled ascents, possible injury and or a lack of comfort in the water and a decision to stop diving.

If you do go the dry suit route, a dry suit class is a must.

As for brands, DUI is well respected but about half the purchase price is for the DUI tag sewn on the suit. It is great if you have the money and/or enjoy the snob appeal that comes with owning a DUI.

I bought a Diamond self entry tri-laminate for half the price of a similar DUI TLS 350 and found that the Diamomd's suit material and zipper were heavier, had kevlar knee pads and a wonderful set of si-tech valves and was overall a better suit than the DUI.

Viking and Nokia also make some excellent vulcanized rubber suits. Self entry is not an option but the suits are extremely tough (particularly in 1600 gram weights and are very quick and easy to repair. So if you are planning to spend DUI type bucks, I'd consider them as well.

My spouse uses an Atlan 7mm neoprene drysuit and swears by it. Neoprene suits are warmer in general than a tri-laminate suits as the shell also has a good deal of insulating abilty even without underwear. Neoprene suits also stretch so they can be cut a little slimmer and produce much less drag in the water if properly fitted compared to a properly fitted tri-lam.

She also has well over 300 dives on her suit and it was used when we bought it so it seems to have exceeded the adagage that neoprene suits will only last about 300 dives. The price on neoprene suits also tends to be very good, although as they seem to be having a resurgence in popularity the odds are that the prices will also rise.

At all costs avoid bi-laminate suits. While a tri-laminate suit uses a layer of butyl rubber sandwiched between layers of nylon or a similar fabric and are very durable, bi-laminates use a layer of nylon backed with a clear poly to make the fabric waterproof The fabric is similar to the packcloth used in waterproof backpacks. They are less expensive but also rather short lived as the poly cracks or is abraded over time and develops leaks. They are also more prone to seam leaks and when they start leaking they are nearly impossible to fix.