Use of the long free diving fins while on scuba when spearfishing

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Is it more difficult to start with the freediving fins? Does it require a long time to get used to them and not get cramps in the legs?


No. You keep looking for the catch... LOL.. My kids were scuba diving with freedive fins when they were 9 or 10 yrs old. you must be thinking that there just has to be a good reason that most scuba divers are using a "scuba" fin.. You could also ask your self why a vast majority of scuba divers have not adopted the elastic rubber weight belt that almost 100% of all freedivers use. I'm a big fan of rubber belts over nylon ones and/or weight integrated pockets on a BC.

If you are a big fan of BP/W, you could also ask why a huge majority of recreational divers are using "normal" jacket BC's too.

In my experience, I TRY to copy the DIR stuff as much as I can (I adopt things piece meal from their recommendations) and I also generally follow the gear used by freedivers as much as is possible. I take what I think is best.

Also, some day if you care to experiment, you would be amazed at how much warmer and flexible freedive suits are compared to similar thickness scuba suits. The difference is pretty significant there as well.

Freedivers have a long history of using low or ultra low volume masks, I think some scuba divers are just now beginning to realize the benefits of scuba diving with a freedive mask as well.
 
Is it more difficult to start with the freediving fins? Does it require a long time to get used to them and not get cramps in the legs?
Just like anything, you have to get used to them but it's not a big deal.
At first they may seem to be a bit hard to move but after a few sessions they will get easier and once you develop the muscles needed to use them well there will be no going back. After you get used to freedive fins you may want to try a pair of regular scuba fins or better yet split fins and you'll get a good laugh at how weak everything else will seem.
 
Also, some day if you care to experiment, you would be amazed at how much warmer and flexible freedive suits are compared to similar thickness scuba suits. The difference is pretty significant there as well.

Freedivers have a long history of using low or ultra low volume masks, I think some scuba divers are just now beginning to realize the benefits of scuba diving with a freedive mask as well.

You bring up the point about the freediving suits that I was going to bring up next :)

Do they hold the thickness well with constant diving to deeper depths and staying there in contrast to free diving?

Why does it matter to the scuba diver to use a free diving mask?
 
You bring up the point about the freediving suits that I was going to bring up next :)

Do they hold the thickness well with constant diving to deeper depths and staying there in contrast to free diving?

Why does it matter to the scuba diver to use a free diving mask?
I'm sure Dumpster will respond, but I wanted to take a stab as well.
I like freedive suits because they are skin-in meaning they are slick neoprene and need to be lubed up to get in with a 25% hair conditioner 75% water solution (I keep in a spray bottle). What this does is puts the actual neoprene closer to your skin making it warmer plus the suit acts like a seal on your whole body not just on wrists and neck seals. They are also made from very high grade neoprene, usually Yamamoto which is the finest money can buy. They are very flexible and nice. Third, the cut of the freedive suit is found to be the warmest with an attached hood and beaver tail top over a farmer john bottom, but most of the bottoms have a thinner top and shoulder straps so that it tapers down and reduces the amount of space between the shoulder straps and the top to eliminate water from sitting in the gap.
I have a 7mm Yazbeck that I use for Ab diving, but then one day I though I should try it for scuba and it's now my go to suit for both. Yazbecks are about $400.
Then the low vol mask is just a better way to go across all points. It fits better, the glass is closer to your eyes making for a wider field of view, with the volume being super low there isn't a bunch of air trying to pull the mask up on your face, they're a snap to clear with very little air used (essential for freediving), they're also very low drag for all that extra speed you'll be enjoying.
Freedive gear is designed for speed and efficiency, so people who want the same in scuba can benefit form freediving gear technology in a big way.
 
You bring up the point about the freediving suits that I was going to bring up next :)

Do they hold the thickness well with constant diving to deeper depths and staying there in contrast to free diving?

Why does it matter to the scuba diver to use a free diving mask?


A typical freedive suit is made from a jacket and pants. the inside is smooth rubber. This makes the suit slide on easier (when you use a lubricant) but it also reduces the exchange of water in and out of the suit.. so it is warmer.

The elimination of the additional nylon lining on the suit also enhances flexibility (which is more important on thicker suits).

The freedive suit has no zippers.. so no leakage

The freedive suit has an attached hood, so zero leakage around the neck.. You don't need to have a tight, constricting, uncomfortable neck seal at the junction of the hood and jacket, because there is no opening there to leak. The only water that can get into the hood is through the face seal and this is typically near zero.. in fact the smooth rubber seals so well you MUST let water into the hood initially or you will get an external ear squeeze.

The freedive suits are typically soft flexible neoprene, but it is not magic.. It compresses as do all other foam neoprene products.

What is important to understand is WHY a freediver would need a warmer, better suit. Typically, I think a 3 mm freedive suit is as warm as a 5 mm scuba suit - even when using a hood. When freedivers descend their chest crushes (a lot) and they lose a lot of buoyancy. Their suit compresses as well - just like a scuba diver. BUT scuba divers have a huge advantage, their chests don't crush AND they just press a button and offset (compensate for) the suit compression. Freedivers HATE this buoyancy swing!

Freedivers need to float at the surface, then FIGHT to descend against excess buoyancy and then when they pass a depth of maybe 30 feet or so, they reach neutral and after that, they just get heavier and heavier and begin to sink fast. So freedivers need to once again FIGHT buoyancy (this time negative buoyancy) to ascend AND they do this 20 or 50 times EVERY day.

As you can imagine, freedivers want to minimize this swing as much as possible.. So to do this they must have the thinnest suits possible. The thinner the suit the less the compression and this reduces the buoyancy swing and the easier it is to get down and up.

So hopefully you get a the picture why a freediver wants the thinnest and warmest suit they can get away with. Hoods are essential for providing thermal protection - with the least amount of rubber. So except for very warm water, hoods are pretty much always used and any kind of zipper is going to be avoided.

Also, i should mention that the freediver needs to really take large inhalations and the more restricted their belly and chest is, the harder it is to freedive.. so they demand a flexible, comfortable suit.

Freedivers want a small mask. As you approach a depth of around 80 or 90 feet, your chest is so crushed that it is impossible to get more air to equalize your ears. There are special techniques (not that I personally can do any of it).. but the point is that your air reserves for equalization become minimal even as you approach 60 feet. Every molecule of air you exhale into your mask on descent is air that can not be put to good use elsewhere. So there is a significant benefit to using a small - low volume mask.

Scuba divers have all the air in the world and mask equalization is not an issue. However, the latest generation of super low volume freedive masks are very comfortable, very easy to clear (and equalize) but some also provide EXCELLENT visibility. there is essential zero peripheral vision restriction - why? because the glass lens is so close to the eyes, that you can see up down and to the sides. It is sort like sunglasses..

The benefit of a very low volume mask to a scuba diver would be that it will not become an issue when dealing with strong currents, say when descending down an anchor line in a heavy current. With a big scuba mask, we hear about people saying they turned sideways and the current started to rip the mask off their face..

The benefit to scuba divers is less than for freedivers, but I have probably 20 masks in the garage and I use the same one for scuba and freediving.. there is no reason for me to switch masks when doing either activity.

Also.. a slightly leaky mask is a minor pain to a scuba diver.. For a freediver who is swimming face down in a vertical position , any water that leaks in is going to cover the entire inside of the face plate and destroy your ability to see, until you level off. This is a MAJOR pain in the butt, and you have no air to be putting into a mask to blow out water that leaked in because the air leaked out on descent... so once again,, a freedive mask MUST seal super well or it is not really functional.
 
I forgot to add one thing, freedive suits also don't have any zippers so leakage is non existant. The only water getting in will be from the bottom of the jacket but it takes a while and has a chance to warm as it seeps in. This is minimized by picking one with a good fit.
Freedive suits are more of a hassle to get on and off, but the payoff blows away any drawbacks. People see me out on the side of the road or in a parking lot with my little carpet out and my lube bottle, then contorting trying to slide into the thing with no zippers, but compared to standard scuba wetsuits there's no camparison. Scuba suits are made for convenience for people to try on in the store. Freedive suits are made to work like nothing else, but there is a price in the form of a slight hassle. Shops that specialize in selling freedive suits know the drill. They'll have a shower stall with a door mat on the floor to stand on. It's a messy deal and it takes time. A lot of times they have you make an appointment so a sales person can work with you one on one and find the perfect suit. They'll have you trim your nails and remove all jewelry and watches before you slide in one.
The last thing, freedive suits being skin in dry out quickly and never stink. The hair conditioner keeps them smelling nice and they dry so fast. The hair conditioner will make your skin feel wonderful after a day in a freedive suit.
I've spent over 6 hours in a 50 degree ocean freedive spearfishing and abalone harvesting and never got cold. We'll spend the entire day out on the ocean in Norcal with our kayaks and our freedive suits and just have so much fun!
 
Eric and DumpsterDiver have covered pretty much all the advantages of freedivng gear.

I use DiveR fins and love them. They have taken a beating and are holding up really well (just a few scratches from rocks and no signs of stress what so ever).

One thing to add to the freedive suit discussion would be adding a scupper. When I am out on/in the water for several hours at a time having a scupper fitted comes into its own - and my dive buddies appreciate it as on the drive home in the car from a remote site I do not smell like a goat. (and am also warmer during the dive day as there is less liquid in the suit to cool down)
 
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Excellent suggestions and advice from Eric and DumpsterDiver. It seems to me that many scuba divers are ill-informed about freediving and freediving equipment. I use a custom fitted Elios wetsuit, a 2mm two piece freedive wetsuit, with a hoody. This wetsuit is warmer than my scuba 3mm wetsuit. The streamlined fit and the soft and stretchy neoprene is wonderful. I also have a 3mm zipped freedive wetsuit from Elios with built-in hood. Although I typically dive in warm waters in SE Asia, with strong upwelling, the SST can be between 18* to 24*C. The 3mm freedive wetsuit is way warmer and less buoyant than my 5mm old wetsuit- - I am serious. I use the zipped full freedive wetsuit for work, with 3-4 dives per day, it super easy to put on and take off, no soaping needed.

I use a prescription mask, so it is not as low volume as a freedive mask. I do use a freedive mask for freediving. These masks are way more easy to equalize if you do deeper than say 20-25m.

If you decide to purchase a custom-fit freedive wetsuit, get a professional fitting. There is no "catch" here, the equipment really shines with respect to performance and fit.

Check out Elios at http://www.eliossub.com or go to A GUIDE TO ORDER A TAILORMADE ELIOSSUB SUIT for a slightly out of date post about freedive wetsuit materials.
 
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The vast majority of SCUBA divers in my area use Freediving fins only. They give you the power when you need it and the power to kick ratio is much higher.

Most use the cheapest plastic blades. I have a pair of Cressi plastic blades that are three years old. No problem other than surface scratching.
 
The vast majority of SCUBA divers in my area use Freediving fins only. They give you the power when you need it and the power to kick ratio is much higher.

Most use the cheapest plastic blades. I have a pair of Cressi plastic blades that are three years old. No problem other than surface scratching.

I am very curious about freediving fins. Would like to try them out, but not spend too much on the experiment. Do you know anyone with small narrow feet looking to sell ?

Can't find anything used on ebay in my size. The most inexpensive I can find for new in my size is the Mako for $89. The Mako's look interesting because you can change the blade.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/perdix-ai/

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