Why a Back-Inflate BC Instead of BP/W

[cool_hardware52]

I was definitely planning on ordering from there. The pix are a big help. So here's the question...it's been sort of answered. Since there is one buckle, this is the only adjustment point. Do you undo the buckle and loosen the harness to don and doff? If so, is it like tying your shoes where you have to retighten each point...shoulders, etc? Does the tension sort of keep everything in place? I'm not sure if I'm being clear, but I'm just trying to not only gauge how difficult the thing is to put on and remove, but also how easy it is to adjust, and if that adjustment stays once you get it all figured out.

With a single piece "Hogarthian" Harness the shoulder straps pass through the plate and become the waist strap. If you need to lengthen the shoulder straps you pass some of the waist strap back through the plate. To shorten the shoulder straps you do the reverse.

Hogarthian Harnesses are widely adjustable, but you won't do it while wearing the harness. DSS plates include a feature, molded keepers in the lower slots, that make any adjustment self retaining. This is also possible with non DSS plates by using a "triglide" or weight belt keeper "behind" the plate.

Correctly threaded a Hogarthian Harness will retain it's adjustment.

Opening the waist belt buckle releases the harness. The crotch strap has a loop at teh end that is passed through the waist strap. Open the waist buckle will release both the waist strap and the crotch strap.

I realize that divers who are used to a fabric BC may have a hard time picturing how a BP&W can remain stable without cinching down the shoulder straps after you put on the rig.

The answer lies in the plate. With a rigid backplate supporting the tank, all the harness has to do is keep the gear centered. The combination of shoulder straps, waist strap and crotch strap accomplish this without being cinched down tight.


Tobin

 

[halocline]

You adjust the shoulder straps once and leave them fairly loose, loose enough so you don't restrict your arm movement, but not so loose that the straps are floating around. It's easier to figure out the correct fit than you might think. The webbing is kept in place with "keepers" which are clips that slide on the webbing and keep it from sliding back and forth through the plate. The DSS plates have these nifty plastic bushings that hold the webbing in place without the keepers.

There are a couple of ways to get in/out of the harness. There's the "chicken wing" method, where you slide your hand up under on of the straps from behind, there's the "shrug" method where you basically let the harness slide off your shoulders, and you can easily use your right hand to push the left shoulder off or vice versa.

 

[String]

Okay, newbie question.....after reading all this, why would anyone use a standard BC?

Easy to adjust so if changing between thick drysuits and pool its done in seconds. Easy to give to someone else for same reason. Easier to remove.
That's about it really.


However if you're comfortable with it then where is the problem? Its perfectly possible to trim out in a BCD underwater despite some claims otherwise. If its fits you, you're comfortable with it then there's no issue.
Personally i dislike the movement in a BC and the way it rides up on the surface no matter how much you tighten up but others like it.

 

[String]

Also, adjusting the various segments of the harness to get a proper fit would be really helpful.

DIR-diver.com - Adjust the backplate

Don-doff depends how flexible you are, how tight you like your harness and where you're doing it (on a bench, in the water etc). Various methods depending on the person and setup.

 

[TSandM]

The people I know who have tried to put a quick release in a Hog harness have eventually replaced it with continuous webbing. It's just difficult to find a place to put the release where it's easy enough to reach to make it useful, and not in the way of the D-rings.

Why would anybody use a BC? Because it's what they know, and what they see, and what they're sold. Despite the slightly greater hassle factor of a BP/W in some respects (eg. pockets), VERY few people ever switch and go back.

 

[String]

The people I know who have tried to put a quick release in a Hog harness have eventually replaced it with continuous webbing. It's just difficult to find a place to put the release where it's easy enough to reach to make it useful, and not in the way of the D-rings.

6" webbing loop on a buckle placed just below the d-ring works well from all the people i've seen using it (you only need 1 not both straps done).
I know many people that couldn't get on with 1 piece when RIB diving so put a loop, break or IQ type harness on instead.

 

[Michael Folise]

A few quick thoughts. I have never used a BP/W so I can't comment on that. I have used a regualr jacket bc and a rear inflate BC. I currently use an Aeris Reef Rider rear inflate BC-see picture. Here are the advantages: dry weight 5 lbs, packs small for travel, no inherent bouancy, streamlined like a BP/Wing, two big pockets. The main advantage (I would guess) over a back plate is that in warm shallow water (e.g. beach diving in summer in Hawaii) I just wear a bathing suit and a long sleeve rash guard. The Reef Rider in lined in something like a suede/short nap felt. It is extremely comfotable. Without a wet suit I only need 6lbs of weight (9lbs with a 0.5mm full suit for deeper dives). I don't know if I could do this with a BP/Wing. I have never used the shouder stap releases. Also, no issues with tank (Al 80) moving about. To get out I just loosen the straps. Integrated weight pouches are a part of the BC so I dont have to pay extra for a ditchable system. Finally, cost-I have seen this BC on sale for less than $300.00. I never saw a BP/W combo for less than $800.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Finally, cost-I have seen this BC on sale for less than $300.00. I never saw a BP/W combo for less than $800.

You need to shop around a bit more.

We offer complete BP&W's for well under $500.

Tobin

 

[LeadTurn_SD]

A few quick thoughts. I have never used a BP/W so I can't comment on that. I have used a regualr jacket bc and a rear inflate BC. I currently use an Aeris Reef Rider rear inflate BC-see picture. Here are the advantages: dry weight 5 lbs, packs small for travel, no inherent bouancy, streamlined like a BP/Wing, two big pockets. The main advantage (I would guess) over a back plate is that in warm shallow water (e.g. beach diving in summer in Hawaii) I just wear a bathing suit and a long sleeve rash guard. The Reef Rider in lined in something like a suede/short nap felt. It is extremely comfotable. Without a wet suit I only need 6lbs of weight (9lbs with a 0.5mm full suit for deeper dives). I don't know if I could do this with a BP/Wing. I have never used the shouder stap releases. Also, no issues with tank (Al 80) moving about. To get out I just loosen the straps. Integrated weight pouches are a part of the BC so I dont have to pay extra for a ditchable system. Finally, cost-I have seen this BC on sale for less than $300.00. I never saw a BP/W combo for less than $800.

First the price issue: You can put together a very good BP/W for $400 - $525 or thereabouts. I'm in the process of doing that now (switching from a jacket-style BC to BP/W). Deep Sea Supply sells excellent complete rigs for single tanks in that price range. And Hammerhead currently sells it's heavy-guage SS backplate with a heavy SS STA for $110. HOG harness costs around $40 or so, or you can make your own out of 2" webbing. Wings vary in price between brands and lift capacity, but you should be able to get a 30lb single tank wing for <$300 (see Oxycheq wings at ScubaToys). A pair of cam straps should be <$50.

Next, the comfort issue You can dive a BP/W with just a t-shirt on (in warm water that is ).

When I started diving here in Hawaii, we used "cam packs", a hard plastic backplate with HOG -style harness, and no BC at all. Later I "upgraded" and used a bare aluminum plate, with curved aluminum "arms" that went over your shoulders and a waist strap (these may have been unique to Hawaii in the 70's, not sure). Again, no BC, t-shirt only. Hard as it is to believe, in the water, you barely feel these types of rigs.

The bottom line is to use whatever you are most comfortable with, but BP/W's are quite comfortable and fairly affordable.

Safe Diving.

 

[Gombessa]

Also, with a SS bp/w you're talking about 6-8lb negative buoyancy, even more with a weighted STA. I know of many warm-water bp/w users who don't need ditchable weight at all.