Why do caves close to diving?

[TSandM]

My last trip to Florida, we did a dive in Peacock where the viz was very low. The cave we were in was dark; I had only the map we had gone over and what I could see as a reference. It was an uncomfortable dive, and I'm not sure any of the three of us (two of whom had been there before) were 100% sure where we were. Yes, we had our bread crumbs . . . we could always get back to where we had been. But it wasn't a happy dive. Why would you WANT to dive in those conditions?

 

[TONY CHANEY]

I understand that the rivers rise and the caves along the Suwanee get blacked out from time to time but why close them off? One of the best dives I did was in Orange Grove sink where there was 5-10' vis for the first hundred feet of the cave. It made it a completely different dive from the dozens of others that I have done in that same spot. Why not just have a "Dive at your own risk" policy and let those that don't mind low visibility dive anyway? We all go through low visibility training so what's the big deal about a tannic cave?

I was just wondering what others thoughts were on this and if there was a legitimate reason that the parks around FL closed off the caves because of low vis.

Ever been in a cave when it starts to reverse? I have and it sucks....really sucks. You go in and it is 50' vis and coming out it is about 5' and cold. We entered Peanut with little to no flow (springing) and we went out againt flow (syphon). Care to plan your gas on a system that changes? After we got out they closed the park. One heck of a full cave training dive.

 

[Redshift]

Some people are saying it's not nice to dive in low viz or that they wouldn't want to. That's fine, but it's not a reason to close the caves. Some people may not mind.
But if the parks feel that it increases the risk to a level they are not willing to accept, then it's their prerogative.

Now this is bad viz! (Sorry it's from Facebook)

[video]https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=142322442630233[/video]

 

[SillyQuestions]

There are plenty of sump divers who dive expecting nothing but full blackout conditions on every dive.

It depends whether you're diving to go somewhere or diving to dive. Also what you're used to.

I dream of 15feet! A lot of the time I dream of being able to see my gauges without a special gauge reader. So I personally don't mind starting a dive in blackout vis.

But what do most divers in Florida do? Dive in big pretty caves with nice gin vis? That's what you train for. If they don't let you dive in Florida without seeing your cards, why expect them to let you dive outside them?






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[kensuf]

I have a canoe but my double 104's are tough to get in and out of it. I can't really afford a boat though. ****, I can hardly afford Ginnie when the rest are closed...

A ginnie pass will pay for itself with a dozen visits, and it allows you to go diving any time you feel the urge. Many of us use it as a way to unwind during the week.

 

[tbone1004]

the sump diving analogy is really a bad one though because they dive because they have to, water is a nuisance preventing them from seeing the rest of the dry cave, they also aren't generally diving any great distances, but even if they are, the goal is not to dive, it's to see the rest of the cave. If there was a cloud in the dry cave where vis was 5' they probably wouldn't go in, so bad analogy there.

Closing the caves is a CYOA policy, CDS is going through a lawsuit right now that is utter BS and should have been thrown out of court but it wasn't, so why would the state risk a lawsuit from an idiot entering the cave at 0 vis and not being able to get out. Also, what the heck are you planning on seeing while you're there? No point in going in for fun if you can't see anything. Plenty of caves don't have this issue, go to one of them, drive up to JB or down to Ginnie depending on where you are in Florida, you can get passes for either of them that pay for themselves relatively quickly and they very rarely get blown out. JB is 6 days to pay for itself, Ginnie is 15, but it's still not bad if you are close.

 

[CamG]

Tickler this topic has been discussed by several of us for sometime.
The State Parks are closely monitored by a committee that make recommendations of when to open once conditions close a system.
When tannic water intrudes or the caves reverse they become very dangerous and can be unpredictable.
I have been in Peacock when the colums of tannic water intruded from the floor of the cave.

Although quite beautiful in one way water temps dropped and vis steadily declined.
I think the liability issues are a driving force behind closures.
As stated there are river caves that you can access at your own risk.
You call your shots so to speak.
If you are up to it dive safe and within your limits.

CamG

 

[TONY CHANEY]

Some people are saying it's not nice to dive in low viz or that they wouldn't want to. That's fine, but it's not a reason to close the caves. Some people may not mind.
But if the parks feel that it increases the risk to a level they are not willing to accept, then it's their prerogative.

Now this is bad viz! (Sorry it's from Facebook)

[video]https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=142322442630233[/video]

Yea, I did talk alittle about the vis but moreso pertaining to the change of flow. Your Facebook picture would be dream vis in the Cooper river (inches) or in the quarries that we dive.

 

[SillyQuestions]

It's not bad TIL you need a gauge reader!


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[LiteHedded]

there are only a handful of caves that close like this