Primary Light OVER long hose, right?

[Reg Braithwaite]

I understand I am supposed to route my "wimpy" can light cord over the long hose. I understand this is a change in procedure, and that there was much rollicking fun discussing the issue.

However, I have tried a search and couldn't find any posts here on the subject of the correct routing. So...

Am I correct in that I should go OVER the long hose?

If so, I imagine the reason is so that if I clip it off, I won't accidentally "capture" the long hose. Are there any other benefits that I am missing?

And finally... if the light in on my right hand, donating the long hose is easy. But if it's in my left hand, I am going to need to sort things out to extend the long hose. I am trying t imagine the procedure but failing... I have been practicing my modified S drill as follows:

1. Offer the reg with the right hand on the hose next to the reg, pulling the hose over the head.
2. Grasp the hose next to the reg with the left hand, keeping it extended.
3. use the right hand to clear the hose, extend it, and make sure it is not kinked or snaged.

All my limited brain can imagine (without the benefit of--you know, diving with a DIR diver) is that after extending the reg with the right hand, I do a switcharoo to take the light head in the right hand before grasping the hose with my left. Then I can put it on my right hand or clip it off.

What simple, obvious thing (besides time in the water) am I missing?

Pointers to links would be appreciated... thanks...

 

[coldsmoke]

... I have been practicing my modified S drill as follows:

1. Offer the reg with the right hand on the hose next to the reg, pulling the hose over the head.
2. Grasp the hose next to the reg with the left hand, keeping it extended.
3. use the right hand to clear the hose, extend it, and make sure it is not kinked or snaged.

All my limited brain can imagine (without the benefit of--you know, diving with a DIR diver) is that after extending the reg with the right hand, I do a switcharoo to take the light head in the right hand before grasping the hose with my left. Then I can put it on my right hand or clip it off.

What simple, obvious thing (besides time in the water) am I missing?

Pointers to links would be appreciated... thanks...

I don't know of a video clip to point you to but you pretty much got it. The only thing to add is that you don't clip off your light and you don't leave it in your right hand.

If you are doing a full S drill then once your buddy is breathing from the reg, but before you deploy the hose you reach your right hand around the hose (between the hose and your buddy - basically following the light cord) and grab the light head and re-route between the hose and your body and back to you left hand. Then you fully deploy the hose.

If you are doing a modified s drill then you do pretty much the same thing except you now have to manage the second stage as well. I do this by transferring my light head to my right hand in a temporary hold and then reach around the hose with my left and to grab the light again before I transfer the reg to my left to deploy the hose. (hope that made sense)

One of my friends came up with a very slick way to do the modified s that makes it much simpler and cleaner. It might me hard to explain without video, but basically you take your long hose reg and pass it under the light cord right off the bat and to your left hand. You then clear if from your canister. To stow it you do that in reverse. Takes just a second and there's much less light flashing around.

Hunter

 

[rainman_02]

I understand I am supposed to route my "wimpy" can light cord over the long hose. I understand this is a change in procedure, and that there was much rollicking fun discussing the issue.

However, I have tried a search and couldn't find any posts here on the subject of the correct routing. So...

Am I correct in that I should go OVER the long hose?

If so, I imagine the reason is so that if I clip it off, I won't accidentally "capture" the long hose. Are there any other benefits that I am missing?

And finally... if the light in on my right hand, donating the long hose is easy. But if it's in my left hand, I am going to need to sort things out to extend the long hose. I am trying t imagine the procedure but failing... I have been practicing my modified S drill as follows:

1. Offer the reg with the right hand on the hose next to the reg, pulling the hose over the head.
2. Grasp the hose next to the reg with the left hand, keeping it extended.
3. use the right hand to clear the hose, extend it, and make sure it is not kinked or snaged.

All my limited brain can imagine (without the benefit of--you know, diving with a DIR diver) is that after extending the reg with the right hand, I do a switcharoo to take the light head in the right hand before grasping the hose with my left. Then I can put it on my right hand or clip it off.

What simple, obvious thing (besides time in the water) am I missing?

Pointers to links would be appreciated... thanks...

Don't practice things before Fundies unless you have a competent mentor handy. You'll just have that much more to unlearn.

However, after I get all settled in I would be happy to dive with you and help you out. No promises on being a competent mentor though!


The over/under discussion has been had many times, but this kind of confusion is simplified by routing the light cord UNDER the long hose EVERY time you clip or unclip...however that adds the possiblity of "trapping" the long hose if you forget and pass it under to your left hand and then clip it off after passing it over (in reality the long hose is no more trapped than when you route the cord OVER the long hose.


Bottom line, for an S-drill or a no-poop OOG you grab the primary in your mouth with your right hand and hand it (and/or swim) to the OOG diver. Your light stays in your left hand. No one really cares what your light beam is doing at this point unless you're shining it in the OOG diver's eyes. Then he or she might care. Once you get situated (OOG diver has gas now) you grab the light head in a right hand temp hold and pass it between the long hose and your body to untangle the cord and hose. Then you put it back on your left hand normally. Now you undo the loop of long hose from underneath the can (only if needed in a real OOG situation, an S-drill is more about the muscle memory).

Hunter, how does your buddy's method keep from shining in the OOG diver's eyes when he has the reg in his left hand?

However, with a little in-water SA, you can do the same thing Hunter is talking about without grabbing the reg in your left hand. Like so:

1) See OOG diver
2) Grab long hose next to reg, pull from mouth, duck head briefly and pass the hose over your head
3) With right hand, pass the reg/hose under your light cord and hand reg to OOG diver
4) Once OOG diver has a good grip on the hose, withdraw your hand back under the light cord (this leaves the light cord on the correct side of the hose)
5) With the right hand, reach down and free the remaining long hose by "windmilling" or "chicken winging" it
6) Wait a potato or two and ask the OOG diver if they're OK


Capite?

 

[coldsmoke]

Hunter, how does your buddy's method keep from shining in the OOG diver's eyes when he has the reg in his left hand?

I am not exactly sure what you are asking, but the reg should only be in your left hand for a modified s-drill not a full s-drill. With a modified s-drill there isn't an OOG diver.

I think you are describing the same method that I am trying to except you did a much better job. I would however, question doing it for anything other than a modified s-drill.

Hunter

 

[rainman_02]

Alright, a better question then is:

When you're training muscle memory by the drill, why train different memory than you will need in a real situation?

 

[Reg Braithwaite]

Don't practice things before Fundies unless you have a competent mentor handy. You'll just have that much more to unlearn.

Sadly, I don't practice because I can, I practice because I can't NOT practice. It's just something I do, the way I learn things: Consume information voraciously, try things, let my body learn things, and then unlearn and relearn things when I have access to instruction and mentoring.

But I appreciate the advice.

 

[rainman_02]

There's something out there you'll hear about (if you haven't already). It's called the Law of Primacy.

"What you learn first you learn best."

I've seen it in action as I learned the valve drill one way and now it is another. Also, as light cord over or under (I was first trained under and now it is over). I've seen it in myself when I was taking Tech 1...during normal diving I was fine and "in trim"...under stress I was still fine but had a tendency to go vertical because that was the first way I was trained to dive.

Reinforcing bad habits now will cause you frustration in Fundies, trust me. (This is the much nicer way of saying JeffG's favorite phrase: "Learning to dive on the internet is a bitch")



YGPM.

 

[coldsmoke]

I don't really think this is a question of muscle memory. (Although I do agree with the premise).

It is my understanding that a modified S-Drill is to show to your buddy(s) and yourself that your long hose is fully deploy-able. It is not to build muscle memory for OOG situations.

An S-Drill OTOH, is to train a reaction to an OOG situation. Here I can see practicing only the way that you want to execute the motion in a true emergency.

This is why I don't practice a full s-drill the way I would preform a modified s-drill. (ie - handing off the reg under the light cord) I am not sure that I would be comfortable having to pass the reg under the light cord before I could get gas to my buddy. Seems like too much indirect movement that has potential to complicate the donation. Perhaps if I practiced it more I would change my stance, but I don't think so. After all, the only reason I prefer the method the two of us are describing (for a mod s only) is because it alleviates the need to juggle the second stage and the light head. In an OOG situation you don't need to manage the second stage after you hand if off, making it much easier to unloop your light cord.

Hunter

 

[coldsmoke]

Sadly, I don't practice because I can, I practice because I can't NOT practice. It's just something I do, the way I learn things: Consume information voraciously, try things, let my body learn things, and then unlearn and relearn things when I have access to instruction and mentoring.

But I appreciate the advice.

I felt the same way - especially before fundies. What I can say is that if you want to practice something then just practice your buoyancy and your ability to stay motionless in the water. All of the other things that you will learn (properly) in Fundies will be much easier.

The best way to get ready for the class is to work on the basics and just dive. I am pretty sure that no matter how hard/much you practice, if you are doing it without good mentoring then you aren't making a pass any more likely and you could very well be making it harder.

Just my 2 cents.

Hunter

 

[rainman_02]

Makes sense. I was thinking you were talking about a mod-s as a drill and not a pre-dive check.