Questions for Ex-NAVY Divers

[DiveVagabond]

Hello Scubaboard, my names Nathan. I'm a 22 year old inactive PADI/SSI dive instructor who has spent the majority of the last 4 years backpacking around the world. I'm not nearly done traveling but I am also looking for a bit more stability in life. I have been looking at the possibility of joining the NAVY Dive program for a while now and feel I am finally ready to do so. I spoke with a recruiter about a year ago and he said that I definitely qualified and he could get me in, but from talking to a lot of past military members I have met, they are not to be trusted. As I don't know anyone who has actually gone through the program I'm hoping to find some answers here:
What are the realities of joining the NAVY Dive Program? What benefits have you actually received during and after your service? Is there a way to guarantee Dive School in your contract and what is the best way to go about it (getting it in writing, verifying a slot being held for you with the school, having a lawyer look over contracts)? What does your job becomes if for some reason you go through basic and can't get in? How would you describe your experiences in the program and what tips to get through would you have for someone new to it?
I do realize that this is NOT recreational diving. It's a lot of hard work and training and I am prepared for that. I am not some kid looking for a free party who needs to be told to rethink his options. I've been rethinking my options for four years. I am also fairly politically neutral, so if you are here to either talk me out of it due to government ethics or sling a bunch nationalistic pride about, Please Do Not Respond.
I am simply looking for the facts of what this program has to offer and the realities of what it can deliver.
Thank You

 

[Rich Keller]

What is it that you want or expect to get out of Navy diver training? Are you looking to make the Navy your career or take what you learn there and use it in a civilian job? If you want to become a commercial diver you would probably do better going to commercial diving school if that is your interest.

 

[T.C.]

No, a recruiter can't be exactly trusted. It's like a car salesman; they have a quota, and they'll tell you what you WANT to hear. That's not to say they'll lie, but it'll seem really cool, and a great deal....until you're in.

You don't just *join* the Navy dive program. You have to first be selected for it, then you have to qualify for it, then take the extremely arduous school...then you *may* become a Navy Diver. There is ABSOLUTELY no way that the recruiter can say you're qualified for this. NONE.

Benefits are standard across the service; there's a wide variety of websites covering this.

For the Navy; no, there likely no way to guarantee entrance into Dive School. As I said, there's a selection and qualification process for it. They don't just take joe blow off the street for the elite program. And no, you won't be able to have a lawyer look over your enlistment contract. The actual enlistment contract will be signed at the Entrance station, NOT the recruiter’s office. The good news, it's a standard form, so you can easily see where it says what you're supposed to get.

If you somehow do get a contract to go to dive school after basic training, and fail (which I think 60% of the selectees do), your rate (your job) will become what's known as "Needs of the Navy". Ever wonder how the Navy gets people to enlist for jobs that no one would do? This is one way. You'll be involuntarily re-classed into whatever the Navy needs you to be- cook, paper-pusher, supply clerk...

No, I don't think you realize either the physical requirements of this school. Well-trained and very fit Sailors and Soldiers enter the school, and few graduate. After a few years of touring the world, you'll not be ready for their requirements. And if you do get in- don't say ANYTHING about your instructor rating, or previous dive experience. You'll become the instant "favorite" of all the instructors, and that won't be fun.

I don't think you realize what you're getting into with the military. Are you willing to sacrifice your life for the requirements of the United States? Would you be willing to suit up and dive in on a job you KNOW that will kill you? Joining the military is NOT something you do *just* for stability, or to have a job as you 'relax' from your 4 years gallivanting the world; which is what it sounds like you're after.

I'd recommend you look into commercial dive training.

 

[Teller]

null

With the draw down going on right now the military doesnt need alot of people to join. The standards to get in are getting harder and harder. I dont think you have to worry about him lieing to you because if you dont want to join someone else will. Call another recruiter from a different office to confirm what the first guy told you. Good luck.

 

[Doubler]

A recruiter can give you a written guarantee that can take the diver physical test but not that you will pass it. SEAL training is demanding with Navy Diver being a notch below but still very demanding. A Navy Diver is many steps above a commercial diver in that you will be diving and not spending years tending. Good luck if you go for it.

 

[DiveVagabond]

No, a recruiter can't be exactly trusted. It's like a car salesman; they have a quota, and they'll tell you what you WANT to hear. That's not to say they'll lie, but it'll seem really cool, and a great deal....until you're in.

You don't just *join* the Navy dive program. You have to first be selected for it, then you have to qualify for it, then take the extremely arduous school...then you *may* become a Navy Diver. There is ABSOLUTELY no way that the recruiter can say you're qualified for this. NONE.

Benefits are standard across the service; there's a wide variety of websites covering this.

For the Navy; no, there likely no way to guarantee entrance into Dive School. As I said, there's a selection and qualification process for it. They don't just take joe blow off the street for the elite program. And no, you won't be able to have a lawyer look over your enlistment contract. The actual enlistment contract will be signed at the Entrance station, NOT the recruiter’s office. The good news, it's a standard form, so you can easily see where it says what you're supposed to get.

If you somehow do get a contract to go to dive school after basic training, and fail (which I think 60% of the selectees do), your rate (your job) will become what's known as "Needs of the Navy". Ever wonder how the Navy gets people to enlist for jobs that no one would do? This is one way. You'll be involuntarily re-classed into whatever the Navy needs you to be- cook, paper-pusher, supply clerk...

No, I don't think you realize either the physical requirements of this school. Well-trained and very fit Sailors and Soldiers enter the school, and few graduate. After a few years of touring the world, you'll not be ready for their requirements. And if you do get in- don't say ANYTHING about your instructor rating, or previous dive experience. You'll become the instant "favorite" of all the instructors, and that won't be fun.

I don't think you realize what you're getting into with the military. Are you willing to sacrifice your life for the requirements of the United States? Would you be willing to suit up and dive in on a job you KNOW that will kill you? Joining the military is NOT something you do *just* for stability, or to have a job as you 'relax' from your 4 years gallivanting the world; which is what it sounds like you're after.

I'd recommend you look into commercial dive training.

Gee TC, between all your *"Quotations"* and tough guy act, you almost actually helped me!

I understand that you don't just sign a piece of paper and get the job. I'm not pretending that I fully comprehend the physical demands and dedication it takes to get this ranking, but who are you judge what I'm made of without ever meeting me? I've got the dedication to earn this if given a fair shot, I just got to know this is worth fighting for. I did however notice that your page has you listed as US Army NOT US Navy, with less than 500 dives, so unless you magically changed branches in the past 24 hours, I'd appreciate it if you'd let someone whose actually been through this training respond. Cheers'




---------- Post added January 29th, 2014 at 09:13 PM ----------

A recruiter can give you a written guarantee that can take the diver physical test but not that you will pass it. SEAL training is demanding with Navy Diver being a notch below but still very demanding. A Navy Diver is many steps above a commercial diver in that you will be diving and not spending years tending. Good luck if you go for it.

Ok, so say I pass the Physical test. Could I then get a slot in the school in a written guarantee from the recruiter or would those select few admissions be handled by the Diver administering the tests from those that passed the initial examination?

 

[Darkforeboding]

First off let me say that I got out in 1983. I'm sure things have changed a huge amount since then. Here are some things that might still apply.

To be a Navy diver you don't necessarily have to be a SEAL. SEALs used to be (if I heard this correctly) a special group among people that were on the UDT (Underwater Demolition Team) and some of the UDT team did other things like research and review diving practices. The guy that originally certified me NAUI and PADI (not as part of a Navy program) was a former UDT diver that had been in the Navy Experimental Dive Unit (EDU), the same group that did a lot of the research for the decompression tables.

Almost every Navy ship has a diver, as it's routine to do a hull inspection underwater before leaving port. It's especially routine before leaving a foreign port. That being said there are several rates (jobs) that are more usually divers than others, although I guess almost any rating can go to dive training. The guys that I knew that were divers were Machinist Mates, Hull Technicians, and other rates related to mechanics and ship repair.

Non-UDT shipboard divers go to a class but you have to be recommended by your command (ship or Commanding Officer) after you get assigned there. On a smaller ship it probably wouldn't be difficult to get sent to dive school. Especially if you were able to get in good with the current ships diver or divers. Once you get to dive school, though, you really don't spend much time at all learning diving, or at least you didn't before I left in '83. Instead you spend the majority of the day jogging and exercising. Like I say, that might have changed since I got out, but the divers I knew told me that dive class consisted of running until the instructor let you stop, then you would do exercises, then run more. Sometime in the course they would get around to some classroom time and teach you some dive tables and other things, but mostly it was exercise. Then towards the end of the course when a lot of people had been washed out they would teach you a little diving. I get the impression they try to wash out as many guys as possible. The guys telling me this weren't trying to scare me, either as they knew I had no plans on being a ship's diver, they were just telling me what it had been like.

So in my opinion the easiest route if you really REALLY wanted to be some kind of Navy diver would be to join for a hitch, be a Machinist or something similar, try going to a smaller ship, like a frigate or maybe a tender might be a good choice, then get in good with the divers there and request dive school. Then work like hell to pass.

DFB

 

[Akimbo]

…So in my opinion the easiest route if you really REALLY wanted to be some kind of Navy diver would be to join for a hitch, be a Machinist or something similar, try going to a smaller ship, like a frigate or maybe a tender might be a good choice, then get in good with the divers there and request dive school. Then work like hell to pass…

Navy divers are a primary rating as of 2006, rather than a secondary like when we were in. Here are the current training schedules as of a few months ago.

Scuba: 25 training days, 6 classes per year
Second Class Diver: 89 training days, 8 classes per year
First Class Diver: 65 training days, 4 classes per year

More information is available at:
Naval Diving and Salvage Training Center

All enlistment contracts are subject to “the needs of the Navy” so there is never an absolute guarantee. The Navy is doing very little deep diving these days. Most work is limited to ship's husbandry, which is mostly done in harbors. They are just getting their only saturation diving system after decades so only the most experienced guys will get a shot at it or EDU.

Here is a link to the Navy’s Faceplate Magazine

You can see what is going on in Navy diving today.

 

[Darkforeboding]

Do they still have a requirement to do a hull inspection on every ship before leaving port? If so, every ship must have a diver and I doubt if they keep a specialized diver on a small ship. Do they still carry diver as a secondary rating?

DFB

 

[BVickery]

Gee TC, between all your *"Quotations"* and tough guy act, you almost actually helped me!

I understand that you don't just sign a piece of paper and get the job. I'm not pretending that I fully comprehend the physical demands and dedication it takes to get this ranking, but who are you judge what I'm made of without ever meeting me? I've got the dedication to earn this if given a fair shot, I just got to know this is worth fighting for. I did however notice that your page has you listed as US Army NOT US Navy, with less than 500 dives, so unless you magically changed branches in the past 24 hours, I'd appreciate it if you'd let someone whose actually been through this training respond. Cheers'




---------- Post added January 29th, 2014 at 09:13 PM ----------



Ok, so say I pass the Physical test. Could I then get a slot in the school in a written guarantee from the recruiter or would those select few admissions be handled by the Diver administering the tests from those that passed the initial examination?

Just so you know all Branches send their people to the Navy School. I knew a U.S Army Diver and went through the U.S.N Dive School. I also was looking at being a Navy Diver like you before giving up on it due to tons of medical issues that prevented me from joining. So even though a person may be Army, Air Force or Marines, they can still offer insight into the Dive School.