Misunderstanding at the dive shop

[mbs]

NY upstate vs downstate is not unfriendly at all, just they way it is Coming from in between I'm like Switzerland, everybody likes us - or maybe the reverse

 

[Scared Silly]

Just maybe theses are older alum tanks and required an eddy test?

The eddy test is only required at hydro … what is done yearly is a scuba industry standard (and I use that term loosely).

 

[Peter69_56]

I can only tell you my experience, I am not a tech.

Every time I purchase a new tank I ask for the O2 clean sticker. This means that when they assemble the tank they will use a vitron O ring and an O2 compatible lube. That's it. No extra charge. In fact, I think most dive shops do this with all new tanks now anyway. The one shop that does PP fills does. Otherwise they couldn't fill their own tanks. The other shop, I always make sure I ask.

Thereafter, you make sure that only "hyper filtered" or Modified Grade E air is used to fill.

As for additional O2 cleaning, so far with VIP's, I have not been required to repeat the cleaning but I assume that when Hydro's are needed they will be O2 cleaned again then.

Never assume anything. They are usually only O2 cleaned after hydro in OZ if you ask for it, its not just done, and is an extra cost.

For me to have my yearly hydro, inspection, O2 clean tank and valve is about $100. I have 10 tanks so $1000/year hence why I did a complete hydro/inspection course and O2 clean course.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Never assume anything. They are usually only O2 cleaned after hydro in OZ if you ask for it, its not just done, and is an extra cost.

For me to have my yearly hydro, inspection, O2 clean tank and valve is about $100. I have 10 tanks so $1000/year hence why I did a complete hydro/inspection course and O2 clean course.

Why do they do hydros every year in Autralia? That just seems like overkill and bad for the tank. Wouldn't that just create more problems than it would try to solve?

 

[redacted]

The eddy test is only required at hydro … what is done yearly is a scuba industry standard (and I use that term loosely).

I ran into a shop in south TX that requires a VE on every Al tank every year. Not really a problem since the shop down the street had no such stupid requirement.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I actually think you made a mistake, and should own up to it. You asked about a hydro, they told you about the hydro. The VIS is not a hidden charge, it is an additional service.

You can call up your auto dealer and and ask what a tire will cost. They may then volunteer -- but you really should ask -- that there is also off/on charges, disposal, balancing, labor, taxes, whatever.

At the LDS you didn't ask the right question(s). Your bad, not theirs. Next time, tell them you need a hydro, and ask them what the bottom line will be to make your tank ready to dive again.

OTOH, the shop prices do seem high!

... so do you run your dive business on the "caveat emptor" business model? Do you expect your students to always "ask the right question" ... and if they don't, you withhold critical information about the course you're teaching?

VIS is not an "additional service" ... it's a necessary follow-on to a hydro, since you cannot get a tank filled without it. Any reasonable dive shop employee would know this, and should ... if they care anything at all about the well-being of their customers ... volunteer full disclosure on the cost of making the tank available for normal use.

I'd shy away from any business, particularly a dive business, who treated their customers with the "gotchya" attitude you describe ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

---------- Post added July 22nd, 2015 at 08:00 AM ----------

OP-IMO you have had a valuable life lesson.
The question you needed to ask was not the one you did ask.
The question you needed to ask was "what will the TOTAL cost be?" Preferably in black and white on paper or an e mail.

... isn't it a shame that there's this adversarial relationship between dive shop and customer ... and even more that so many people seem to think that's somehow normal?

No wonder so many shops are going out of business ... and internet sales have become so popular ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[tursiops]

... so do you run your dive business on the "caveat emptor" business model? Do you expect your students to always "ask the right question" ... and if they don't, you withhold critical information about the course you're teaching?

VIS is not an "additional service" ... it's a necessary follow-on to a hydro, since you cannot get a tank filled without it. Any reasonable dive shop employee would know this, and should ... if they care anything at all about the well-being of their customers ... volunteer full disclosure on the cost of making the tank available for normal use.

I'd shy away from any business, particularly a dive business, who treated their customers with the "gotchya" attitude you describe ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Seems like the signal is being lost in all the noise, and in my error on calling it a hydro when in fact it was an O2 clean.

My point it that the OP asked a question ("How much is an O2 clean?") and got an answer. The shop guy answered the question that was asked.
Why does it have to be that the LDS is trying to cheat and defraud?
Sure, the LDS could volunteer all kinds of additional info, like the cost of the next shop trip to Bonaire, or the cost of a new BCD, or even the cost of an Advanced Nitrox class to give more value to the O2 cleaning. I'll even stipulate the LDS could just ask, do you want a VIP/sticker as well? That would be gentle upselling, and would have avoided the problem.

But the OP said in his OP that he made an assumption, and that was his mistake. Then he said later that he didn't see why you needed a new sticker after the O2-clean when the tank already had one on it. So, we've got a bad assumption followed by some bad knowledge. And he has learned something, including the outrageous prices at the shop he went to. All in all, not a bad deal, and nobody got hurt.

 

[RandomGuy1]

You are right, I did learn something. To avoid that shop. I already knew that if you take the valve off it wound need a VIP. My mistake was when I asked how much it would cost me to get my tanks O2 cleaned, that it would include the entire cost. If I take my car to the shop and ask to get the brake pads replaced, I don't expect to be quoted the cost for installing the brake pads, and then when I come back, get a bill for extra for inspecting the brakes after they changed the pads.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

My point it that the OP asked a question ("How much is an O2 clean?") and got an answer. The shop guy answered the question that was asked.
Why does it have to be that the LDS is trying to cheat and defraud?

Given that logic, I think a more relevant question would be "why did the dive shop then provide and charge for a service that wasn't requested?

Sure, the LDS could volunteer all kinds of additional info, like the cost of the next shop trip to Bonaire, or the cost of a new BCD, or even the cost of an Advanced Nitrox class to give more value to the O2 cleaning.

... because that information isn't relevant to what the customer asked for ... apparently the VIP sticker is ...

I'll even stipulate the LDS could just ask, do you want a VIP/sticker as well? That would be gentle upselling, and would have avoided the problem.

But the OP said in his OP that he made an assumption, and that was his mistake. Then he said later that he didn't see why you needed a new sticker after the O2-clean when the tank already had one on it. So, we've got a bad assumption followed by some bad knowledge.

Exactly my point ... either the service is required, in which case it should have been included with the quote, or it's not required, in which case it should not have been done. You can't have it both ways. The inevitable conclusion is that the dive shop did ... in fact ... cheat the customer, either by withholding information about the full cost or by providing and charging for a service that wasn't needed.

And he has learned something, including the outrageous prices at the shop he went to. All in all, not a bad deal, and nobody got hurt.

I disagree ... to my way of thinking both parties got hurt. The customer got hurt by being hit with charges for services he didn't ask for ... and the business got hurt by losing this person as a potential future customer.

Dumb way to do business, to my concern ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[BRT]

I actually think you made a mistake, and should own up to it. You asked about a hydro, they told you about the hydro. The VIS is not a hidden charge, it is an additional service.

You can call up your auto dealer and and ask what a tire will cost. They may then volunteer -- but you really should ask -- that there is also off/on charges, disposal, balancing, labor, taxes, whatever.

At the LDS you didn't ask the right question(s). Your bad, not theirs. Next time, tell them you need a hydro, and ask them what the bottom line will be to make your tank ready to dive again.

OTOH, the shop prices do seem high!

We sell tires. The big name competition adds on everything. Don't know if they still do but they used to sell a 15 cent valve stem for $3 extra. So our tire business model is to include everything in the tire price including sales tax. The locals have been vaccinated (you know, when you feel that little sting?) so they ask us about balancing, valve stems, etc. We tell them they can bring a check made out for the amount we are quoting. Our tire business has been growing really fast.