Buy Dan Travel Insurance At Your Own Risk. Did You Know This?

[VaeVix]

Well it is at least understandable that DAN excludes this kind of incident from their travel insurance. First it concerns quite a minority of the diving community with a higher risk of accident and second the costs can be quite significant. "Hi dude, I got a hit on a prep dive for a 20 people expedition on the other side of the world, please refund everything" has no place in a general purpose insurance (it would make "ordinary divers" subsidize extreme diving) , it can be insured but this needs some specialized underwriting (and I'm sure DAN would provide an appropriate quote, once the dive plan and so on is submitted).

Their policy seems to be : if you get a medical/diving problem we'll cover the costs in any case (and they can run high), not covering a potential thousand or so in lost hotel reservations if you were into tech/solo diving seems fair game to me. And if you organize a super-expensive expedition, getting specialized insurance coverage, on-location medical staff and so on is part of the organization.

 

[gr8jab]

Well it is at least understandable that DAN excludes this kind of incident from their travel insurance. First it concerns quite a minority of the diving community with a higher risk of accident and second the costs can be quite significant. "Hi dude, I got a hit on a prep dive for a 20 people expedition on the other side of the world, please refund everything" has no place in a general purpose insurance (it would make "ordinary divers" subsidize extreme diving) , it can be insured but this needs some specialized underwriting (and I'm sure DAN would provide an appropriate quote, once the dive plan and so on is submitted).

<conversational tone>
Hi VaeVix... do you think that diving without a DM should be considered 'extreme diving' ? I just don't get that.
</conversational tone>

<authoritative voice>
The meat-n-potatoes of this whole thing is that DAN is a diving organization, and should be sure that any product they offer is diver friendly. This is obviously not. It wreaks of pure profiteering.
</authoritative voice>

<cynical voice>
Imagine AARP offering auto insurance, but excluding claims for accidents at night. Old eyes... right?
Imagine the Sierra Club offering accident insurance, but excludes hiking in the woods.
Imagine TurboTax selling audit insurance, but excludes you if your refund is over $3000.
</cynical voice>

Bad DAN. Bad bad DAN. My opinion of you has diminished greatly.

 

[Steve_C]

In many areas most of the diving is without a DM. All my dives are to recreational depths, all but a handful above 100 fsw, and maybe 30 were lead by a DM. I hardly think of diving a reef off key largo to be extreme diving.

 

[Cert1967]

DAN isn't the insurance company. They market the policy - undoubtedly receiving a commission - for Generali US Branch, the insurance company underwriting the plan.

Similarly, the AARP Medicare Insurance is marketed by AARP - the insurance company is United Healthcare.

Sierra Club markets travel insurance plans underwritten by US Travel Insurance.

AARP auto insurance is The Hartford.

DAN, just as AARP and Sierra Club do, lives with the good and bad reputation that is attributable to the underlying insurance product.

 

[Altamira]

Vaevix,
Your logic escapes me. Since other travel insurance companies do not penalize a certified diver for diving without a DM (see all of my posts on this issue), I do not not find it understandable that DAN, a company that caters to divers would have such a ridiculous policy. Contrary to your opinion, there are a lot of qualified divers that do not need or use a DM except for occasions required by local regulations or dive op policy, and these divers do not, IMHO, have a higher risk of accident. Nor are tech divers necessarily any more at risk than other diver groups. In fact, I would contend their training and equipment would generally tend to make them a lower risk group than a typical group of out-of-shape, non-current, and inexperienced, three dive days a year divers. In addition, not all high cost diving is large scale, 20 people expeditions. Check out the cost for an 11-14 night Paul Gauguin cruise to Polynesia. On such a cruise, If I got hurt on a first day shore dive with my dive buddy, without having a DM with us, the financial cost of forfeited cruise, non-refundable hotel costs, and airline ticket issues would be substantial.

My whole point of posting this problem is that the offending wording is buried deep in the insurance contract, and if you miss, or do not fully understand that critical phrasing, it could cost you dearly.

We are all adults, and free to make our own decisions with reference to buying insurance of any type. But, if I stumble across something that divers are not likely to know about a particular policy that they might use, and I think it could unnecessarily harm them financially, I sure as hell am not going to sit on that information.

 

[mcohen1021]

.....

 

[lerpy]

Altamira, your concern seems to be if you have an issue or injury then you should get a refund on your trip, I think what the majority of people are more worried about is that the injuring and costs associated with it are covered. If I get hurt here in at home and have to end my ski vacation early my healthcare does not cover the loss of my three week ski trip if I get hurt on the first day. Personally if I was hurt diving and missed out on the rest of my trip I think I would just be happy I was ok and the loss of money that I spent on the trip is less of a concern. But maybe I am misunderstanding a difference between travel insurance and medical coverage for when I am in the US. I was recently in Florida diving and got an ear infection diving, had to quit diving after a week of the three weeks I was there, I did not expect my insurance to cover me not being able to dive and refund me that, but it covered the medical cost which is what is important to me.

 

[gr8jab]

DAN isn't the insurance company. They market the policy - undoubtedly receiving a commission - for Generali US Branch, the insurance company underwriting the plan.

Similarly, the AARP Medicare Insurance is marketed by AARP - the insurance company is United Healthcare.

Sierra Club markets travel insurance plans underwritten by US Travel Insurance.

AARP auto insurance is The Hartford.

DAN, just as AARP and Sierra Club do, lives with the good and bad reputation that is attributable to the underlying insurance product.

Yup. DAN is just a 'reseller', putting their name on another's product. I think DAN has an obligation to be sure that product is diver friendly.

 

[gr8jab]

Altamira, your concern seems to be if you have an issue or injury then you should get a refund on your trip, I think what the majority of people are more worried about is that the injuring and costs associated with it are covered. If I get hurt here in at home and have to end my ski vacation early my healthcare does not cover the loss of my three week ski trip if I get hurt on the first day. Personally if I was hurt diving and missed out on the rest of my trip I think I would just be happy I was ok and the loss of money that I spent on the trip is less of a concern. But maybe I am misunderstanding a difference between travel insurance and medical coverage for when I am in the US. I was recently in Florida diving and got an ear infection diving, had to quit diving after a week of the three weeks I was there, I did not expect my insurance to cover me not being able to dive and refund me that, but it covered the medical cost which is what is important to me.

Well, your point is valid. Most people will be concerned that the injury/accident and costs therein are covered.

However, remember that the travel insurance is a separate policy from the DAN accident insurance, and purchased in addition to accident insurance. The travel insurance premium is paid to specifically protect your investment in the vacation, and covers things like lost luggage, bad weather, canceled flights, and apparently incidents while scuba diving with a DM above 120'.

 

[Lorenzoid]

. . . Check out the cost for an 11-14 night Paul Gauguin cruise to Polynesia. On such a cruise, If I got hurt on a first day shore dive with my dive buddy, without having a DM with us, the financial cost of forfeited cruise, non-refundable hotel costs, and airline ticket issues would be substantial. . . .

Isn't that scenario atypical? Doing a shore dive during a cruise? I would think the most typical high-ticket item for which someone might seek claiming a loss if they got hurt as a result of diving and couldn't continue with the trip would be on a liveaboard or dive resort, and those are typically done with a DM. Sure, there are many resorts where you can do shore diving, but shore diving usually isn't the main draw. It's typically boat diving (with a DM) with unlimited shore dives from the house reef. If you do avail yourself of the shore diving, you're probably not going to get bent on the house reef. No doubt there are exceptions--some resort that is renowned for its shore diving--but insurance is geared toward the typical traveler. If your trip is a special case, get special insurance to cover it.

I get your point that DAN's travel insurance has an exclusion that most others don't, and that it would make sense for DAN to offer travel insurance that has benefits geared toward traveling DIVERS as opposed to tourists who might do a dive here and there during their vacation. But I don't see the exclusions likely impacting the average traveling diver that much. For dive accidents, most of us already have DAN accident insurance. We would look to travel insurance mainly to cover trip cancellation and interruption, and DAN's travel insurance does cover that, so long as the interruption wasn't due to diving over 120 feet or without a DM.

I appreciate your bringing these silly exclusions in DAN's policy to our attention. There is apparently better travel insurance out there than DAN's.