Solved: Who am I talking to?

[lowviz]

@The Chairman

Dear sir,
Would you consider making dive professionals (DM and above) immediately distinct from 'just divers' on this fine social board? I gain a lot of insight by being able to determine the 'flavor' of the poster and have recently been greatly surprised to learn of their professional status. I find this to be most unsettling.

It matters. You (posters) are or aren't posting as a professional. The unwashed massed don't always know this. Your SB persona does not reflect this as it should. No, we aren't all the same. Professionalism comes with obligations, titles, and transparency.

Show yourselves...

 

[lowviz]

And how would you even know; does the OP expect you to personally verify every professional's credentials? ...

No, no!!! Now I see your concern. I've been looking at it from the other side of the issue.

I would only be interested in whether or not the poster CONSIDERED him/herself to be a dive professional. Nothing legal or binding. The word 'professional' gives one a lot of latitude.

Checkbox on profile: Do you consider yourself to be a dive professional? Y/N. If yes, put a discrete but special border around the avatar.

Yes, that's it. Feels right. What I was trying to get across in my first post.

 

[RayfromTX]

With

Understood ... but sometimes it's helpful to consider the audience ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

all due respect sir and there are few I respect as much as I do you, whether a diver is new is not a primary indication of whether a Perdix is a good choice. A Perdix is for tech divers, excited about their future divers, divers with means who enjoy nice tools and any diver that demands to own the best when it comes to their gear.

We bought ours when we had 11 dives. My wife told me to forget the 150 dollar special or the i300. She said we are going to be divers for a long time. Let’s not waste money buying something that we will soon want to replace. It was a huge investment for us with the transmitters. Aside from our aow instructor fees, it is by far the best money we have spent. Too each their own eh?

 

[100days-a-year]

Meh,I often discount professionals advice in lieu of advice from people with practical experience.Several of the worst divers I've dove with were instructors or DMs with a lot of book,pool and quarry diving but were hopeless in the ocean.

Wookie aside,as many of my respected friends have dove with him,same goes for charter captains.

 

[The Chairman]

so you think it's appropriate to be telling a brand new diver they should spend $900+ on a dive computer with capabilities they'll probably never use, and an algorithm that can easily get them in trouble if they misprogram it?

Wow. I don't recall ever giving that advice. Are you now suggesting that the Perdix is unsafe at any depth? Or that a new diver is incapable of reading literature, including SB and using the Perdix safely? Or possibly that no one could abuse the other PDCs?

See? These semi-rhetorical questions that try to cast the other party in an unflattering light are pretty bogus. Of course, you never suggested any of those things, just like I wouldn't suggest that a diver use a piece of equipment that they don't understand. It's misleading and relies on fear mongering. However, lots of newbies love the Perdix and recommend them to other newbies. They don't try to dive it outside of their understanding just like a person with a backplate and wing won't try to do the Doria because they have one. Guess what, Shearwater's growth is in the recreational sector. Perdix PDCs are flying off the shelf and they are being bought by Joe and Jane diver. Apparently, they feel pretty comfortable with the new technology. Who are we to tell them "you're gonna die!"??? More to the point, do you have actual incidences of new divers getting hurt on their Perdix? I certainly haven't heard of any.

 

[TMHeimer]

For what it's worth, and I'm fully aware my opinion is not really worth anything - I agree. I don't think there's anything deliberately nefarious going on with pros who hide the fact that they're a pro in most cases. I do think that whether they admit it or not, a pro usually has some affiliation with a shop or other business that sells dive gear. In my mind, that devalues their opinions on gear recommendations. It would be nice to be able to easily sort out the "customer" opinions from the "salesmen" opinions.

I think @The Chairman has already made clear his position and reasons for it, so there's not really anything to debate. However, I thought it would be nice to let @lowviz know that he's not alone in his perception that this is a less than ideal situation.

Regarding your point about a pro usually having some affiliation with a shop or other business that sells gear--- I assisted more than a dozen instructors at the shop here and can't recall one instance where an instructor recommended that a student buy anything from the shop. Some of them worked retail as well. It may be because our shop kinda has a monopoly on business in the area. This may not be the case elsewhere, but I don't know if "usually" is the correct word.

 

[northernone]

Meh,I often discount professionals advice in lieu of advice from people with practical experience.Several of the worst divers I've dove with were instructors or DMs with a lot of book, pool and quarry diving but were hopeless in the ocean.

Wookie aside, as many of my respected friends have dove with him,same goes for charter captains.

I'm echo this.

We all have various strengths related to diving... Some are strongest safely on shore

I'd be interested in knowing those who are posting who are "professionals" meaning making a sustainable living (or donated significant parts of life) from the diving industry.

They are interesting folks.

Otherwise, personally, I put such low value on the pro level certifications, it's virtually meaningless to me if a poster is a "pro". I respect wisdom and experience. Those can be found in every diver. That's why I love the forum.

Let the people be heard.
Cameron

 

[T.C.]

Checkbox on profile: Do you consider yourself to be a dive professional? Y/N. If yes, put a discrete but special border around the avatar.

I feel like that would have even less value. If it's something just anyone could select....

Unless it's verified with a agency ID number or a shop affiliation, I wouldn't take anyone's advice as a professional. I don't think many people would. And if I did need professional advice, I think I would ask a local instructor in person, and compensate them for their time and advice.

 

[lowviz]

I feel like that would have even less value. If it's something just anyone could select....

Understood, but that is how I would like it.

So if I'm trying to help an "unknown" along who has identified him/herself as a professional, I'm going to either pass or proceed with the utmost caution.

It is my continued observation that true newbies are absolutely thrilled to get an honest hand-holding answer to a question that has been answered scores of times. And no, I don't need to chastise them for not using search. Give them a bit of time. They'll get it.

Help me sort out the 'wizards' from those who just want a civil answer and maybe even a 'like'.

 

[MichaelMc]

Understood, but that is how I would like it.

So if I'm trying to help an "unknown" along who has identified him/herself as a professional, I'm going to either pass or proceed with the utmost caution.

It is my continued observation that true newbies are absolutely thrilled to get an honest hand-holding answer to a question that has been answered scores of times. And no, I don't need to chastise them for not using search. Give them a bit of time. They'll get it.

Help me sort out the 'wizards' from those who just want a civil answer and maybe even a 'like'.

I would think that if one is trying to help, and providing their best honest answer, finding that the questioner was a pro and did have some background knowledge should not suddenly put your answer at risk. Sure, maybe it could raise the level above the basics from then on, but it should not imperil what you already said.

Years ago I was wandering an electronics store when a fellow customer, hanging out in the computer section, told me how I really wanted some machine, because of X. I said I was thinking of getting one as a server for my development work or as a file backup machine. They instantly evaporated, clearly deciding they no longer wanted to tell me all about these machines. And I was not at all unkind in my response. I thought it was reaally funnny, and wondered if they went back to their hangout post after I left, ready to offer helpful advice as long as the listener knew less than them.

Plus as people have said, there is not some strict relationship between titles and knowledge.

 

[Wookie]

Meh,I often discount professionals advice in lieu of advice from people with practical experience.Several of the worst divers I've dove with were instructors or DMs with a lot of book,pool and quarry diving but were hopeless in the ocean.

Wookie aside,as many of my respected friends have dove with him,same goes for charter captains.

<head swells> thank you for the kind words, but I'm a butthead just like the rest. Ask most anyone...