AOW before Tech?

[rjack321]

I would have liked to do the sidemount course, but entry level is cave 2. While i do understand why the entry level is cave 2, i don't fully agree with them.

You have no business being in a sidemount passage unless you are full cave (cave2) with a few dives (25+). If you aren't experienced enough to actually be in sidemount sized passage then you should be in backmount and have access to all of your gas and all the other positives of backmounted doubles. There is no place in GUE for sidemount zealots who aren't versatile enough to pick the right tool for the job. I know plenty of divers who sidemount everything (even when its a bad idea) or have no idea how manifolded doubles actually work (so they make poor buddies) - don't be that diver.

 

[Doby45]

You have no business being in a sidemount passage unless you are full cave (cave2) with a few dives (25+). If you aren't experienced enough to actually be in sidemount sized passage then you should be in backmount and have access to all of your gas and all the other positives of backmounted doubles. There is no place in GUE for sidemount zealots who aren't versatile enough to pick the right tool for the job. I know plenty of divers who sidemount everything (even when its a bad idea) or have no idea how manifolded doubles actually work (so they make poor buddies) - don't be that diver.

There is a huge difference in being in a sidemount passage and taking the class. There is no reason at all that you should be not be allowed to take sidemount unless you are already full cave. Seems one more reason that people view GUE as the zealots. I did most of my Intro dives in sidemount and my full cave training. Do I also dive doubles, you bet. But to paint with such a broad brush harkens back to the days of DIR Nazis and strokes. Don't be that guy.

EDIT: Every time I even think about dipping my toe into the GUE pond, I see crap like this. Holier than thou and it reeks. Now go ahead and stand on your high post and proclaim that anyone that feels that way is just not "good enough" or whatever but you absolutely are doing GUE no favors.

 

[PfcAJ]

EDIT: Every time I even think about dipping my toe into the GUE pond, I see crap like this. Holier than thou and it reeks. Now go ahead and stand on your high post and proclaim that anyone that feels that way is just not "good enough" or whatever but you absolutely are doing GUE no favors.

Because you're looking for someone or some agency to confirm what you want to be true?

 

[Doby45]

Because you're looking for someone or some agency to confirm what you want to be true?

HUH, that makes no sense? I am not looking for an agency or person to do anything for me. I greatly respect you @PfcAJ and I think we see eye to eye on a lot of things, but the snarky attitude that exudes from some of the GUE fanboys, flat out sucks.

 

[admikar]

Let me disagree. If you have good driving skills can you exceed speed limits? Answer is no. The same is here. There are prescribed limits in different certifications.

Speed limits are not recommended. Every standard for recreational diving has that word in their limits section. That's the difference.
As for CMAS3* I can talk only about my country. At the moment, all diving is conducted according to your cert agency. So, for me, it is PPO of 1,4 and backgas deco. There is only my club's limit on equipment, like doubles, redundant buoyancy device etc.
Croatia for example has a depth limit on air, but the problem is, it is not stipulated by a law, but with an ordnance (sorry, don't know correct term for this) so even if you are caught breaking that limit, you just walk away. Or any other diving offence that is not covered by some other law. And there is no mention of any other breathing medium. @Vicko might know more about this.
Montenegro has a law, which has no mention of maximum depth at all, not even the: "as authorized by the agency".

 

[PfcAJ]

HUH, that makes no sense? I am not looking for an agency or person to do anything for me. I greatly respect you @PfcAJ and I think we see eye to eye on a lot of things, but the snarky attitude that exudes from some of the GUE fanboys, flat out sucks.

There ARE good reasons to not dive SM unless you're an experienced cave diver looking to dive in small passage.

But that statement is somehow transformed into holier than thou?

Naw.

 

[Doby45]

There ARE good reasons to not dive SM unless you're an experienced cave diver looking to dive in small passage.

But that statement is somehow transformed into holier than thou?

Naw.

okie dokie

 

[rjack321]

There is a huge difference in being in a sidemount passage and taking the class. There is no reason at all that you should be not be allowed to take sidemount unless you are already full cave. Seems one more reason that people view GUE as the zealots. I did most of my Intro dives in sidemount and my full cave training. Do I also dive doubles, you bet. But to paint with such a broad brush harkens back to the days of DIR Nazis and strokes. Don't be that guy.

EDIT: Every time I even think about dipping my toe into the GUE pond, I see crap like this. Holier than thou and it reeks. Now go ahead and stand on your high post and proclaim that anyone that feels that way is just not "good enough" or whatever but you absolutely are doing GUE no favors.

You do realize that my GUE days are a decade ago? Lol
I backmount, sidemount, and have 2 rebreathers - and neither of them are JJs with onboard 50s like GUE uses. So I am about as strokey as can be.
And
I recommended that the OP take AOW before "tech" - because he (she) needs AOW to get on some boats to build experience and its only a couple days investment so I don't see any good reason to skip it. AOW is also a prerequisite for rescue which is also valuable - and far outside of DIR.

 

[Preach]

You have no business being in a sidemount passage unless you are full cave (cave2) with a few dives (25+). If you aren't experienced enough to actually be in sidemount sized passage then you should be in backmount and have access to all of your gas and all the other positives of backmounted doubles. There is no place in GUE for sidemount zealots who aren't versatile enough to pick the right tool for the job. I know plenty of divers who sidemount everything (even when its a bad idea) or have no idea how manifolded doubles actually work (so they make poor buddies) - don't be that diver.

I have full ( tech) cave, and i dive both (started sidemount diving last year). I mostly preffer backmounted doubles, its what i used with more then 90% of my dives logged.
You say you have to pick the right tool for the job, and i mostly agree, but there can also be a downside to this.

Someone that always dive sidemount, will be much more efficient and safer with his gear then someone that just picks his sidemount set once in a while to just make "that" dive. Especially if that dive is a challenging restricted dive.
I think its better to start learning stuff early, instead of learning it in the most challenging conditions.

Your point is that you always want access to all of your gas, this is the best point for not diving sidemount. But if you make a proper gas planning, there is a lot that should go wrong before things really get bad.

 

[Germie]

First not every diver need every course. Drysuit or intro to tech can bbe usefull, but some can do without.

Sidemount diving doesnt mean you have to do narrow passages in caves. Some prefer the equipment as lighter or more versitile. Or because of backproblems.

After cave 2 is way too late for some divers. This will change in a few years. Then you can do a sidemount primer and do it earlier. Same as ccr has changed now (was not allowed) and it will change you can do ccr earlier.
At the end the chimney must smoke is a Dutch way to say: money must be earned.