Instructors: teaching neutrally buoyant

[boulderjohn]

I know I have never taught anything, never having been an instructor. I still feel it is logical to say it is at least somewhat harder for some students to be taught skills neutrally from the get go. Not saying I disagree with it being taught that way at all--I did see an improvement in students on checkout dive 1 in my last year assisting (2015) when more time was spent basically hovering around in the pool (not necessarily while skills took place).

But, here is a quote from someone who HAS experience-- Lynn Laymon, Aug. 2015 article in Dive Training mag.---

"WORD OF CAUTION"
"Removing and replacing the scuba unit is significantly easier when performed while standing on a solid surface, like the bottom of a pool, lake or quarry floor. That is fine for learning the skill and practice. ....., once you become comfortable...try executing it midwater. ..... Be prepared to adjust buoyancy. ... Depending on the type of weighting system you are using, the scuba unit may float up as you sink or vice-versa.....This can be dangerous.....It is important to maintain secure physical contact with the unit and to keep the combination of the scuba unit and your body neutrally buoyant throughout the skill"

Now, removing & replacing the unit was always my worst skill and it actually held up my DM certification.
But in reading this article, logic tells me its harder to do this than to plant yourself on the bottom, particularly if your total prior water experience has been in the shallow end of motel pools on vacation.
Other skills, such as mask clearing, reg retrieval, etc., would seem to be a whole lot easier to do neutrally the first time. In fact, in my own diving and assisting, I have done these on my own and while demonstrating to students very well the first time, without any prior practice doing them neutrally.

My final conclusion from all those other threads was that the reason teaching the skills that can be done neutrally neutral (not that many-- 7 or 8?), is not the main reason students are much better divers after certification (or even on the first checkout dive). I figure it is the fact that while one student does a skill in the pool everyone else is hovering looking at him/her, and not wasting time kneeling on the bottom. That's a lot of neutral practice.

I never said all skills were easier while neutral--some are harder. But think this through for a while. At the end of the same amount of pool times, some divers have had little experience with neutrally buoyancy, and some are able to remove and replace their scuba unit while hovering in mid water.

Which student would you rather be?

 

[MichaelMc]

@TMHeimer, You teach band. Is it easier to teach fundamentals first and then build on them? Or add the fundamentals in the last few sessions?

I think one version of the plan, the Chairman's as I recall, is to swim about or float on the surface on scuba where you are horizontal and planted firmly up by positive buoyancy, do some simple drills that way. While there get weight and weight distribution initially dialed in.

Then swim about with just a bit of you still breaking the surface as that is still very easy, do some drills that way. Fine-tune weight and weight distribution. Get an initial feel for buoyancy control.

Then swim about just subsurface where you might still broach the surface on occasion, do some drills that way. Hey, guess what, you've been getting used to neutral buoyancy that whole time. And as you say, you got lots of practice being mid-water, with balanced weight distribution and horizontal.

 

[TMHeimer]

John, Agree with both your posts. I think it was someone else who claimed they ALL were easier NB.
Do you agree with me that it is mainly the time spent neutral during the course that makes the real difference, rather than learning those few skills neutrally? I don't suppose it matters, as the results apparently speak for themselves either way.
Of course I would rather be the student that can do everything neutral. But I don't think learning stuff on the bottom really hurt ME (maybe others, but I would guess all the instructors on our staff learned on their knees).
Keep in mind your expertise to begin with when you were able to take it on & off better neutrally than on the bottom.

 

[TMHeimer]

@TMHeimer, You teach band. Is it easier to teach fundamentals first and then build on them? Or add the fundamentals in the last few sessions? I think one version of the plan, the Chairmans as I recall, is to swim about on the surface on scuba where you are horizontal and planted firmly up by positive buoyancy, do some simple drills that way. Then swim about with just a bit of you still above the surface as that is still very easy, do some drills that way. Then swim about just subsurface where you might still broach the surface on occasion, do some drills that way. Hey, guess what, you've been getting used to neutral buoyancy that whole time. And as you say, you got lots of practice being mid-water.

I think the Chairman's method is an interesting and very good approach (says me, the relative layman).
Band-- Notes first, rhythms next (some basic rhythms must be taught right after the first note, so the student starts to properly read music-- maybe this is where a lot of hovering in the pool would come in). Last is dynamics and musicality-- you do this when enough notes & rhythms are learned to make it practical to start playing songs musically.
In otherwords, follow any one of the bazillion beginner method books and it works.

 

[VikingDives]

"Removing and replacing the scuba unit is significantly easier when performed while standing on a solid surface, like the bottom of a pool, lake or quarry floor...

Personally, I find that teaching this skill is one of the easiest. Hover vertically and everything's the same. I find it easier than kneeling. The BCD doesn't change attitude so there's no change in buoyancy. I think doing this vertically is safer in open water. It's easier to manage in my experience.

 

[jgttrey]

It's hard to deny that, starting from 0, most skills are a bit more challenging for students when neutral - at first. But that isn't the point. The goal isn't just skills, but to have them comfortable doing so NB by the end of training. The best and easiest way to get there by the end is to start NB from the beginning. More time up front, but less time later. Plus, they are learning buoyancy all along.

It's amazing what students can do when doing the skills kneeling is just never presented as an option.

 

[The Chairman]

I still feel it is logical to say it is at least somewhat harder for some students to be taught skills neutrally from the get go.

The first few minutes might be a bit 'slow' as they get used to being on scuba. Comfort is derived from time in the water. However, once you're over that little bit, they more than make up for any lost time. A balanced, comfortable diver has confidence and can learn as well as retain skills with greater alacrity.

As for you citation of doff and don at depth. It's actually pretty easy if you understand the physics. With a weight integrated BC, you simply keep the BC above you. Instead of moving the BC, you move the diver.

Establish buoyancy in a prone position.
Undo all buckles and loosen left arm strap.
Pull left arm out of strap.
Spin to your left, out of the BC so that you're looking up and the BC is on your chest.
Watch your buoyancy.
Unbuckle your tank and adjust.
Re-buckle tank.
Spin to your right, being sure your right arm goes in the right arm strap.
Tighten left arm strap and buckle all buckles without trapping your hose.
You're done.

If you keep the weight on the cork, there's no problem. If you allow the weight off the cork it becomes an anchor and everything becomes hard.​

 

[Raphus]

I am currently a divemaster in training.
I watched some first pool sessions. And tbh i can not imagine, that some students can hover on day 1 and are able to do skills neutral.

Ofc some can. But i saw other students, that need much longer. And it is unsafe to let them hover in the first session. Or it would take a lot of 1 on1 time, which is not possible during a standart owd.

In my opinion the owd should start on the bottom and over time more and more neuteal hovering. And at the end of the pool session every student should be able do be some kind of neutral.

 

[The Chairman]

But I don't think learning stuff on the bottom really hurt ME

The problem is the rule of primacy. If I learned how to clear my mask while kneeling, and I'm having difficulty with it, I'm going to return to the way I first learned it. I saw this in the Keys all the time. You would see divers stop and kneel on the reef in order to clear their mask. When you teach skills while kneeling you're introducing them to a horrible bad habit. Many never grow out of it.

When you teach all the skills on the knees, the student really has to learn it twice. Many of the skills are markedly different while vertical than when horizontal. Sometimes you don't even notice the difference, but it confuses the hell out of the student. I had been teaching all horizontal for a while when someone asked me how I "did" it. The question floored me. My response was in effect: "don't effin kneel". But over the years, I really see the differences between the two.

Finally, it's a matter of comfort. Every minute you have your student practicing trim and neutral is less effort you'll have to exert managing them. It seemed that almost every class had a "bolter". You know, that one student who panics and tries to bolt to the surface? Here's a clue: they're not comfortable. They're not comfortable because they're not in control. They're not in control because, in many classes, neutral buoyancy is the last skill introduced in the pool. Since I eliminated kneeling, I haven't had a single bolter. My class is under complete control.

And tbh i can not imagine, that some students can hover on day 1 and are able to do skills neutral.

I have not had a student who couldn't hover on the first day. Most can do it after the first hour.I take two three//four hour sessions to train a diver to the point I'll trust them in OW. It doesn't take magic. It doesn't take being a superior instructor. It simply takes a commitment to do it.

 

[Wibble]

Can I ask a dumb question please...

Why would one remove one’s rig underwater? On the surface makes a lot of practical sense especially if climbing onto a boat, but not underwater when there’s a big risk of dropping it and a rapid ascent.

Is this just a "confidence" skill?