Air share

[SlugLife]

Yes, it is.

I didn't recognize that signal either. I don't buddy dive much either, which could contribute.

 

[mc42]

Did you close your fist towards your chest and move it inwards and out? The one in the diagram you posted looks a little dodgy and looks like a hold signal. Standard hand signals:

WRSTC hand signals

 

[Edward3c]

In my book, LOA means 50 bars. It means we end the dive. On the other end, if one has less than that, it might be better to signal OOA.
Now, I understand your point. In all my courses, this signal was understood but if it is not universal, there might be a problem.

Not all agencies teach surfacing with 50bar, some have adopted one 1/3 or 70bar for trainees and those inexperienced.

Yes, it is.

No, the image you show doesn’t have the fist on the chest. It’s held ready to move the lower arm down to signal “I can’t pull my reserve” a throwback to the days of J values. The signal you refer to is actually “I’m on reserve” not I’ve got 50bar. Reserve used to be 30bar.

 

[Blackcrusader]

Never been OOA or had to share air. But in two occasions when I was diving with DMs that I did not know in new locations, I signaled LOA (50 bars). They signaled back Ok and continued the dive, still stopping to see critters or whatever. In both cases, I ended the dive with between 20 and 40 bars and I was pretty much pissed off. I don't care if we are shallow and close to the exit point. At 50 bars, we end the dive. Period. I am so into this rule that unless the surface conditions are really bad, I would deploy my DSMB, surface and swim to wherever I need to exit.

Fact is you chose not to end the dive at 50 bar and continued on. You can end a dive any time you like. No one forced you to continue the dive. 50 bar does not mean needing to end a dive especially if you are at shallow depth less than 10m.

I've seen plenty of divers at the surface with 30 or 40 bar after a safety stop. In most cases guides have made sure people start their safety stop with at least 40 or 50 bar. As divers we are responsible for ourselves regardless of what a DM, guide, or dive buddy does. You should only signal OOA if in fact you are.

 

[SlugLife]

Never been OOA or had to share air. But in two occasions when I was diving with DMs that I did not know in new locations, I signaled LOA (50 bars). They signaled back Ok and continued the dive, still stopping to see critters or whatever. In both cases, I ended the dive with between 20 and 40 bars and I was pretty much pissed off. I don't care if we are shallow and close to the exit point. At 50 bars, we end the dive. Period. I am so into this rule that unless the surface conditions are really bad, I would deploy my DSMB, surface and swim to wherever I need to exit.

I'm reminded of another thread, where the Dive-Guide lead the group into a cavern or cave.

Fact is you chose not to end the dive at 50 bar and continued on. You can end a dive any time you like. No one forced you to continue the dive. 50 bar does not mean needing to end a dive especially if you are at shallow depth less than 10m.

I've seen plenty of divers at the surface with 30 or 40 bar after a safety stop. In most cases guides have made sure people start their safety stop with at least 40 or 50 bar. As divers were are responsible for ourselves regardless of what a DM, guide, or dive buddy does. You should only signal OOA if in fact you are.

I'm going to give this comment a strong +1. We can certainly complain about irresponsible dive-guides, or whether they're liable from a legal or moral perspective. However, it's always the diver's responsibility to look out for their own safety & do the responsible thing.

While solo-diving and abandoning a dive-buddy or dive-group is generally not recommended for standard conditions, every diver should be more than capable of surfacing alone if needed at any point of the dive. If not, they are diving beyond their means & either need to stop doing that or pursue more training.

If my dive buddy doesn't understand my signals, ignores them, or "argues" the only response is "I'm going up" and then to go up regardless of whether they follow or not.

 

[divinh]

I've had a swim against current where I surfaced with 5 bar. :/ We were pretty far from the boat and it was more efficient to swim below than on the surface, which was only 2 m above.

I've had someone in the dive group break off for the surface at 50 bar, since she saw red on the SPG and thought she was out of air. No signals, just went up and up. She hadn't dove in 10 years and didn't take a refresher.

I've had an insta dive buddy wanting to maximize his underwater time, where even though we were all on the surface, he continued to swim around til he reached 10 bar.

 

[ginti]

@Dody some comments:
1) it isn't a smart approach to end ALL the dive at 50bar. It can be not enough at 40m with strong currents, and way too much at 10m. You should discuss the gas planning at any dive.
2) it isn't the first time that you feel the urge to stop the dive, it happened also in the cave. Be more assertive when you want something. If you want to call a dive, call it
3) many signals aren't universal; when you dive with new people, review them (you'd be surprised that some tec guys communicate their gas only with one hand, always). This isn't related to the dive you mentioned, but it's good to think about it

 

[Dody]

Did you close your fist towards your chest and move it inwards and out? The one in the diagram you posted looks a little dodgy and looks like a hold signal. Standard hand signals:

WRSTC hand signals

Page 7 of your link is exactly what I do. Now, as it seems that it is not widely used, I am open to use a more efficient signal.

 

[Dody]

I'm reminded of another thread, where the Dive-Guide lead the group into a cavern or cave.

I'm going to give this comment a strong +1. We can certainly complain about irresponsible dive-guides, or whether they're liable from a legal or moral perspective. However, it's always the diver's responsibility to look out for their own safety & do the responsible thing.

While solo-diving and abandoning a dive-buddy or dive-group is generally not recommended for standard conditions, every diver should be more than capable of surfacing alone if needed at any point of the dive. If not, they are diving beyond their means & either need to stop doing that or pursue more training.

If my dive buddy doesn't understand my signals, ignores them, or "argues" the only response is "I'm going up" and then to go up regardless of whether they follow or not.

That's right that in some occasions, I have followed a DM and I was not happy. In this particular case, I still had air but I breached my own personal rules. I think that I need to learn to say no immediately and not wait for the last minute.

 

[SlugLife]

@Dody some comments:
1) it isn't a smart approach to end ALL the dive at 50bar. It can be not enough at 40m with strong currents, and way too much at 10m. You should discuss the gas planning at any dive.
2) it isn't the first time that you feel the urge to stop the dive, it happened also in the cave. Be more assertive when you want something. If you want to call a dive, call it
3) many signals aren't universal; when you dive with new people, review them (you'd be surprised that some tec guys communicate their gas only with one hand, always). This isn't related to the dive you mentioned, but it's good to think about it

Another great post:
1) Goes in-hand with having a dive-plan and sticking with it.

3) Absolutely discuss hand-signals. 3a) You also have people like me forget dive-signals. I solo-dive a lot. Other people might dive only occasionally. Others were taught different signals. 3b) I noticed that going through Sidemounting.com training; pretty much every signal is one-handed, and many of those signals are more intuitive than some of the 2-handed signals I've seen. I've also noticed he's very clear, deliberate, and methodological with hand-signals.

Page 7 of your link is exactly what I do. Now, as it seems that it is not widely used, I am open to use a more efficient signal.

That's right that in some occasions, I have followed a DM and I was not happy. In this particular case, I still had air but I breached my own personal rules. I think that I need to learn to say no immediately and not wait for the last minute.

It's important we learn from our mistakes, and it sounds like you have.