Old steels denied fills due to store "policy"

[runsongas]

SCBA tanks are frequently CF with 15 yr service lives. If every LDS in my area lost their marbles and declared they wouldn't fill a tank older than 20 years, then i'm going compressor shopping.

 

[markmud]

I think you'll find (but I've no supporting evidence of their policies) that these entities would retire their cylinders after a relatively short time (15yrs?) mainly because of the frequent use they get and wear and tear.

Hi DD,

On this issue, I have to agree with some of the other posters. I have not heard of issues with the steel tanks per se.

I have searched for chronic issues or data regarding failure and failure analysis on these "cases". I am not finding them. They are probably available, I am not finding them.

The current system seems to be working.

Has DOT and TC Canada, or other governments, issued advisory letters?

As always, cheers,
markm

 

[txgoose]

I think you'll find (but I've no supporting evidence of their policies) that these entities would retire their cylinders after a relatively short time (15yrs?) mainly because of the frequent use they get and wear and tear.

I would likely agree for those carbon fiber systems and bottles being worn on the active personnel. I honestly do not know anything about those regulations. I have not heard of groups using other gasses sourced from local welding providers requiring only newer tanks be provided.

I will say that the bailout bottle I was provided by the Houston Police Dept on a demo dive looked like it had been to hades and back. I did not verify a born on date. Money isn’t easy to come by for most of these orgs (military aside possibly) and I bet that they follow the best rules that both maximize safety and not needlessly remove dollars from their budgets.

 

[Diving Dubai]

carbon fiber systems

Carbon tanks are different. I think they're life limited to 15yrs I was involved in developing an inspection to re life them, and while we could, the cost of the test was greater than new. Carbon wrapped cylinders in scuba are a nightmare I wouldn't' go near them nor fill them.

 

[Diving Dubai]

Hi DD,

On this issue, I have to agree with some of the other posters. I have not heard of issues with the steel tanks per se.

I have searched for chronic issues or data regarding failure and failure analysis on these "cases". I am not finding them. They are probably available, I am not finding them.

The current system seems to be working.

Has DOT and TC Canada, or other governments, issued advisory letters?

As always, cheers,
markm

There are no faults. And you won't' find record of failure unless there's been a serious incident - even then they're hard to come by.

The assertion was that steel scuba cylinders as long as they pass Vis and hydro are not life limited. I disagreed especially with long life items. Would I have a 50 year old cylinder, pass it onto my kids and tell them it'll be good for another 50 years? No way!

 

[Bob DBF]

I think you'll find (but I've no supporting evidence of their policies) that these entities would retire their cylinders after a relatively short time (15yrs?) mainly because of the frequent use they get and wear and tear.

In the case of SCBA cylinders, used by firefighters and others for surface use, they are composite material and were made with a 15 year life span. Continuing use is a violation of DOT rules.

As for military use, @Akimbo might be able to give a reason why the military might retire scuba and other cylinders after 15 years, if they do.


Bob

 

[kelemvor]

There are no faults. And you won't' find record of failure unless there's been a serious incident - even then they're hard to come by.

The assertion was that steel scuba cylinders as long as they pass Vis and hydro are not life limited. I disagreed especially with long life items. Would I have a 50 year old cylinder, pass it onto my kids and tell them it'll be good for another 50 years? No way!

If you owned a 50 year old steel cylinder that passed hydro and vis last month would you replace it due to age or dive it? I mean it could fail the next hydro, sure. But for now.. it's good, right?

There are plenty of folks in the cave country area that have been massively overfilling steel tanks for decades. Even those abused steels aren't catastrophically failing. Clearly, you know more about metallurgy than the nothing that I know. That said, the evidence doesn't seem to support properly maintained steel tanks having a finite lifespan. It doesn't even seem to support abused steel tanks having a finite lifespan.

 

[Ghetto Diver]

I got three 63 year old tanks that I got wet this mornin'.
I filled them though.
Still here, for now.

 

[Akimbo]

As for military use, @Akimbo might be able to give a reason why the military might retire scuba and other cylinders after 15 years, if they do.

I'm not aware of it if they do.

If you owned a 50 year old steel cylinder that passed hydro and vis last month would you replace it due to age or dive it?

I have a steel 72 born in 1959, 3 years before I started diving. It still passes hydros and I still use it. It's becoming doubtful that I will outlive it.

 

[Bigbella]

Wow, my current go-to tanks are Genesis steel 100s, from the early 1990s; my 60s and 72s, from the mid-1970s. They have all of their current paperwork and have never posed a problem with any shop in California or the Pacific Northwest.

Coincidentally, I went diving with the ForceE guys, out of Jupiter, back in December, while visiting friends, and they were quite accommodating. Amusingly enough, all of my gear, with the exception of a BC and 3mm suit, were older than any of the guys on the boat.

One of the crew particularly liked my "retro" Poseidon Odin and carefully handled the hefty first stage, a bit like the hominids did the monolith in "2001" . . .