Another opinion: To buddy or not to buddy

[MalibuJerry]

The advice on a longer primary hose is great advice. Just try using your integrated air2 for yourself and a standard length hose for your buddy in a pool and see what a CF it is to try to then in a coordinated way swim to the surface while venting your BC. With your configuration there is a lot to practice and get comfortable with.

 

[boulderjohn]

I have a daughter who is 10 1/2 and will probably get certified within the next two years. I'd say I wouldn't want the vast majority of the local instructors to teach her to dive. I've only met 2 so far that I would trust her with which probably represents about 10% of the instructors that I know. The rest turn out divers that are horrible.

So you agree that the vast majority of divers are horrible, and those horrible divers therefore represent the vast majority of divers in the potential Mentor pool.

I am not saying you personally are saying what follows (which takes the argument to its extreme), but this is a condensed version of what I see a lot of people argue, except they never put all of it together into one statement like this, and the last one is a just a logical result of the preceding points.

1. Because instructors suck, most of the divers they turn out are horrible.

2. Because instructors suck, it is better to learn from an experienced diver who will Mentor you.

3. You should select that Mentor from the horrible divers who are turned out by the instructors who suck.

4. If an excellent experienced diver decides to become an instructor in the future, that diver will then suck once gaining that certification.

You can learn a lot from an good Mentor. You can learn a lot from a good instructor. The opposite is true in both cases. The trick is knowing which is which.

 

[chrpai]

So you agree that the vast majority of divers are horrible, and those horrible divers therefore represent the vast majority of divers in the potential Mentor pool.

No, I didn't say that at all. I don't feel like wrapping my head around your logic right now because I think there are more variables at play. In the end, I think we agree regardless of how we get there.

Personally I'm a product of about 5 directly involved instructors, 5 more advisory instructors, about 12 years of cyber diving listening to hundreds of opinions, reading various books, blogs, articles, and most importantly hundreds of dives in a variety of conditons. I'm no dive "god" but somewhere in there I've become very competent and feel that I give give good guidance at the recreational level to an already certified diver who wants said guidance. Most importantly I know when to say "I don't know."

 

[sailordiver11]

one thing I'll add to the already very good advice you have been given here is this ...
I have an integrated inflator too (Air2) and one thing I did was to get a longer hose on my primary regulator .. the stock hose is just too short for comfortable air sharing , I found it was trying to pull the reg out of the persons mouth unless literally face to face ... mine is now octo length goes under my arm and up to my reg and is much more comfortable to share air

what is the standard 2nd stage hose length? Mine currently is 29" from 1st stage port to 2nd stage port.

 

[D_B]

about 30" , short enough it would pull on the reg if anything other than face to face and a bent armed BC grab - straighten your arm a bit due to stress/whatever and it will start to pull the reg out of their mouth ... it's now on a 52" hose that routs up under my arm (can see in my pics)
I also dont like that they are heavy, and on a longer corrugated hose and hang down even with a bungee cord restraint, I have to hold it to my stomach with my left hand .. at some point I will switch to a short hose backup reg/ long(er) hose primare reg (already have the matching reg for it)

 

[tracydr]

Sounds like your buddy is Hogarthian. Wouldn't be my choice to dive with someone that inflexible - him, not others that practice that style.

With your configuration in your conditions I'd rather have a steel tank also.

If you can't find someone else to dive with in the Long Beach area you aren't really trying...

He dives with an octo. He's not hogarthian.
What on earth is wrong with a steel tank and a drysuit?

 

[sailordiver11]

So what would you recommend as far as a longer hose,I.e. how long?

 

[tracydr]

So if I understand correctly, you're pretty new to diving with 15 dives, you're in California and I'm guessing interested in (shore?) diving locally, and you've got a dry suit & some sort of Air2.

I've never shore dove in California. I do use an Air2, and I prefer steel tanks for offering me more air. If I were in California talking with you guys about going on a shore dive as a trio, and hearing what you've said to each other, I think I'd comment like this:

1.) I use an Air2, but my primary reg. (an Atomic B2, hoses as they came from the factory) has a fairly short hose between 1'rst & 2'nd stage. So if I donate you my primary in an OOA, we're going to face-to-face, real close. If we were planning to shore dive somewhere with substantial waves & surge that make exiting something of a challenge, a traditional octo. might offer an edge (of course, the tec. inspired people with long hose setups, donate your primary, would have it even better, but I have no experience with that).

2.) I've never even worn a dry suit. I know they introduce a 'new' airspace to deal with and can complicate buoyancy management and until you get it down. Adds a bit of task loading, I'm thinking. You've only got 15 dives. You might be quite proficient with a dry suit, please take no offense, but I'd at least be somewhat worried.

I could argue with some of his other input, but others here have already done that effectively, so why beat a dead horse?

Is this guy really trying to dictate terms, or is he just a Type A personality who's unconsciously more forceful/overbearing with his opinions than he ought to be, and trying to 'help you for your own good?'

The former I'd probably avoid, but the latter you might could work with. But you may have to exercise polite assertiveness, since it sounds like he'll tell you what to do if you let him.

Richard.

There are divers in colder areas that take OW class in a drysuit. TSandM is one.
You do know its pretty easy to change out the hoses on your reg? I did it all by myself.

---------- Post added August 3rd, 2013 at 09:47 AM ----------

So what would you recommend as far as a longer hose,I.e. how long?

I dive with a 7 foot primary. You can use a 5 foot but a 7 foot is pretty easy to manage and nicer if you need to share.

 

[sailordiver11]

There are divers in colder areas that take OW class in a drysuit. TSandM is one.
You do know its pretty easy to change out the hoses on your reg? I did it all by myself.

---------- Post added August 3rd, 2013 at 09:47 AM ----------


I dive with a 7 foot primary. You can use a 5 foot but a 7 foot is pretty easy to manage and nicer if you need to share.

i can swap out hoses, I just will need the special tool Aqualung uses for their ports, thanks.
7', wow! Wasn't expecting that. How do you keep it under control?

 

[uncfnp]

i can swap out hoses, I just will need the special tool Aqualung uses for their ports, thanks.
7', wow! Wasn't expecting that. How do you keep it under control?

What special tool?