AOW right after OW

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By asking the question again, you are certain to get the same differing opinions you found all the other times the question was asked, and you are not likely to get any response that will provide any greater clarification.

However, stating my particular case I can eliminate the variables that don't apply.

For example:
- I don't plan on getting any further certification, as I have no interest in teaching diving.
- I don't plan on diving under 20m. in the foreseable future.
- I don't plan on using anything but air nor planning a dive that requires any deco stop (beyond security).

i.e.: I want to do the courses because I think it will be an entertaining way of making the first immersions and also because I think they'll make me feel safer.

Does that information alter the responses in any way?
 
In that case, search carefully for a true advanced class and not the typical AOW. Get in about 20 - 25 dives while you are searching for a class that's more than just making 5 dives with an instructor.
 
However, stating my particular case I can eliminate the variables that don't apply.

For example:
- I don't plan on getting any further certification, as I have no interest in teaching diving.
- I don't plan on diving under 20m. in the foreseable future.
- I don't plan on using anything but air nor planning a dive that requires any deco stop (beyond security).

i.e.: I want to do the courses because I think it will be an entertaining way of making the first immersions and also because I think they'll make me feel safer.

Does that information alter the responses in any way?

There are many kinds of certification that do not include instruction. When I was first certified, I planned to do a couple of dives every other year or so while on a tropical vacation. That plan ended, ironically enough for this conversation, during my AOW class.
 
In this case, it's not about a lack of information, it's about a lack of consistency. I've read multiple opinions in both senses in various threads, so now I'm a bit lost.

Is it useful to enter an aow course right after passing the ow? Or will I just lose time and money.

My first impression was that it would be a nice way of learning during my first immersions (it's not so much more expensive than the immersions themselves). However, I've also read some people saying it's better to do some immersions first and then do the aow.
As JimLap said, it depends on what you want to get out of it ... and which AOW you want to take. They vary.

To expand a bit on JimLap's point ... different agencies sell AOW for different reasons.

Those that promote AOW directly after OW are looking at it as "experience" based learning ... in other words, a few more dives under instructor supervision in varying conditions. The primary purpose of this class is really to "cement" the basics you learned in OW by giving you more dives before you start to forget what you learned on OW. There's little to no additional learning outside of what you teach yourself while being supervised by an instructor who's primarily there to make sure you don't hurt yourself in the process. If this is the type of class you want, then go for AOW as soon as possible after OW.

Those who promote some dives between OW and AOW are looking at the class as a way to expand both your diving knowledge and skill level ... they will introduce you to skills that were not covered in your OW, rather than seek to emphasize through repetition those that were. (For full disclosure, I happen to fall into this category.) If this is the type of class you want, then get some more dives first. Become completely comfortable with what you learned in OW. Then seek out an instructor who takes this approach to the class (generally those will be NAUI or SSI instructors, because their agencies support this approach).

Further instruction for inexperienced divers can never be a bad thing can it?
Many AOW classes don't involve further instruction ... they consist only of supervised diving.

The only time I think further instruction can hurt, is when you have a diver who has not mastered the skill sets taught in OW. I have seen some divers attempt the skills learned in AOW, but they were still struggling with the lessons learned in OW.
Exactly ... your brain can only handle so many new things at once. If you're still struggling with what you learned in OW, then the chances of coming out of an AOW class feeling like you didn't learn anything are very high.

However, stating my particular case I can eliminate the variables that don't apply.

For example:
- I don't plan on getting any further certification, as I have no interest in teaching diving.
- I don't plan on diving under 20m. in the foreseable future.
- I don't plan on using anything but air nor planning a dive that requires any deco stop (beyond security).

i.e.: I want to do the courses because I think it will be an entertaining way of making the first immersions and also because I think they'll make me feel safer.

Does that information alter the responses in any way?
First off, I'm going to tell you not to stop at AOW. If you take nothing else, take a Rescue class ... it is by far the most important scuba class you can take, since it is as much about learning how to avoid an accident as it is about learning how to respond to one.

Furthermore ... as a new diver, you really don't know what your goals are. You know what they are today ... but I have seen many, many divers change their goals rather quickly once they started diving.

Whatever you decide to do, keep in mind that what you get out of any class will be proportional to what you put into it. Go into the class prepared to make every effort to learn. Don't be afraid to ask questions and challenge anything that doesn't make sense to you, and no matter which option you choose ... or who teaches the class ... you will get the most out of it.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
 
In that case, search carefully for a true advanced class and not the typical AOW. Get in about 20 - 25 dives while you are searching for a class that's more than just making 5 dives with an instructor.

That seems exactly what I'd like, but how to evaluate how useful will a class be before having already the knowledge?

Theoretically, that should be one of the results of having a coherent certification system.

For example you could tell me: "Don't dive with unprepared instructors" and my only ways of knowing if they are prepared or not would be to either know more than them, believe someone who knows more tham them, or ask for a certification by that someone.
 
I seem to recall seeing a package deal once where one could take OW, AOW and Nitrox all as a combi-course.
 
Those that promote AOW directly after OW are looking at it as "experience" based learning ... in other words, a few more dives under instructor supervision in varying conditions. The primary purpose of this class is really to "cement" the basics you learned in OW by giving you more dives before you start to forget what you learned on OW. There's little to no additional learning outside of what you teach yourself while being supervised by an instructor who's primarily there to make sure you don't hurt yourself in the process. If this is the type of class you want, then go for AOW as soon as possible after OW.

Those who promote some dives between OW and AOW are looking at the class as a way to expand both your diving knowledge and skill level ... they will introduce you to skills that were not covered in your OW, rather than seek to emphasize through repetition those that were. (For full disclosure, I happen to fall into this category.) If this is the type of class you want, then get some more dives first. Become completely comfortable with what you learned in OW. Then seek out an instructor who takes this approach to the class (generally those will be NAUI or SSI instructors, because their agencies support this approach).

An enlightening post that's clarified my own ideas.

Indeed what I was looking for was more and progressively harder supervised dives, for which I'll take the aow. More safety, for which I'll take the rescue if possible during the same holidays. And finally more knowledge, for which I'll go, after 25+ dives, to NAUI or SSI (which I still don't know, so I'll have to investigate).

The idea is: as long as it doesn't become prohibitively expensive, I'll try my best to find every possible problem, incident or difficulty with a professional next to me. And then I'll hope my training's been enough to face them when I start diving "alone" with my buddy and a guide.


Thank you.
 
That seems exactly what I'd like, but how to evaluate how useful will a class be before having already the knowledge?

Theoretically, that should be one of the results of having a coherent certification system.

For example you could tell me: "Don't dive with unprepared instructors" and my only ways of knowing if they are prepared or not would be to either know more than them, believe someone who knows more tham them, or ask for a certification by that someone.

A coupla weeks back I posted some tips for those thinking about taking a class. These thoughts may be helpful in your case ...

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ne...g/293996-those-considering-scuba-lessons.html

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
 
Thanshin, I did my AOW for the reasons you list . . . I didn't feel confident to do any diving without an instructor or divemaster with me when I finished OW, and my shop strongly encouraged me to go straight to AOW. I learned very little in the class, and in retrospect, I probably would have been better off just to hire a divemaster to go diving with me (or to have used something like SB to find some experienced buddies who would patiently escort a newbie). I empathize with the desire to have some dives with someone who's good and solid. I know that, at the end of my OW class, putting me with another diver of similar (lack of) skills for a dive would have been a good risk for some kind of unpleasant experience.
 
My OW instructor advised me to get 25 or 30 dives under my belt before taking AOW. I actually had 77 when I took it. In our class we did deep, night, nav, nitrox, the usual specialty stuff. I was already Nitrox certified but I learned more on gas planning and management. I had already been deeper than we went and done night and low viz diving but I learned some new light skills and important team skills in that portion of the class. We went over gear configuration, did mask off line drills, shot lift bags in the middle of the water column with only a buddy for reference.

Our instructor knew that a couple of us in the class were serious about diving and planned to do AN/DP and Cavern/Cave courses in the next year so he geared the class toward a more "tech" style of diving. I think even the non-tech oriented students in our class benefited from just from watching the skills of the instructors. I think the important thing about AOW is to define what you expect to get out of the class and making sure you are matched with a GOOD instructor who knows what your diving goals are and wants to help you on your path.
 
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