Authoritative Incompetency

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PhotoTJ once bubbled...
OK, I realize that we tend to notice an emphasis on the negative, but here lately the general thrust of this board seems to be;

All agencies suck. (Except the one we're a member of)

All instructors suck. (Except us, or our current mentor/guru.)

All equipment manufacturers suck. (Except what we dive with.)

All LDS' suck. (Except for one, that only one or two of us know how to find. Evidently, it's in Wyoming someplace.)

Anyone meet a new, good PDAI/NAUI instructor, that had them try new gear, at a LDS that they liked, followed by a great dive?

You say instructors have a swagger/attitude? Most Scubaboard members should check the mirror! (And no, I don't exempt myself from these criticisms!):rolleyes:

Spot on.
 
VTWarrenG once bubbled...
One year later: the instructor referenced in the first post in this thread has since been found guilty on felony drug trafficking charges. It seems he had developed a habit of storing bags of cocaine inside sealed and pressurized air cylinders. I don't know all the details just yet, but it seems fitting end to his career.

- Warren

ROFL They weren't poorly trained divers they were stoned on cocaine inhalers!

I'm SSI certified through Dive Con and we covered tables very well as they were part of the training curriculum. I must say I appreciate my LDS more all the time after reading some of these threads.

woof
 
You forgot to mention...

Any effort to sell someone gear is an attempt to rip the buyer off (unless it's over the internet)

Offering continuing education/specialties is a ripoff (unless it's DIR-F)

Otherwise, I prefer Gouda (with crackers). Can I have grapejuice, please? I don't drink wine.Never mind... I'll just swagger over to the fridge and get my own grapejuice

~grin~
 
I have seen plenty of bad divers in my time... so I set the example first and then became an instructor. I will change them one by one. :tease:

PS, I almpost got that swagger thing down too! They didn't teach that in my ITC!
 
I be willing I know , which school and boat that was. as recently actually three months ago I had a fairly familiar scene , with a boat and crew out of myrtle beach actually I had dove from this boat before, But I don't think I will be back with them .
short version class of 14 students, one instructor no dive master
I actually set the wreck line as turns out other than instructor. I was the most experienced.
the wreck was the Sherman with depth of 60 feet.
water visibility ok , equipment failure after equipment failure.
I Know one jumped into water didn't have air turned on , another had BC inflator hose come off stuff like that .
made a mess of the bottom visibility gone !!
and yes I did say something to the instructor, boat captain ands to most all the students this wasn't safe diving nor the way it should be done , and really hope most them students realize it .
I do know one did because since then we have talked and planning a dive together in sept. he was amazed at the pre planning and equipment check I have talked about before even diving , really makes me wonder what the instructors are doing today, I hope this is not the new trend to hype things up and going for numbers rather than quality of divers !!!
and yes I reported him to padi not sure if anything they will do or say !!!.
well I am not afraid to name the name!! the class was out of coastal scuba in myrtle beach along with thier boat !!!
I will say that I had dove this boat several time and this was the first like this, but still will make me wonder if I will dive from this one again unless I cant find another boat !!! then I will do it with my buddy !!
 
medic13 once bubbled...
I be willing I know , which school and boat that was. as recently actually three months ago I had a fairly familiar scene , with a boat and crew out of myrtle beach actually I had dove from this boat before, But I don't think I will be back with them .
short version class of 14 students, one instructor no dive master
I actually set the wreck line as turns out other than instructor. I was the most experienced.
the wreck was the Sherman with depth of 60 feet.
water visibility ok , equipment failure after equipment failure.
I Know one jumped into water didn't have air turned on , another had BC inflator hose come off stuff like that .
made a mess of the bottom visibility gone !!
and yes I did say something to the instructor, boat captain ands to most all the students this wasn't safe diving nor the way it should be done , and really hope most them students realize it .
I do know one did because since then we have talked and planning a dive together in sept. he was amazed at the pre planning and equipment check I have talked about before even diving , really makes me wonder what the instructors are doing today, I hope this is not the new trend to hype things up and going for numbers rather than quality of divers !!!
and yes I reported him to padi not sure if anything they will do or say !!!.
well I am not afraid to name the name!! the class was out of coastal scuba in myrtle beach along with thier boat !!!
I will say that I had dove this boat several time and this was the first like this, but still will make me wonder if I will dive from this one again unless I cant find another boat !!! then I will do it with my buddy !!

Who's the dive shop, who's the boat?

I just don't understand the ability to tell this story, and not identify the culprits.
 
I did the answere to whom it was is as follows
"well I am not afraid to name the name!! the class was out of coastal scuba in myrtle beach along with thier boat boats name is (Safari IV ) !!!"
 
medic13 once bubbled...
I did the answere to whom it was is as follows
"well I am not afraid to name the name!! the class was out of coastal scuba in myrtle beach along with thier boat boats name is (Safari IV ) !!!"

You are infact correct, and I do apologize.
 
Custer --

Do you know what agency they were certifying through? I can't speak for any other agency, but I can assure you that 14 students with one instructor and no other dive leadership is a gross violation of SSI standards. I'm not asking you to name names here (like we don't have enough agency bashing going on with this board already) but I would highly recommend reporting the incident to the appropriate agency if you know who it is. I can't believe, no matter which agency it was with, that their standards would permit only one dive leader with 14 students in open water -- no way.
 
PhotoTJ once bubbled...
Anyone meet a new, good PDAI/NAUI instructor, that had them try new gear, at a LDS that they liked, followed by a great dive?

Since you asked... Here's the perspective of a tourist diver, and my 1st post here. I was certified 15 years ago, but stopped diving after my daughter was born and a couple of less-than-reassuring dives with met-on-the-boat buddies. I just re-certified from scratch with my daughter through a LDS a couple of weeks ago. Call us wimps if you will, but we'll probably dive only on vacations to warm spots and locally in the summer. Don't want to get too cold or too rusty. Our instructors were great.

Prior to the class, they told me I couldn't take the class without a physician's note, since I'd had a hernia repair a year earlier. Didn't matter that everything was uncomplicated and healed up. Same deal for my daughter, who was taking medication for acne. Made no difference that the medication had no implications for diving or that I was a physician. No note, no dive. Not even in the pool.

The first day of class, they toured us around the store, showed us equipment, pointed out advantages and disadvantages, and told us they didn't want us to consider this a sales pitch, just an opportunity to see what was what. And it didn't feel like a sales pitch. We were told that there was plenty of time to decide what to buy after completing the course and some experience with rented gear to see what we liked. The only things we were told we had to own to complete the course were fins, mask, and snorkel, which could be used for snorkeling anyway should we decide diving wasn't for us.

The instructors made sure that everyone in the class understood everything before moving on. This included spending extra time in the classroom and in the water to be sure everyone was up to speed. In the pool, there were 2 instructors for 8 students. In OW, there were 4 instructors for 8 students. The OW dives were quarry dives with about 8-10' vis, but it was a thrill to get into real water, actually experience the stuff we'd been reading about: buoyance control with a full wetsuit, finding your way with the compass, and seeing a few fish.

No one passed unless they successfully completed all the skills that were listed in the manuals the students got. We all had to swim 200m before the pool sessons started. One student had to come back for an extra pool session before doing the final OW dives. One couldn't do the hover thing in the OW after multiple tries and didn't get his card. Near the end of one of the OW dives, one of the students apparently got panicky and started hyperventilating. An instructor brought her up. He said it was the first time he'd seen that in 30 years of teaching, that they usually weeded out the panicky ones in the pool, and though she seemed fine once out of the water, he wasn't taking any chances and called an ambulance to take her for a medical evaluation. She didn't get her card either.

When we were done, the instructors made it clear that we were still rank beginners, and that we had to be sure to dive within the limits of our experience or go down with a guide. They offered more courses, but didn't push. And still no push to buy equipment. I finished the class with the impression that tables were more conservative 'cuz you can stay down longer with a computer on a multilevel dive. I wasn't aware that the majority of divers used computers until I came here.

I compare this experience to the one I had 15 years earlier, doing the class- and pool-work with the same LDS owner, and getting a referral for the OW dives in the Caymans. Some of the people just couldn't do all of the OW skills without the instructor doing part of it for them, but they all got their cards. Even though we had great vis, warm water, saw a ton of colorful coral and fish, I left the water feeling less confident and less inspired because of that.

Does it really matter what agency it was? No. It all depends on the instructor and the student. Diving is fun, but it's serious too. A significant amount of personal responsibility is involved. That's why I'm re-reading my manuals and devouring all I can from this site before we venture out on a couple of boat dives in the FL keys in a couple of months. We're sticking to the novice-level dives. I bought a computer, but we'll be taking our tables and doing some comparisons. No doubt that some of the people these guys trained will still go out and do stupid things. But you can't blame the teacher for every crazy diver. I wasn't as careful 15 years ago as I am now.
 

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