Authoritative Incompetency

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ScubaDubaDoo,

:( That's really, really sad. I've already decided that I'm going to be an instructor soon, but I will not work at a dive shop. I'm going to be an instructor only because I want to be a better diver. I'll teach my friends, and my friends will (hopefully) recommend me to others. I intend on providing a real education to my students, because what I really want are dive buddies!

- Warren
 
Originally posted by VTWarrenG
ScubaDubaDoo,

I've already decided that I'm going to be an instructor soon,

- Warren

Warren,
I think that's a splendid idea! Until you've actually taught scuba, it's hard to know how tricky it can really be. You certainly have the right attitude. I've decided to take a NAUI Instructor Trainer course soon, so maybe I can help the cause by turning out better instructors some day.

Neil
 
The tough go diving... even with this terrible weather, I found my way to make 7 dives this week and even taught snorkeling in an outdoor pool. Yeah, I know I am nut, but I don't let the weather stop -ME- from diving.
 
Originally posted by artsprite
This post brings up a question I had in a store the other day. I'm kind of a newbie myself, but I was taught the dive tables, and that you should know them as a backup before using computers. I was in a store that uses SSI certification. I was looking at computers, and the salesman/owner? made a big deal about the fact that they don't teach dive tables. In fact he said that if an instructor in his store tries to teach them that he'd have to turn in his resignation. They don't even allow them in their classes.

Artsprite,

I was SSI certified about 15 months ago. Tables were a big part of the training and there were several questions on the exam using tables.

I have heard of an agency that teaches computers and not tables, it is not SSI, unless something has changed recently.
 
Hello,

People! Just keep in mind there is NOTHING dishonorable about picking up that telephone and calling the certification agency to file an official complaint against the dive shop/instructor. As tom mount told me on the phone regarding this situation "how can the agency's police the instructors if the students keep their mouths shut?" (well may not be word for word but it was very close to that) Bottom line is make that call, report these cases so something can be done about it.

Ed
 
Scubado, finally, we have a post which describes a truly dangerous situation. The business about the tables, NITROX and drysuit was pretty bad.

Blacknet thinks that complaining to a cert agency will have some effect? Yes, the agency will probably give the offending instructor an "attaboy".

By way of background, I started diving before SCUBA certification was available. There were a few fellows at the YMCA and LA County who were pushing to form "agencies" but that's about it. In my teenage years, I knew approximately 15 divers besides myself. None had taken a course or even heard of such a thing. Many years later, I took a basic course, an instructor course and subsequently taught for a while.

The early instructors were an idealistic lot. They often learned instructional skills by teaching informally at dive clubs and training in the military. The majority were self taught from books and from personal experience. Some had backgrounds in physics, engineering or medicine.

These folks were extremely idealistic and believed in their responsibilities. Diving equipment was rudimentary; there were no BCD's or any of the sophisticated ancilliary equipment taken for granted today. Their approach to proficiency and safety had to do with physical fitness, strenuous drills of water proficiency, various rules and gas theory. A diving class had a certain bootcamp feel. It did not have much to do with selling dive gear, hardly at all.

By the early 70's, there emerged a certification agency which took an entirely different approach. Instead of idealism, it was based on commercialism and profits. This was the NASDS which was controlled by Scubapro. Eventually, for competitive reasons, this incestuous relationship was adopted by others such as PADI/USD and the curtain between teaching and sales was torn away, never to return. Meanwhile, at least as far as I could determine, course instruction was still responsible however much the hidden agenda. It was different though; to pass through as many as possible, the physical requirements demanded by some agencies were drastically reduced. The technicals or science background remained intact. Course tutorials still included considerable water work but the emphasis was changing to include new equipment now available on the market. Instructors were pressured to sell this equipment.

The experiences related by scubado are the most egregious I have heard of. Competition has been increasing and it's still hard to turn a profit at a dive shop. More than that, I don't know.

Being a maverick who has his own compressor and boat I don't hang around dive shops or even know many other divers. That is, unless you want to count the old timers such as those mentioned in Carlos Eyles book and the film "Blue Water Hunters". So, you could say I'm "out of it". Partly, for that reason, I've been having a good time reading this board and hearing about the regimentation of diving and the path that commercialism has taken in lockstep with certain "authorities". I'm putting the pieces together one might say.

The whole idea of independent agencies was to teach, and later, to forestall regulation. There were (and are) good reasons for their existence. However, as deregulation of the airlines, etc has produced some unintended results, so has our original plan. The upshot is that there probably is no agency board or ombudsman with a portfolio of the sort that blacknet refers to. Does anybody know anything different? That is, is there any legitimate self policing of the agencies/industry?

Getting answers from insiders to questions of a controversial nature is difficult at best. My experience has been that everything is fine and "we've never had a complaint"
 
devjr,

Instead of a history leason why not give something useful in combating this plague?

Ed
 
Tavi,
I'm glad your SSI instructor taught you the tables, and I'm not saying they are all like the one I came across, but I'm sure this one is SSI. I originally asked about lessons there before I took mine from another LDS and found out it is SSI, and the sign out front says in huge letters SSI. In fact, they are really proud of that fact and the reason I didn't take my lessons there was all the extra stuff they wanted you to buy, the lessons were twice the cost of where I went, and because I didn't like their attitude the first time I was in there asking about the lessons. Now, knowing about not teaching the tables, I'm doubly glad that I went elsewhere. I had another post in a thread called opinionated LDS's about another idiot that was a PADI instructor. It just goes to show they're in every agency.
 
Wow! I have been off the board for a couple of days and this is what I find!

Let me say this about that. Scuba Diving is a business. As much as we want to think of it as a benevolent pursuit and dive shops are there to sell us only the things we really need at a price we can afford! For obvious reasons that shop does not exist in the real world.

As for agencies and instructors who do their work, I feel too many fine and highly qualified instructors were unintentionally maligned by DEVJR. Not by name or number but in general.

But, I do have one thing in common with DEVJR. I too have seen the inadequacies of the dive shop/OW teaching marriage. It is an unholy one in many cases. Now back to the instuctor and agencies. I am an instructor and so is my wife and another good friend. We all have turned to teaching outside of the dive shop arena. We buy our own pool time and we have purchase our own equipment for teaching up to 10 students at a time.

Why? Because we love the sport and the thrill it has given us. We also love to teach others to dive in a safe and proficient manner. Our class is 10 weeks long. Yes we teach dive tables and computers. We also have spend a considerable amount of time on bouyancy. Our students must be able to swim! (What a novel approach)! I am sure there are many more like us out there.

Except for one particular dive shop in the area, we are not all that welcome. Like DEVJR, we are pretty much self efficient and can dive just about anywere whenever we like.

The choices that the average OW diver has are many. Shop around at several dive stores before making that plunge for additional TRAINING and the associated cost. Check out the instuctor and ask for references (other than the ones on the staff). If you are still dis-satisfied, search the NET or simly post here. If you lived in my neighborhood, I would certainly give you a call.
 
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