Best Place for Weights with BP/W?

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Well, regarding ditchable weight . . .

In a single tank, in warm water, it is highly unlikely that you would ever be in a situation where even a total wing failure would prevent you from swimming to the surface as a result of buoyancy loss. Most people can swim up ten pounds negative, and with a thin suit and normal sized tanks, you won't be more negative than that, even at depth at the beginning of the dive. So even in the event of a total wing failure (which is very rare, and pretty much requires that the inflator hose come off the wing) you should be able to reach the surface without jettisoning any weight. However, should you jettison weight at depth, you will likely not be able to control your ascent in the shallows, which to me is more of an issue.

On the surface, it's a different story. This is where ditchable weight is most useful, but it's also where you are most buoyant. If, with a full tank and the wing empty, you have difficulty keeping your face out of the water, then you may elect to have either ditchable weight or a redundant source of buoyancy, like an SMB (which is something I think anybody diving off a boat should have, anyway). Again, this is based on a total wing failure. With most punctures or rips, you can trap air in the wing in some position. But inflator hoses have been known to come off.

My own risk assessment is that, with well-maintained and inspected equipment, that particular risk is extremely low -- and were it to happen, I have a buddy or buddies close at hand to assist. (But I also dive a ton of ditchable weight in very cold water, mostly because I carry so much weight some of it HAD to end up ditchable!)

If you have a body that makes carrying a weight belt difficult, and you don't want your weights to use up any of your harness real estate, and you want the weights easily ditched, I'd highly recommend a weight harness like the DUI Weight & Trim. They aren't cheap, but they give you everything you are asking for. This is what my husband uses.
 
DeepSeaFalcon - This might be just the solution I'm looking for. Looks like you ran two pieces of 2" webbing vertically along the outside edges of the backplate, between the plate and the wing, and installed two velcro-flapped weight pockets on each strap.

I have two questions: How did you fasten the webbing to the plate? How do you keep the pockets from sliding up and down?

If I took the weights off my belt and put them on the plate, my weights would not then be self-ditchable, and most rescuers would have trouble finding them, too. I need to educate myself on the issues with weight ditchability, pro and con.

Thanks again,
Mike

Hi Mike,
below I copied a description I wrote some years ago when I came up with this solution.
Should answer all your questions and then some...
Setup's unchanged for 4 years now ... and the "temp cable tie solution" became sort of permanent, although I still "plan" to replace them with nicer bolts :wink:

Reg. "ditchability": I also have two single XS pockets on the waist belt, see picture. But only need them when diving in cold water.
I think "weight ditching" is overrated: there aren't so many realistic failure modes that require immediate discharge of large amounts of weight.
Also, consider that bouyancy increases when you swim up, so ditching too much can be became a serious and uncontrollable hazard!

Problem:
What I was missing now was the weight integration. I looked at weight systems that thread on the harness, e.g., Halcyon, OMS, and Zeagle. Didn't really like either of them, as they create almost as much obstruction on the sides as my earlier BCD. Besides, most are kind of expensive.
I considered tank (strap) weights, but don't care for the weight too far behind, plus it's more of a hassle when switching tanks.
I looked at threading XS scuba pockets onto the waist strap. That COULD work, but wouldn't allow using D-Rings and addtl. pocket/knife at the place I like them. Plus it puts all the weight on my waist ==> quite a heavy and floppy thing while I move the rigg when fully loaded. And not so good center of gravity-wise.
But it led to an idea...

Solution:
I threaded a single piece of heavy 2" webbing from the backside of the plate through the lower one (angled) of the two upper harness slots, wrapped it around the edge of the plate, and routed it between wing and plate to the angled slot on other side of the BP.
I then ran the two loose ends down on the backside of the plate, and attached "dual weight pockets" that came off a 4-pocket XS Scuba belt. Pockets are very well made!

Opening could be either towards the inside or outside. If to the inside, it's more secure reg. loosing weights. I choose to the outside, as it's easier to load and one has a chance to dump. I am not too concerned about loosing a weight, as my old BCD also had a pocket between bladder and backside, and I never lost anything.

I then pushed the pockets all the way up, and secured them with keepers. I finally wrapped the ends of the webbing around the lower edge of the plate, and secured them with heavy duty cable ties run through two adjacent mounting holes that were just at the right spots. I consider this a temp. setup. If it works out long time (and the band is fully stretched), I will either replace the cable ties with SS bands, or put a screw throught the plate.
Hint: secure the webbing when it is wet, it stretches slightly when wet

Single-pocket XS Scuba "tank weights" on each side of my harness waist strap complete the setup. Fit perfect between plate and D-Ring.

Attached pictures illustrate the setup.

Advantages as I see them:
- light weight BP/W for travel, yet no hassle with weight belt
- weight location close to the center of gravity: much better than a belt, similar to a heavy SS plate
- ability to fine-tune the trim by selecting proper weights for upper and lower pouches, and sliding pockets N-S
- reduced risk of tank tipping over when fully rigged on a boat, as opposed to typical weight integration systems. This was a real problem with my earlier BCD!
- very streamlined and low profile, compared to "commercial" weight pockets for BP/W
- (limited) ability to dump: although not as quick as a ripcord or such, I can still dump the weights in the single pockets, or can even reach back
- quite inexpensive: total cost <$50.-
- flexible: if I don't like it, I can always convert back to a weight belt. but I don't think that'll happen. :14:

Disadvantages:
- not DIR :shocked2:
- bladder slightly pushed towards tank when fully inflated (no issue, as my wing is rather large for single tank, will rarely be fully inflated, and plate is flexible)
- effort to set up the first time (~1hr, not counting all my other trials and errors)
- ?
 
I am in the process of setting up a BP/W for use with doubles. I am also going to replace my Hollis HTS with another BP/W for travel/single tank. On the HTS, I have the integrated weight pockets. I am going to transfer these to the new BP/W simply because they are easy to travel with and when using weights off of a boat. My question is who makes a good weight belt for when I am home with doubles? All of my weights are soft so I need something that does not require hard lead. I am not into spending a bunch of money on a weight belt. I've seen a few online. My LDS only carries one or two types. It seems like the belts that hold the soft weights look bulky. Obviously not desirable. Anyone have any belts they love or hate? Thanks for the info.

By the way, I am a big guy diving dry so weight is my friend...
 
The XS scuba pockets, especially the QR version attached to the lower cam band are definitely "self ditachable." It's pretty easy to reach back and pull out the weight if you need to. In a pinch I could probably do the same for the top cam band. You may have to keep them near the plate, though.
 
I need to educate myself on the issues with weight ditchability, pro and con.

Thanks again,
Mike
If you're diving single tank and weigh yourself properly, with an empty tank or near empty tank, you're going to float on the surface anyway. So, ditchable weight is a moot point. But if you're worried about dive master rescuing you in case of problem, just tell them up front that you don't have ditchable weight and if they need to, just cut you out of your rig.

So, now you carry 8-lbs of lead. You can use a weight pocket per tank cam strap and put 4-lbs on the top cam strap and 4-lbs to the bottom cam strap.

Or get some ankle weights and attach them to the holes that run the perimeter of your backplate. Let's say you use the 2lbs ankle weights, you'd have 2-ea. attached to your BP (one per side), loop one around the neck of the tank and then maybe throw a 2-pounder into a weight pouch attached to the top or bottom cam strap.

If you have a waistline that can support a weight belt then just use the weight belt. If you're worried about the buckle being a "failure point" then get the high quality stainless steel buckle instead of the plastic el cheapo buckle. I'm willing to bet that the stainless steel belt buckle will last much longer than you.
 
Re weight ditchability, it seems there are many variables and lots - I figured over four thousand, actually - of different diver scenarios, and one can easily come up with many plausible scenarios for, and just as many against, ditching your weight.

But as long as the weight isn't accidentally ditched, I can think of no good reason not to have the ability to ditch it, if you need to.

Having just completed the PADI Rescue Course, I am now convinced that ditchable weight is a very good thing to have, both for the diver victim and the rescuer. For example, to get a submerged, unresponsive diver to the surface, you might decide to ditch some of his weight. Less weight and extra buoyancy can be very helpful in quickly towing a "victim" 300 yards through the surf to safety while holding his head above water, protecting his airway, and giving him rescue breaths every five seconds. At the surface, a rescuer should be able to easily ditch your weights for you in case you are panicked or incapacitated.

So it seems that I will have to go with one of the traditional weight systems, weight belt, harness, or ditchable waist pockets.
 
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https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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