Biggest thing killing dive shops?

[mdb]

Nice post markmud:

I think you might be referring to Dolphin Dive Center in Sacramento.

Mike runs a very successful and progressive store.

On site pool, great repair service, lots of trips and events.

Also, as you mentioned, a very active online site shipping country and
worldwide.

 

[Scuba-Blue-13]

I went to the local dive shop to ask them if they had a service where I could test out my equipment in their pool and they didn't have one.

I will say we have 1 shop nearby that addresses this and the social aspect. They have what they call "Bubbles and Beers" once a month. They rent time at a local school's pool and for $10 you get a tank of air and weights and can dive in the pool to test new equipment, or just to get wet. I think they'll even loan out rental equipment to use. When it's over they head to a local establishment for beers and conversation.

 

[ajtoady]

Dan Humble of Dive Tech in Mallorytown, Ontario should run classes for owners on how to do business. Only Dive Tech, Abucs Scuba in Brockville, ON; Cave Country Dive Shop in High Springs, FL; Amigos Dive Center in Ft. White, FL and Cave Adventurers in Marianna, FL have been 100% feel good experiences. Your mileage may vary.

What Trace fails to mention and I am sure not intentionally, is the attitude or atmosphere you encounter at places like Dive Tech. I get a real feel that they want to and will try their best to help you or steer you in the right direction. I have a shop 20 minutes from my house that I no longer use due to a "chest beating" type of atmosphere and lack of respect for people in general. I took my "fear of water wife" to Dan's for a wetsuit to get her started to overcome those fears. The service she received was outstanding and she left with a desire to return. THAT IS HOW A SHOP SHOULD OPERATE!! Do I shop online, hell yes, I also shop every shop I pass when on the road. I know it's hard to compete, but you should also realize, not everyone likes online shopping ,and will seek out a good experience from a shop that has a good vibe.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Dan was one of my IT's when I was learning to be a PDIC instructor in 1989. In all the years I've known him, he has embodied the absolute best of what an instructor and dive shop owner should be. I've never heard him be anything but "humble" - literally, and never heard him bad-mouth anyone or anything. His love of diving is infectious and he makes you feel great whether you just stop in to use the bathroom before a dive or put a dent in your C-card.

 

[Neilwood]

Posted my experiences of local dive shops on other threads before but I will do it again to show the differences:

• Did my initial training with a shop 100 miles away and bought a fair amount of gear (wetsuit, fins, mask) from them. Great to deal with and owner will do you a deal - not been oversold on anything. Run trips throughout the year. Good online presence with facebook & good webshop. Would buy gear from them anytime. Seem to be thriving atm.
  
• Went to my local dive shop (20 miles away at that point) - quite poorly lit, not a great amount of stock and no online presence so hard to see what is available. Would only visit the shop if I happened to be in the neighbourhood for other reasons. Not sure how they survive as they must just get by.
  
• Next shopping trip was about 30 miles away (having an "end of season sale") - ended up getting oversold on a BP&W (with a horseshoe wing with about 60lbs of lift) instead of ordering the single tank wing that would have been a better size. Never been back to that shop and never will (I discovered later they have a reputation as "rip off merchants"- I now know of about a dozen people in my circle of diving friends that they have screwed over). They also have a reputation for refusing to fill tanks unless they tested them (if you need a fill they force you to have it vis tested even if it has just been done) and also issues with servicing.

If I need something that is out of the ordinary I will phone the shop 100 miles away or look online. Had good success with both (tweaking of the BP&W set up was helped by the owner of the shop 100 miles away despite not buying it there - he helped with advice for what I should have been sold).

If my experience is anything to go by there are a few things that improve shops chances long term:
1) Treat every customer as if they are your first and last - be honest, don't oversell.
2) Be willing to invest time in customers - it will pay dividends long term. I would rather travel to purchase from one shop that go local.
3) Have a good online presence - facebook, instagram, twitter etc and a good online shop. Respond quickly to emails.
4) Add services - the best shop above have a pool that customers can use (for a fee) for trying/testing gear. They also service and repair regs,drysuits, wetsuits etc.
5) Don't stress the minor items - a couple of times I have been in the better shops and small things like 1st stage plugs have been thrown in with other items instead of being charged for as some other shops do. Costs the shop nearly nothing but gains goodwill from customers.
6) Try to match online prices or be flexible on prices (if possible) - if not people will just go online anyway. Better to make a sale and get a smaller % profit than no profit at all.

 

[dmaziuk]

If there were 30k of you and you had been running your training for sixty years would that help?

I get the feeling that it shouldn't be too hard for "just a bunch friends sharing costs" to open a local chapter of an existing country-wide diving club network. As far as I know there is no country-wide diving club infrastructure in the US, so over here a move to "BSAC-type club structure" would require building one. Having 30K interested divers for 60 years would probably help with that. But by the same token LDSes could unionize into a country-wide network too.

 

[Bob DBF]

Having worked and managed a retail store that involved both sales and service, I saw that customers would spend a reasonable amount more than online IF they thought the local business was more helpful and perceived as proffessional help in solving their problems. The store closed because the business owning it was bought out, and the new company did not do retail stores regardless of how profitable they were. But that is another story.

A lot of dive shops have not figured it out, perhaps the scuba MSRP model and need to maximize profit on each sale because of low volume skewed their thinking, or the owners are just d**ks trying to be a big fish in a draining pond.

A few years back I wanted a 19cuft pony bottle, already had the valve and so on. Go to the LDS and ask them how much for them to get it for me. Their deal was for me to pay up front, no problem, wait two to four weeks depending on when they made the next order with their supplier, and pay $200 for the special order. Needless to say, I declined. I ordered it online, had it in a few days, and paid under $90 including the cheapest shipping. I wouldn't have minded paying more for the connivence but everyone has their limit.



Bob

 

[ljpm]

Dan Humble of Dive Tech in Mallorytown, Ontario should run classes for owners on how to do business. Only Dive Tech, Abucs Scuba in Brockville, ON; Cave Country Dive Shop in High Springs, FL; Amigos Dive Center in Ft. White, FL and Cave Adventurers in Marianna, FL have been 100% feel good experiences. Your mileage may vary.

I'm going to have to check out Dive Tech and Abucs. I've heard good things about these shops from others as well. I also hear Abucs has a new shop in Kingston as well.

 

[Steve_C]

I realize that scuba regulators are not the most difficult piece of equipment to service, but they are not fool proof. Saw a DM have to do a cesa from 80 ft. Had lent one reg to a customer and was diving with one reg. At the anchor it just shut down. Zero air. Turned out that he had serviced the reg himself and had put one part in upside down. It locked up at 60 ft.
One of my LDS has AirTech in the same building. I just have the equipment serviced by folks who know what they are doing and have a huge array of stocked parts.

 

[Kharon]

I love this contribution. Especially after reading 6,344,297 scuba board posts to new divers saying they should buy expensive stuff to start since they may decide later to take up tech diving.

I would argue that this is typical of many new divers or older confirmed non tech divers like myself.

While I COMPLETELY understand the "Don't buy it twice" mentality (keeping salt water aquariums for any length of time will teach you that) I'd prefer to have the OPTION of purchasing a "cheaper" model to start with. Every store I go in says "this is what you need" without actually listening to my wants, desires, diving style, frequency, etc.

You don't get it. The cheap stuff doesn't have to be upgraded. It's just as good.

First, +1 @Steve_C. I see SB posts urging high end purchases far more than ones urging reasonably priced equipment. Often they say the low(er) end gear is junk. Bushwah.

Second, +1 @Scuba-Blue-13. I have a habit of researching what I want to buy intensively. Not just scuba gear but everything. Most often, when I ask my LDS if thay carry or can get a specific brand and model they try to direct me to something they prefer or sell. Guess what - I want what I want - not an argument. They also often try to get me to switch from the way I'm diving to something that costs a lot - at least initially. For example, you really need to learn to dive in a drysuit, you really need to get into sidemount.

Guess what? Single backmount and layering insulation is fine for me. I'm 71, the local diving is pretty poor, and I'm not in the habit of fixing what ain't broke.

Finally, +1 @2airishuman

Before I started OW I researched equipment that I wanted to train with. They included BC, reg set, and computer. I did a thorough job and came up with low end equipment to start with. During my first class the owner of the LDS told me I should have talked to him because he would have recommended different equipment, primarily the BC which was a jacket style. He would have recommended a back inflate. He could have also directed me to a "quality" reg set and a better computer.

Years later, I still prefer the jacket BC - hate back inflate BC's (though for trips I now use a soft backpack and harness sans wing because it packs better), I'm still exclusively using original reg set (though I switched the 2nd stage primary for a Hollis 500SE solely for the side exhaust), and I would probably still be using the Oceanic Veo 100 if not for my declining eyesight - I got a Mares Icon for the huge display).

I love the Cressi AC2 1st stage. It's rugged, dependable, bullet-proof, and so easy to service. I've had it to 130' and in 42°F water (108') and it performed flawlessly when my buddies high end balanced diaphragm free flowed causing an aborted dive. I've never had occasion to wish I had "better" gear.

In short, there may be a difference between the low end gear and the top of the line - there probably is. It's not a difference I can notice, nor one that I believe is worth the price differential, and certainly not a difference I or every new diver needs. You don't need it till you do. There's time enough to decide to upgrade IF you decide you need to. Starting with top of the line, bleeding edge equipment is vast overkill for most beginning divers