Check dives, private DMs, and local/shop policies

[ggunn]

Why not do what most places (not necessarily on Coz) do: a quick pool check out before you are allowed on a boat? Several times I have had to go in a pool, get neutral retrieve my reg, remove my mask.......then I am free to dive to my certification level. And I am not charged for the pool dive either. I too disagree with the logic of charging for a check-out dive when such a simple free solution exists.

A couple of things. Most DMs on Cozumel are very busy diving more than two tanks a day and would be losing significant income doing what you suggest, but beyond that, how you do in a pool and how you dive a reef are very different. Just because you can clear your mask and keep from crashing into the bottom of the pool doesn't mean you are ready for Barracuda.

 

[ggunn]

Absolutely untrue. I am OK doing anything you want in a pool. But if I think I am going to be taken to a chitty location for a simple check out dive.....
For me, if you make it sound like I am paying to do another basic OW checkout dive over a sandbar, then I would not be happy. Make it AND describe it as an actual dive and talk it up as the first dive of the day, then I am happy. With many people, it is all about presentation.

There are no "chitty" dive sites at Cozumel, and the fact that the "checkout dive" is in actuality a real dive at a great, albeit less challenging, site is what Christi and Dave have been trying to tell you (the collective "you"). Nobody is going to take you on a sand dive.

 

[redacted]

There are no "chitty" dive sites at Cozumel, and the fact that the "checkout dive" is in actuality a real dive at a great, albeit less challenging, site is what Christi and Dave have been trying to tell you (the collective "you"). Nobody is going to take you on a sand dive.

But there are a few "chitty" pools.

 

[ggunn]

I have no issue with a Mexican making money, I have an issue with an utter disregard for experience, log book and certifications and an inflexible policy. I won't be diving with that Aldora.... with that policy of arrogant disregard.... I am very appreciateive of the owner explaining his policy in clear and understandable terms.. Pay for another DM to babysit you or they dictate where you dive... Is that like "professional courtesy" LOL

Dive with whomever you want, but it's likely you will find the same practice in place no matter whom you dive with on Cozumel. They might not tell you what they are doing or be completely forthright with you about why you are going to Palancar today, Maracaibo tomorrow, maybe, but they are doing it just the same. Make no mistake, on Cozumel, the DM always dictates where you dive and you are always escorted, no matter what your experience level. Have you ever been there?

 

[ScubaSteve]

A couple of things. Most DMs on Cozumel are very busy diving more than two tanks a day and would be losing significant income doing what you suggest, but beyond that, how you do in a pool and how you dive a reef are very different. Just because you can clear your mask and keep from crashing into the bottom of the pool doesn't mean you are ready for Barracuda.

WTF are you on about? How do you translate a quick pool session for a group before an AM departure into an entire day lost? You obviously have given nothing any thought. I have done this multiple times and it is always, everybody gets in the pool 30 minutes before the boat leaves, quick demonstration and you are good to go. I for one was also NOT advocating going from a pool session to the most difficult dive on the island. Now Christi's point of pool availability......that could be a legitimate issue. And as for "not a single chitty dive sites".....I dive at home and see green rocks that are more exciting than the 30 minutes I spent in the shallows over sand apparently looking for a sea horse back in '08. I think Coz is great for many people but anybody that makes a claim like no bad sites for anywhere in the world is full of it or has a vested interest in lying to people.

And since you chose not to read my posts......if you make it a full dive as Christi said and it is described that way then all is great. Even the most technical diver is likely to be Ok with a dive that is not the island pinnacle dive if approached in a reasonable manner and explained properly. If you tell many people that you are paying dearly for a check-out dive to prove you are not unsafe then expect hell in return. It is all in the delivery.

 

[Mike]

WTF are you on about? How do you translate a quick pool session for a group before an AM departure into an entire day lost? You obviously have given nothing any thought. I have done this multiple times and it is always, everybody gets in the pool 30 minutes before the boat leaves, quick demonstration and you are good to go. I for one was also NOT advocating going from a pool session to the most difficult dive on the island. Now Christi's point of pool availability......that could be a legitimate issue. And as for "not a single chitty dive sites".....I dive at home and see green rocks that are more exciting than the 30 minutes I spent in the shallows over sand apparently looking for a sea horse back in '08. I think Coz is great for many people but anybody that makes a claim like no bad sites for anywhere in the world is full of it or has a vested interest in lying to people.

And since you chose not to read my posts......if you make it a full dive as Christi said and it is described that way then all is great. Even the most technical diver is likely to be Ok with a dive that is not the island pinnacle dive if approached in a reasonable manner and explained properly. If you tell many people that you are paying dearly for a check-out dive to prove you are not unsafe then expect hell in return. It is all in the delivery.

Thankfully reality bares no resemblance to your descriptions. You might have been at Kozumel.

I fully guarantee you that a large portion of first time divers with Aldora have zero clue that anything different is going on at all on their first dive day, because you're right it's all in the delivery and you're personally creating a mountain out of a mole hill, a full blown code 10 red alert out of nothing.

Aldora's not for you, we get it. Dave's not hurting for business believe me. The rest of us lemmings love the cool aid he serves us.

 

[ggunn]

WTF are you on about? How do you translate a quick pool session for a group before an AM departure into an entire day lost? You obviously have given nothing any thought. I have done this multiple times and it is always, everybody gets in the pool 30 minutes before the boat leaves, quick demonstration and you are good to go. I for one was also NOT advocating going from a pool session to the most difficult dive on the island. Now Christi's point of pool availability......that could be a legitimate issue. And as for "not a single chitty dive sites".....I dive at home and see green rocks that are more exciting than the 30 minutes I spent in the shallows over sand apparently looking for a sea horse back in '08. I think Coz is great for many people but anybody that makes a claim like no bad sites for anywhere in the world is full of it or has a vested interest in lying to people.

And since you chose not to read my posts......if you make it a full dive as Christi said and it is described that way then all is great. Even the most technical diver is likely to be Ok with a dive that is not the island pinnacle dive if approached in a reasonable manner and explained properly. If you tell many people that you are paying dearly for a check-out dive to prove you are not unsafe then expect hell in return. It is all in the delivery.

The worst dive I ever did in Cozumel was far superior to any site I can find here in Lake Travis, and lots of people dive it. I have been diving Cozumel for nearly 20 years and every dive, no exaggeration, has been great. Well, there was that dive at Maracaibo where 90% of the underwater time was getting down to the reef and doing deco on the way up; that one wasn't that great, but some folks love that dive. I have no vested interest in touting Cozumel; I truly love it for its own sake, and that's in the eye of the beholder. You may disagree. You may consider me "full of it"; you are free to think whatever you want.

I would far rather dive Paradise and be "evaluated" that spend time putzing around in a pool, and Dave and Christi have both been very clear that their evaluations are done on real dives. Pools are not that readily available for such things, anyway; many Cozumel hotels have fresh water trucked in and do not want dive gear in their pools. Beyond that, this is the way it's done, and when in Rome...

 

[Laurie S.]

I can verify that Blue XTSea does not evaluate divers on "chitty" dive sites. My first dive at Cozumel was with them in 2011 and the first dive was at Santa Rosa Wall. It was fabulous!

 

[peterbj7]

I have "evaluated" countless divers over the years, but I don't do it in the blunt and inflexible way that is being suggested here. Obviously I listen to the diver, look at the available records, and form my own initial opinion. Then I invite him/her to go on one of our regular local reef dives. I watch them setting up, and believe me you can tell a great deal about a diver's competence in just a few moments. Then I go out on the boat with them, watch their behaviour on the boat, and enter the water with them. I then watch how they conduct themselves in the early part of the dive - I'm accompanying the group but not leading it. At no point do I normally tell them they are "under scrutiny", and nor do I restrict what they may do on such dives. I don't allow them to do any extreme dives such as the Blue Hole until I'm happy with their diving, but that's all.

I have been on the receiving end of courteous almost transparent vetting and the far more active control apparently described here. My record was when on a dive in Egypt with a highly qualified and experienced friend, when we were required to do a special "check out" dive we had to rescue our assessor - he hadn't bothered to check he had enough air and he didn't. I find the active, arbitrary and rather officious vetting referred to here quite off-putting. And I know many other experienced divers feel the same, which is why I have never done it in my own operation. As they say, there's more than one way of skinning a cat.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

I have "evaluated" countless divers over the years, but I don't do it in the blunt and inflexible way that is being suggested here. Obviously I listen to the diver, look at the available records, and form my own initial opinion. Then I invite him/her to go on one of our regular local reef dives. I watch them setting up, and believe me you can tell a great deal about a diver's competence in just a few moments. Then I go out on the boat with them, watch their behaviour on the boat, and enter the water with them. I then watch how they conduct themselves in the early part of the dive - I'm accompanying the group but not leading it. At no point do I normally tell them they are "under scrutiny", and nor do I restrict what they may do on such dives. I don't allow them to do any extreme dives such as the Blue Hole until I'm happy with their diving, but that's all.

I have been on the receiving end of courteous almost transparent vetting and the far more active control apparently described here. My record was when on a dive in Egypt with a highly qualified and experienced friend, when we were required to do a special "check out" dive we had to rescue our assessor - he hadn't bothered to check he had enough air and he didn't. I find the active, arbitrary and rather officious vetting referred to here quite off-putting. And I know many other experienced divers feel the same, which is why I have never done it in my own operation. As they say, there's more than one way of skinning a cat.

Why don't you just make them pay for their personal DM and take them where they want?